Brand New Transfer Season NIL talk

[cpf2001]

Huh? SMU cheating and getting the death penalty four decades ago is an example of thee market forces in college sports?

Again, I have no clue what point you are trying to make, but it seems irrelevant to the discussion, so who cares.

You think UGA was aboveboard and clean with Herschel and others? Funny how SMU got cracked down on so hard and no blue bloods did.

I’ll try to simplify it: let’s establish that there is a market. Schools have been dirty in recruitment and retention of players for decades. That’s a black market which indicates that the true market rate for a top CFB player would be higher than just a scholarship. Do you want citations or is this common knowledge?

Moving on from there, the NCAA powers that be have known about it but they have colluded to try to minimize it by making it against the rules - but they enforce those rules arbitrarily and capriciously and mostly against outsiders or newcomers instead of their top-tier programs. And that is evidence that the claims of amateurism are a sham. That’s the relevance of SMU vs UGA.

 

[stinger78]

You think UGA was aboveboard and clean with Herschel and others? Funny how SMU got cracked down on so hard and no blue bloods did.

I’ll try to simplify it: let’s establish that there is a market. Schools have been dirty in recruitment and retention of players for decades. That’s a black market which indicates that the true market rate for a top CFB player would be higher than just a scholarship. Do you want citations or is this common knowledge?

Moving on from there, the NCAA powers that be have known about it but they have colluded to try to minimize it by making it against the rules - but they enforce those rules arbitrarily and capriciously and mostly against outsiders or newcomers instead of their top-tier programs. And that is evidence that the claims of amateurism are a sham. That’s the relevance of SMU vs UGA.

If you’re paid in college for working part time at a clothing store are you a professional salesman?

 

[leatherneckjacket]

Not going to argue with you at length but if you took out every professional caliber player you would have the equivilant of womens college basketball vs mens college basketball

Or you would have Ivy League foitball where they average 16K fans and no significant TV contract.

Players matter. College names matter. The combination of both is what makes a billion dollar industry

No, you wouldn't. That is absurd. There are numerous men's college basketball teams without a professional calibre player on them and all of them are significantly better than the best women's basketball team.

But let's say you are correct. It still would not matter because the fans would pay just as much money for tickets and watch as many games . They cheer the name on the front, not the name on the back.

 

[leatherneckjacket]

You think UGA was aboveboard and clean with Herschel and others? Funny how SMU got cracked down on so hard and no blue bloods did.

I’ll try to simplify it: let’s establish that there is a market. Schools have been dirty in recruitment and retention of players for decades. That’s a black market which indicates that the true market rate for a top CFB player would be higher than just a scholarship. Do you want citations or is this common knowledge?

Moving on from there, the NCAA powers that be have known about it but they have colluded to try to minimize it by making it against the rules - but they enforce those rules arbitrarily and capriciously and mostly against outsiders or newcomers instead of their top-tier programs. And that is evidence that the claims of amateurism are a sham. That’s the relevance of SMU vs UGA.

I think whatever you are trying to get at has nothing to do with you being wrong about compensation.

I will add your understanding of what constitutes market forces in a free market economy is wildly inaccurate.

 

[Root4GT]

No, you wouldn't. That is absurd. There are numerous men's college basketball teams without a professional calibre player on them and all of them are significantly better than the best women's basketball team.

But let's say you are correct. It still would not matter because the fans would pay just as much money for tickets and watch as many games . They cheer the name on the front, not the name on the back.

Yup, Yale and Harvard draw great crowds. Fans want both, school and Players. Look at GT’s attendance. Bad coach and bad players and attendance dropped 40%. Play glorified HS football and GT draws 15K per game.

GT adds some NFL caliber studs in the next couple of years with goid coaching we get back a lot of the 40% who gave up.

School do matter. Players do matter.

 

[leatherneckjacket]

Yup, Yale and Harvard draw great crowds. Fans want both, school and Players. Look at GT’s attendance. Bad coach and bad players and attendance dropped 40%. Play glorified HS football and GT draws 15K per game.

GT adds some NFL caliber studs in the next couple of years with goid coaching we get back a lot of the 40% who gave up.

School do matter. Players do matter.

Yale and Harvard do not draw great crowds because they are Yale and Harvard. Thanks for proving my point.

Also, fans want winning. They do not care what players get them the wins. If you take away the professional caliber players, the blue bloods will still recruit the best non professional players available, they will continue to win more games, draw the largest crowds, and generate the most revenue. Talent only matters relative to your competition.

 

[Root4GT]

Yale and Harvard do not draw great crowds because they are Yale and Harvard. Thanks for proving my point.

At one time they were the best college football teams. They chose not to have NFL caliber players and no one gives a darn about them now. That would happen to college football if all NFL caliber players didn’t play college football.

Of course this won’t happen and colleges will do everything in their power to get the very best players and pay them via collectives.

This is the way of college football now. Trying to “un pay” college athletes is dead.

 

[leatherneckjacket]

At one time they were the best college football teams. They chose not to have NFL caliber players and no one gives a darn about them now. That would happen to college football if all NFL caliber players didn’t play college football.

Of course this won’t happen and colleges will do everything in their power to get the very best players and pay them via collectives.

This is the way of college football now. Trying to “un pay” college athletes is dead.

Fans will continue to watch college football and basketball regardless if the best athletes play or not. When basketball allowed Freshman to enter the NBA draft, it had no impact on viewership or revenues. So, there is clear evidence you are wrong.

Also, when Yale and Harvard were the best, there were no TV deals. In fact, there were no tvs.

 

[roadkill]

At one time they were the best college football teams. They chose not to have NFL caliber players compete with the big state schoools and no one gives a darn about them now. That would happen to college football if all NFL caliber players didn’t play college football.

Of course this won’t happen and colleges will do everything in their power to get the very best players and pay them via collectives.

This is the way of college football now. Trying to “un pay” college athletes is dead.

Fixed.
Have to agree with @leatherneckjacket on this issue.

 

[inknerd]

The schools generate the billions, not the players. You could take every professional caliber player out of college sports and it would have zero impact on revenues.

What is this based on? Does the WNBA generate as much as the NBA? Did the XFL generate as much revenue as the NFL? A sports team is a product, and in every industry, everywhere in the world, consumers care about quality.

 

[stinger78]

What is this based on? Does the WNBA generate as much as the NBA? Did the XFL generate as much revenue as the NFL? A sports team is a product, and in every industry, everywhere in the world, consumers care about quality.

Quality is relative. I buy Toyota’s. Great quality, not the world’s most stylish or equipped cars. I want a quality product but at a reasonable price.

 

[deeznats]

What is this based on? Does the WNBA generate as much as the NBA? Did the XFL generate as much revenue as the NFL? A sports team is a product, and in every industry, everywhere in the world, consumers care about quality.

XFL and other pro leagues are 2nd tier to the NFL but still better quality players on the whole than college, yet college is more popular. It's not because of the players, it's because of the colleges.

If/when college football goes to a 2 conference league, I bet it will die a slow death. There's no reason for people to watch a college game when the NFL exists unless they have some reason to care about the teams playing. In the fight for current money, they're reducing the overall future pie.

 

[stinger78]

People will follow college football like they do baseball and other sports. It will be smaller, like it used to be. There won’t be the money to pay for huge stadiums and salaries .

 

[cpf2001]

XFL and other pro leagues are 2nd tier to the NFL but still better quality players on the whole than college, yet college is more popular. It's not because of the players, it's because of the colleges.

If/when college football goes to a 2 conference league, I bet it will die a slow death. There's no reason for people to watch a college game when the NFL exists unless they have some reason to care about the teams playing. In the fight for current money, they're reducing the overall future pie.

If the top ten percent of college players went straight to the USFL or and college football was truly amateur how long do you think the relative popularity would last? Ten years, twenty, thirty? Every time a college school or conference has opted out of chasing the most talented players they have gradually faded from relevance.

IMO the most likely outcome would be the NFL also changing their draft rules to pick players out of high school or the development league earlier, more like the NBA, to avoid any threat of a commercial entity they didn’t control getting a pipeline of young talent established. Which would turn CFB into college baseball slowly but surely (NCAA hoops is also not what it once was, after all).

 

[Oldgoldandwhite]

The SEC would pay more than the minor leagues.

 

[stinger78]

There’s the core issue, IMPO. The minute you introduce academics you have a huge variance across schools. The idiots who should go to the D league as pros, for minimal pay, will go to those “colleges” for more pay. It only works for MLB due to their antitrust exemption.

 

[leatherneckjacket]

What is this based on? Does the WNBA generate as much as the NBA? Did the XFL generate as much revenue as the NFL? A sports team is a product, and in every industry, everywhere in the world, consumers care about quality.

Comparing the WNBA to the NBA is idiotic.

Does the XFL or CFL generate as much revenue as the college football?

Does the NBA D league generate as much revenue as college basketball.

The product is the schools and all fans care about is beating other schools. Not if the players are as good as the players in the pros. Otherwise, everyone would just watch the professional leagues, which they do not.

 

[leatherneckjacket]

If the top ten percent of college players went straight to the USFL or and college football was truly amateur how long do you think the relative popularity would last? Ten years, twenty, thirty? Every time a college school or conference has opted out of chasing the most talented players they have gradually faded from relevance.

IMO the most likely outcome would be the NFL also changing their draft rules to pick players out of high school or the development league earlier, more like the NBA, to avoid any threat of a commercial entity they didn’t control getting a pipeline of young talent established. Which would turn CFB into college baseball slowly but surely (NCAA hoops is also not what it once was, after all).

You would be wrong. The top basketball players used to go straight to the NBA and it had no impact on viewership or attendance. The fans support their teams. The players are replaceable. In fact, they get replaced regularly without impact to the revenues.

 

[JacketOff]

If the top ten percent of college players went straight to the USFL or and college football was truly amateur how long do you think the relative popularity would last? Ten years, twenty, thirty? Every time a college school or conference has opted out of chasing the most talented players they have gradually faded from relevance.

Mostly because they stopped winning games. The vast majority of college baseball players will never see a pitch in the pros, much less in the big leagues. The biggest SEC, Big 12, and sometimes ACC schools outdraw the vast majority of minor league teams. If those minor league teams were playing the colleges it would be a slaughter. Yet the college games and teams are more widely popular because the schools are what’s drawing the fans, not the players.

 

[leatherneckjacket]

Mostly because they stopped winning games. The vast majority of college baseball players will never see a pitch in the pros, much less in the big leagues. The biggest SEC, Big 12, and sometimes ACC schools outdraw the vast majority of minor league teams. If those minor league teams were playing the colleges it would be a slaughter. Yet the college games and teams are more widely popular because the schools are what’s drawing the fans, not the players.

This. Fans will watch the teams that win regardless if the best players attend college or not.