ACC Discussion 2020

TheJuiceIsLoose

Georgia Tech Fan
Messages
71
Dabo is basically a product of being super religious and starting right about the same time Clemson started committing themselves to raising money from boosters to pay players. The former creates a “family atmosphere” and resonates with kids from the SE which is obviously a region that is pretty religious. their 5* frosh QB from Cali said the religious atmosphere is what drew him to Clemson.

But that only works because of the latter. Had Dabo taken over at NCSU instead of Clemson does anybody actually think he’d have had any success at all? He’d probably be back to being a coordinator by now (I guess he never was one actually).

He’s a hell of a “CEO” for a program with elite coordinators and bagmen with some of the deepest pockets in the country. But unless I’m another factory with pockets as deep as Clemson’s, I’d take either of the coordinators over him to be my head coach in a heartbeat.
Does ND pay their players also?

My guess is that 100% of ND's 85 man scholly roster could graduate from GT had they chosen to come here

Dabo is successful because he understands that at the Pwr5 Level 80% of your success comes from Recruiting elite Talent to start with

Elite Talent with same coaching & development wins 99% of the time vs lesser Talent given the same variables, there are no special genius playcalls that will make a huge difference

Belichick with a crappy QB is a crappy HC, Belichick with Brady is an all time HoF HC

Dabo & his Bama MBA is lot smarter than many GT Fans give him credit for, he understands marketing as it applies to Pwr5 FB, he understands Consumer Behavior as it applies to Recruiting, he understands Industrial Psychology as it applies to developing a Staff

Dabo would do wonders & miracles at a place like GT

GT's Fanbase needs to let their thinking about Recruiting evolve beyond "well gee shucks, they all come highly recommended", that mindset is just another example of the residual Toxins that the previous Guy left in the well for our Fanbase to drink from

At what point do we decide to run with the big canines, instead of complaining that everyone else is cheating?
 

gtrower

Helluva Engineer
Messages
1,693
Does ND pay their players also?

My guess is that 100% of ND's 85 man scholly roster could graduate from GT had they chosen to come here

Dabo is successful because he understands that at the Pwr5 Level 80% of your success comes from Recruiting elite Talent to start with

Elite Talent with same coaching & development wins 99% of the time vs lesser Talent given the same variables, there are no special genius playcalls that will make a huge difference

Belichick with a crappy QB is a crappy HC, Belichick with Brady is an all time HoF HC

Dabo & his Bama MBA is lot smarter than many GT Fans give him credit for, he understands marketing as it applies to Pwr5 FB, he understands Consumer Behavior as it applies to Recruiting, he understands Industrial Psychology as it applies to developing a Staff

Dabo would do wonders & miracles at a place like GT

GT's Fanbase needs to let their thinking about Recruiting evolve beyond "well gee shucks, they all come highly recommended", that mindset is just another example of the residual Toxins that the previous Guy left in the well for our Fanbase to drink from

At what point do we decide to run with the big canines, instead of complaining that everyone else is cheating?

Lot to unpack here.

- I don’t know how ND factors into this discussion at all. There hasn’t been as much smoke there as there has from Clemson. Tuitt + the FL DE who committed to Tech/FSU but were both forced to flip by the parents days before NSD always seemed fishy to me. I’d be surprised if they weren’t. But I’d also be surprised if any factory wasn’t. It’s the reality we live in.

- Where do academics factor into this discussion?

- Dabo is successful b/c he has the backing of one of the biggest money machines in the country.

- Again this doesn’t apply to the discussion at all so I’m hesitant to even acknowledge it with a response, but you can literally disprove that statement with Tech vs Clemson the last decade.

- Again, idk why you’re referencing NFL here. Does not apply at all.

- I don’t disagree that he’s a great CEO. I also think he could switch jobs with CGC next year and both teams would have the same records they would have had
otherwise.

- Again, 2008 Dabo is basically 2019 CGC plus factory money and minus the actual coaching resumé.

- I don’t know what I said to make you think that’s my mindset. Honestly don’t know what you’re getting at here. Was that meant to respond to a different post?

- Nobody is complaining that they’re cheating. I’m stating that’s it’s obvious that they are. We would do it too if we had the money to do it. But we don’t have the money to do it. Or at least not to the same level. I’d love to hear how you think we’re going to “run with the big dogs” through effort and enthusiasm and without offering comparable bags.
 
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TheJuiceIsLoose

Georgia Tech Fan
Messages
71
Lot to unpack here.

- I don’t know how ND factors into this discussion at all. There hasn’t been as much smoke there as there has from Clemson. Tuitt + the FL DE who committed to Tech/FSU but were both forced to flip by the parents days before NSD always seemed fishy to me. I’d be surprised if they weren’t. But I’d also be surprised if any factory wasn’t. It’s the reality we live in.

- Where do academics factor into this discussion?

- Dabo is successful b/c he has the backing of one of the biggest money machines in the country.

- Again this doesn’t apply to the discussion at all so I’m hesitant to even acknowledge it with a response, but you can literally disprove that statement with Tech vs Clemson the last decade.

- Again, idk why you’re referencing NFL here. Does not apply at all.

- I don’t disagree that he’s a great CEO. I also think he could switch jobs with CGC next year and both teams would have the same records they would have had
otherwise.

- Again, 2008 Dabo is basically 2019 CGC plus factory money and minus the actual coaching resumé.

- I don’t know what I said to make you think that’s my mindset. Honestly don’t know what you’re getting at here. Was that meant to respond to a different post?

- Nobody is complaining that they’re cheating. I’m stating that’s it’s obvious that they are. We would do it too if we had the money to do it. But we don’t have the money to do it. Or at least not to the same level. I’d love to hear how you think we’re going to “run with the big dogs” through effort and enthusiasm and without offering comparable bags.
OK

My point is that GT do everything we can to win and stop with the accusations that the other guy is cheating or that school over there has easy Academics

Many colleges with generic Academics have horrible FB Teams, so Academics isn't the magic pill you think it is, many Teams have bagmen and also have horrible Teams

If the other guys are Cheatin', then maybe we need to learn the way the Game is played and beat them at their own Game

Getting your teeth kicked in & acting as if "losing with honor" is somehow heroic is beyond ridiculous

Generally speaking, I don't like accusing others of Cheatin'

There's no extra Seal or Designation on our Degrees & Diplomas that signify that our FB Program and MBB Program don't cheat, that's just an empty self-awarded thing that GT Fans have deluded themselves into thinking is important

After SMU got the Death Penalty did rich Kids that Graduated from SMU stop getting Job offers?

So what's the downside of living in the gray areas of the NCAA Rulebook?
 

bwelbo

Helluva Engineer
Messages
13,308
Does ND pay their players also?

My guess is that 100% of ND's 85 man scholly roster could graduate from GT had they chosen to come here

Dabo is successful because he understands that at the Pwr5 Level 80% of your success comes from Recruiting elite Talent to start with

Elite Talent with same coaching & development wins 99% of the time vs lesser Talent given the same variables, there are no special genius playcalls that will make a huge difference

Belichick with a crappy QB is a crappy HC, Belichick with Brady is an all time HoF HC

Dabo & his Bama MBA is lot smarter than many GT Fans give him credit for, he understands marketing as it applies to Pwr5 FB, he understands Consumer Behavior as it applies to Recruiting, he understands Industrial Psychology as it applies to developing a Staff

Dabo would do wonders & miracles at a place like GT

GT's Fanbase needs to let their thinking about Recruiting evolve beyond "well gee shucks, they all come highly recommended", that mindset is just another example of the residual Toxins that the previous Guy left in the well for our Fanbase to drink from

At what point do we decide to run with the big canines, instead of complaining that everyone else is cheating?

Notre Dame’s class last year was ranked #22. Notre Dame is proof that we can recruit better and have good academics. They’re not the multi 5-star bagman academy we’ve been discussing.
 

gtrower

Helluva Engineer
Messages
1,693
OK

My point is that GT do everything we can to win and stop with the accusations that the other guy is cheating or that school over there has easy Academics

Many colleges with generic Academics have horrible FB Teams, so Academics isn't the magic pill you think it is, many Teams have bagmen and also have horrible Teams

If the other guys are Cheatin', then maybe we need to learn the way the Game is played and beat them at their own Game

Getting your teeth kicked in & acting as if "losing with honor" is somehow heroic is beyond ridiculous

Generally speaking, I don't like accusing others of Cheatin'

There's no extra Seal or Designation on our Degrees & Diplomas that signify that our FB Program and MBB Program don't cheat, that's just an empty self-awarded thing that GT Fans have deluded themselves into thinking is important

After SMU got the Death Penalty did rich Kids that Graduated from SMU stop getting Job offers?

So what's the downside of living in the gray areas of the NCAA Rulebook?

I still have no idea why you’re bringing academics into this. I haven’t mentioned entrance requirements / degree difficulty once. It has nothing to do with why Clemson became elite recruiters in the span of five years.

Cheating is a reality we live in and people are naive to think that factory players aren’t walking away with paychecks. Hell we’ve got LSU getting caught red handed last year and we’re supposed to think the schools recruiting even better than them are clean? When we have wiretap of their own AA bragging about it? I don’t see why this is a controversial take.

I wouldn’t be surprised to find out Tech is cheating in some form. Basically have to these days to compete in a sport where the NCAA takes a blind eye to its moneymakers.
 

yeti92

Jolly Good Fellow
Messages
449
OK

My point is that GT do everything we can to win and stop with the accusations that the other guy is cheating or that school over there has easy Academics

Many colleges with generic Academics have horrible FB Teams, so Academics isn't the magic pill you think it is, many Teams have bagmen and also have horrible Teams

If the other guys are Cheatin', then maybe we need to learn the way the Game is played and beat them at their own Game

Getting your teeth kicked in & acting as if "losing with honor" is somehow heroic is beyond ridiculous

Generally speaking, I don't like accusing others of Cheatin'

There's no extra Seal or Designation on our Degrees & Diplomas that signify that our FB Program and MBB Program don't cheat, that's just an empty self-awarded thing that GT Fans have deluded themselves into thinking is important

After SMU got the Death Penalty did rich Kids that Graduated from SMU stop getting Job offers?

So what's the downside of living in the gray areas of the NCAA Rulebook?
That's a real space cadet rant you're on, all to say you want to cheat like the big boys.

Who is going to front the cash?
 

684Bee

Helluva Engineer
Messages
1,186
That's a real space cadet rant you're on, all to say you want to cheat like the big boys.

Who is going to front the cash?

If more GT fans would put effort into “fronting the cash” to the Athletic Association, we’d be a lot better off.

The people that do give, give generously. We just don’t have nearly enough people contributing.

Let’s quit message board b#tching, and accusing others of cheating, and start doing something productive. If you aren’t currently giving to GTAA, start small. Just start.
 

Skeptic

Helluva Engineer
Messages
5,864


Interesting. Thanks. I ain't buying, but it is interesting. I am sure they wanted that recruit, but I have followed Brad Brownell since coached at UNC-Wilmington 20 years ago. He is a straight up, by the book, stand up guy. I don't see him having any part of buying players. The same with Swinney. Apparently the FBI didn't put any credence into Smith's kind of rambling indictment and of course Clemson fired him. Didn't hurt him though. FSU immediately hired him.
 

Skeptic

Helluva Engineer
Messages
5,864
Well, we could have had Elliot, and without a 7-year contract, too. He didn't even get an interview. He might be a candidate at South Carolina but would be reluctant to play Swinney for the state championship every year. As for Venables: he is a great defensive coordinator, one of top 2 or 3 in country. He is also spring-wound and hyper, not exactly the temperament for a HC. He needs a hand on his shoulder. Swinney? He might be the CEO but the man can coach.
 
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