CFP Discussion

[forensicbuzz]

Glad I missed it. Watched "Welcome to Wrexham" to watch real futbol. I really like the leagues where teams are promoted and relegated based on performance every year. I think performance based is better than advertising $ based.

There was a game on?

 

[DeepSnap]

Washington's right tackle, number 73, committed two crucial penalties when the Huskies still had a chance. The first wiped out a long pass completion and the second was on a fourth-down play that would have resulted in a first down on a PI penalty against Michigan had it not occurred. Those two penalties were killers, but of course were committed because the right tackle got beat by Michigan's DL.

As #73's problems rolled along, it almost appeared the officials just got tired of calling Procedure penalties on him...... he was starting his "outside leg kick back" for pass pro a half-count before the ball was snapped. The holding penalties - only one was a 50/50 call - were waaaay too obvious to be ignored.

As for the beating Penix took, many of those hits would have been NFL penalties the way the NFL plays two-hand-touch football for their QBs.

THWg!

 

[stinger78]

I don't have a problem with this logic, but that's not the argument that was put forward. You pointed out the losses, but what about good wins? I haven't looked at their schedules, so I don't have an opinion. Hard to knock a 10-win team though, regardless of who the losses were to. No, I don't think Louisville was that good, but they were as good as LSU in my opinion. SEC wasn't that great this year. Their best OOC win was Kentucky over Louisville. (unless you count bowls, which I can't really wrap my head around whether they mean anything or not).

If we would have had a 12-team playoff this year, who would have been in the playoff? Would that have been based on performance on the field or a popularity contest? I don't know.

Yea, you do. A popularity contest based on biggest draw.

 

[forensicbuzz]

2023 G5 Conference Champions:

American Athletic Conference: SMU – lost to P5 teams – Oklahoma (28-11), TCU (34-17) and BC (23-14) bowl game. No P5 wins

CUSA: Liberty – no regular season games against P5 teams lost to Oregon their Bowl Game 45-6

MAC: Miami of Ohio – lost to Miami (38-3), lost to Cincy (31-24) – no P5 wins

Mountain West: Lost to Washington (56-19), lost to UCF (18-16), UCLA (35-22) Bowl Game

Sun Belt: JMU – they beat UVA (36-35)

Summary: G5 Conference Champions were 1-9 against P5 teams. Yea lets put these losers in the CFP! Back to your Lost Causes - at least come up with some reason this makes sense than you personally think's it's fair!

I have to say, with the expansion lately, most of the best G5 teams have been gobbled up by the B12. There may be a number of AAC teams that are still decent, but then there is a definite drop-off in talent from there. Wasn't App St a FCS team when they knocked off Michigan? (I know they're FBS now)

With so many teams making the conversion from FCS to FBS, maybe it's time to split the P4 and G5 into two subcategories.

 

[CEB]

Oh geez! Was it an ACC crew? How embarrassing. Please tell me it wasn’t Jeff Flanagan.

I didn’t recognize or hear any individual names but it was mentioned several times that it was an ACC crew.

 

[RonJohn]

With so many teams making the conversion from FCS to FBS, maybe it's time to split the P4 and G5 into two subcategories.

Funny that the NCAA president was talking about such a thing recently.

 

[forensicbuzz]

Funny that the NCAA president was talking about such a thing recently.

kind of. He was talking about a no-holds-barred level and a more traditional level. Not exactly the same thing.

 

[Oldgoldandwhite]

However they do it, everyone deserves a shot. They can play themselves in or out. Up to them.

 

[Northeast Stinger]

However they do it, everyone deserves a shot. They can play themselves in or out. Up to them.

Consensus is building for a playoff that is fair and transparent. How or what or whether that will be is unknown but the way the system has played out the last few years has been a horror show unless you are uga, Alabama, Michigan and a few others. And lately uga isn’t even all that happy with it.

Now, I’m not naive, I know that with a 12 team playoff, as long as every SEC that thinks they are deserving gets in, we will have a harder time holding the consensus together.

 

[Root4GT]

I don't have a problem with this logic, but that's not the argument that was put forward. You pointed out the losses, but what about good wins? I haven't looked at their schedules, so I don't have an opinion. Hard to knock a 10-win team though, regardless of who the losses were to. No, I don't think Louisville was that good, but they were as good as LSU in my opinion. SEC wasn't that great this year. Their best OOC win was Kentucky over Louisville. (unless you count bowls, which I can't really wrap my head around whether they mean anything or not).

If we would have had a 12-team playoff this year, who would have been in the playoff? Would that have been based on performance on the field or a popularity contest? I don't know.

As I pointed out of the 5 G5 champs there was only ONE win against a P5 team, JMU over UVA. As I said the 5 G5 Champs played 10 games against P5 teams and lost 9 of them. It’s the G5 Champs that are in consideration for the 22 team CFP. Their case based on the 2023 season is very weak at best.

As for LSU and Louisville neither were in the final CFP ranking top 12 so neither would have been in. At the time of the CFP selection teams 9-12 were all 10-2. In order from 9-12. Missouri, Penn State, Ole Miss and Okalahoma.

Nothing really terrible about those 4 teams.

 

[RonJohn]

kind of. He was talking about a no-holds-barred level and a more traditional level. Not exactly the same thing.

It would have the same effect. Some teams would be unhappy about where they land, but it would split FBS into two divisions. 65-70 team divisions would be much easier to set up an actual championship playoff without automatically excluding 80 percent of teams.

 

[orientalnc]

It would have the same effect. Some teams would be unhappy about where they land, but it would split FBS into two divisions. 65-70 team divisions would be much easier to set up an actual championship playoff without automatically excluding 80 percent of teams.

We could be like the NBA where almost everyone is in the playoffs and we have the championship Easter weekend.

If there was a fair and somewhat objective way to select the teams, I think four teams is fine. Maybe eight. If you are ranked #16 and there is any credibility to the ratings, you are not winning the championship. A game? Sure. But four straight games against the best teams? Not going to happen.

 

[CEB]

As for LSU and Louisville neither were in the final CFP ranking top 12 so neither would have been in. At the time of the CFP selection teams 9-12 were all 10-2. In order from 9-12. Missouri, Penn State, Ole Miss and Okalahoma.

Nothing really terrible about those 4 teams.

Except the order… using the “best win” criteria that the committee used for “other things”

*** cough Texas Bama cough hack***

Oklahoma should be 9, right? Wonder why they were ranked behind 2 SEC teams and a BIG team when their win over Texas was CLEARLY the best win of all…. Hmmm. That’s a puzzler.

Surely you can see the bias that will be employed in selecting the 7 at-large teams for the 12 team playoff…. If not, tell me why this year’s Oklahoma sits at home while Ole Miss or Mizzou gets another chance to lose to Bama and UGA.

I’m just not accepting this notion of “if you don’t like it, just win more.” It would take a decade of thorough a**whippins to even get the propaganda machine to start to pay attention.

I, for one, think the 12 team selection is going to make the bias even more pronounced if there isn’t some consideration for spreading the wealth. Im not going as far as selecting all G5 conference champs for the playoff, but I do think that any second team in the top 15 or so should get a spot before we go 3 or 4 deep on the SEC also rans. First time we see an undefeated ACC or Big 12 champ get upset in the conference championship, you’ll know why.

 

[TampaBuzz]

I didn’t recognize or hear any individual names but it was mentioned several times that it was an ACC crew.

The head ref introduced himself and said from ACC during the coin flip...but I wasn't paying attention to his name.

 

[forensicbuzz]

It would have the same effect. Some teams would be unhappy about where they land, but it would split FBS into two divisions. 65-70 team divisions would be much easier to set up an actual championship playoff without automatically excluding 80 percent of teams.

I think with that split, the number would be closer to 40-50 teams without restrictions.

 

[Richard7125]

I have to say, with the expansion lately, most of the best G5 teams have been gobbled up by the B12. There may be a number of AAC teams that are still decent, but then there is a definite drop-off in talent from there. Wasn't App St a FCS team when they knocked off Michigan? (I know they're FBS now)

With so many teams making the conversion from FCS to FBS, maybe it's time to split the P4 and G5 into two subcategories.

Well, doesn't the fact that one is called P4 and the other called G5 already indicate there are two subcategories?

 

[Northeast Stinger]

We could be like the NBA where almost everyone is in the playoffs and we have the championship Easter weekend.

If there was a fair and somewhat objective way to select the teams, I think four teams is fine. Maybe eight. If you are ranked #16 and there is any credibility to the ratings, you are not winning the championship. A game? Sure. But four straight games against the best teams? Not going to happen.

When the playoff was first proposed, the system that was proposed, and favored by many, was a six team playoff. The rules were straight forward. 4 conference champions are in with 2 highest ranked champions getting a bye. 2 highest ranked at large teams have a play-in game against the two lower ranked conference champions. And you can figure it from there.

It was the system I most favored. I wish we had tried that from the beginning. But obviously it is too late for that now. Things have become so political (in the worst sense of the word, not in the usual sense that all human interactions are political) that it will be hard to create a system that feels fair to everyone and which doesn’t cement the status quo while contributing to football dying a slow death.

 

[Root4GT]

Except the order… using the “best win” criteria that the committee used for “other things”

*** cough Texas Bama cough hack***

Oklahoma should be 9, right? Wonder why they were ranked behind 2 SEC teams and a BIG team when their win over Texas was CLEARLY the best win of all…. Hmmm. That’s a puzzler.

Surely you can see the bias that will be employed in selecting the 7 at-large teams for the 12 team playoff…. If not, tell me why this year’s Oklahoma sits at home while Ole Miss or Mizzou gets another chance to lose to Bama and UGA.

I’m just not accepting this notion of “if you don’t like it, just win more.” It would take a decade of thorough a**whippins to even get the propaganda machine to start to pay attention.

I, for one, think the 12 team selection is going to make the bias even more pronounced if there isn’t some consideration for spreading the wealth. Im not going as far as selecting all G5 conference champs for the playoff, but I do think that any second team in the top 15 or so should get a spot before we go 3 or 4 deep on the SEC also rans. First time we see an undefeated ACC or Big 12 champ get upset in the conference championship, you’ll know why.

So the question becomes is a G5 team getting an auto bid? If so OU would miss out as they are #12. If no auto bid G5 bid OU is in.

You could make the case in any order you want for the teams I listed as9-12. One would be mad. So what, you were not a Conference Champ and if you were not than you are at the mercy of some system to select the rest of the field. There is no perfect system be it computers, humans or a combination of both.

Do you think there would be a National controversy over team #12 as there was over FSU this year? I sure don’t see pick #12 stirring up much except for the fan bases of teams 13-15 or so.

 

[Northeast Stinger]

So the question becomes is a G5 team getting an auto bid? If so OU would miss out as they are #12. If no auto bid G5 bid OU is in.

You could make the case in any order you want for the teams I listed as9-12. One would be mad. So what, you were not a Conference Champ and if you were not than you are at the mercy of some system to select the rest of the field. There is no perfect system be it computers, humans or a combination of both.

Do you think there would be a National controversy over team #12 as there was over FSU this year? I sure don’t see pick #12 stirring up much except for the fan bases of teams 13-15 or so.

Yep. In a 12 team playoff the chance of controversy are greatly reduced. If a 8-4 Mississippi State got in ahead of a 9-3 Ga Tech for the 12th spot the only people who would care would be Tech fans, and half of them would say we suck anyway.

 

[stinger78]

Just need two 8-team playoffs, one for P4/5 and one for G5. All conf champs plus 3 at-large. Done.

More games to sell, which should please sEcSPN and more inclusion, which should please the G5. Less controversy, which should please all of us.