A Player's Perspective on Clemson game

pbrown520

Ramblin' Wreck
Messages
586
The biggest problem I saw with our O was this staff did not get to open the season against a Bobby Johnson led vandy or Jax State.

PJ never played Bobby Johnson at Vandy. I suppose PJ makes the ACC schedule. Edited to say, he played Bobby Johnson in 2009, my bad.

Truth is we had as much production in this last game as PJ had the last 3 years, which isn't saying much. It also was one of the worst defensive performances we have had too.

I personally just don't care for all the pressers with the coach speak, but that's how this staff rolls from Collins on down. The thing that is really good from the staff is the positivity, even though it is usually over the top.
 

Beerbrewingjacket

Georgia Tech Fan
Messages
84
It may have been a good plan until Clemp basically dared us to pass.

And we burned them a couple of times with Graham back there and tried to do it TO but it wasn’t successful. We just don’t really have the guys to be effective at both. I am reserving that opinion a bit on Graham because we haven’t really seen him pass and run a whole lot. I think we know exactly what we have with TO. Slippery runner who can operate a basic option offense. But he isn’t a passer and a new scheme isn’t going to magically make him have it either.

The fact that Lucas still can’t seem to get snaps just tells me that maybe he just isn’t the guy. Hard to say because we haven’t seen him get decent playing time.
 

Beerbrewingjacket

Georgia Tech Fan
Messages
84
PJ never played Bobby Johnson at Vandy. I suppose PJ makes the ACC schedule. Edited to say, he played Bobby Johnson in 2009, my bad.

Truth is we had as much production in this last game as PJ had the last 3 years, which isn't saying much. It also was one of the worst defensive performances we have had too.

I personally just don't care for all the pressers with the coach speak, but that's how this staff rolls from Collins on down. The thing that is really good from the staff is the positivity, even though it is usually over the top.

Technically we had 100 more yards this year than last and averaged 1 more yards per play. We had more than 100 yards than 2017 or 2016. And this was with a variation of the old offense with essentially the same personnel so that to me is a pretty good look to build on.

Defensively, there were some miscues. But Clemson hung 44 on Bama, 63 on Wake, 42 on Pitt, 56 on FSU and 40+ on several teams last year. We also got 2 INTs off Lawrence when he threw 4 all last year. Considering the 4 turnovers they got straddled with.
 

pbrown520

Ramblin' Wreck
Messages
586
Technically we had 100 more yards this year than last and averaged 1 more yards per play. We had more than 100 yards than 2017 or 2016. And this was with a variation of the old offense with essentially the same personnel so that to me is a pretty good look to build on.

Defensively, there were some miscues. But Clemson hung 44 on Bama, 63 on Wake, 42 on Pitt, 56 on FSU and 40+ on several teams last year. We also got 2 INTs off Lawrence when he threw 4 all last year. Considering the 4 turnovers they got straddled with.

100 more yards on more drives. We had less 1st Downs this year than last. A lot of the byproduct of the low yards with PJ was the game shortening game plan he rolled with. Defense gave up 150 more yards this year and would have last year most likely if we would have run hurry up like we did this year.

All in all, it was a wash. I think the potential of the defense is there, same with the offense. I just think Pnode is generic and I am tired of him tooting his horn, but that's just me. He could end up being really good - I hope he is.
 

Beerbrewingjacket

Georgia Tech Fan
Messages
84
100 more yards on more drives. We had less 1st Downs this year than last. A lot of the byproduct of the low yards with PJ was the game shortening game plan he rolled with. Defense gave up 150 more yards this year and would have last year most likely if we would have run hurry up like we did this year.

All in all, it was a wash. I think the potential of the defense is there, same with the offense. I just think Pnode is generic and I am tired of him tooting his horn, but that's just me. He could end up being really good - I hope he is.

Did he toot his horn? I’ve heard nothing of the sort from him.
 

Longestday

Helluva Engineer
Featured Member
Messages
2,856
@Lee I wonder how long it will take until you state your distaste for the current coach and call fans out for not being for GT by not backing the new coach?

I thought changing coaches would change the outcome of the Clemson game? It’s not that I am pro CPJ over GT... it’s that I believe the problem is beyond the coach and hiring Nick Saban coach would not solve the issue... or a coach that won championships at FBS level and took Navy to new heights... or a coach that went 2 years at Temple going 16 and 8.
 

Dpjacket

Jolly Good Fellow
Messages
183
I don’t care what the Offense is called. Just don’t base it on the QB carrying the ball 30+% of plays. That’s where CPJ lost me last two seasons. And that playbook is little more than Peewee football.
 

Bogey

Helluva Engineer
Messages
1,726
The real reason we didn't throw more is that coach knew we would get slaughtered trying to pass against the Clemson defense in our first game and he was trying to cover the spread since he knew I had a hundred bet on us.

Sent from my ASUS_Z01RD using Tapatalk
 

RonJohn

Helluva Engineer
Messages
4,995
Had you all been listening objectively this offseason then you wouldn’t be surprised at what we got. The staff repeatedly said they were going to run the offense based on the personnel they have. They did exactly that. The handful of times they tried to do some passing concepts TO failed. So did Lucas, albeit a short sample size. Graham did the best passing but his knock is grasp of the playbook. So the staff have to evaluate these guys in a non controlled environment. The staff are still learning what they have.

It is extremely common for people to hear what they want to hear. CPJ gave pretty straight answers most of the time and people still heard some things totally different than what he said. CGC gives mostly vague answers, so people will read whatever they want to in them. I like what CGC has done so far, but his comments are in full sales-guy mode. You can understand vague concepts such as "family" and "effort", but anyone who believes they understand specifics about what the team will do they are fooling themselves. That isn't my style, but there isn't anything wrong with it. It matches the majority of football coaches, thus the "coach speak" vernacular. People just shouldn't put too much into what he says related to specific things like who will be playing or what percentages of plays will be pass vs run.
 

Lee

Ramblin' Wreck
Messages
841
@Lee I wonder how long it will take until you state your distaste for the current coach and call fans out for not being for GT by not backing the new coach?

I thought changing coaches would change the outcome of the Clemson game? It’s not that I am pro CPJ over GT... it’s that I believe the problem is beyond the coach and hiring Nick Saban coach would not solve the issue... or a coach that won championships at FBS level and took Navy to new heights... or a coach that went 2 years at Temple going 16 and 8.

Not sure why you called me out specifically. Cheese is essentially giddy about the way the game went and going out of his way to undermine anything the new staff is going. It’s clear his allegiance is greater for CPJ than it is GT. I’ve said nothing about you. All I did was prove how ignorant his post was yet again. He never responds which means he either knows he’s wrong, but won’t admit it or got tired of being called out and ignored me. Either way is fine by me.

But since you called me out specifically, I’ll respond. I’ll start by saying that I was a huge supporter if PJ when he was hired. So much so that I bet a Bama friend of mine that we would get to a National Championship game before they did with Saban (clearly wrong on that one. Was 22 at the time). PJ started losing me when he told Vad something like: “don’t plan on ever doing that again”after the 4 td pass game against Duke in whatever year that was. Ironically (or not) this is one of the last times we beat Duke. This started me thinking that his offense and perception as an “option genius” trumped winning. He didn’t officially lose me until 2017. It just seemed like his ego never went away and only got worse, he valued “his offense” more than winning and his total apathy towards recruiting just turned me off.

As for the new coach, I don’t plan expressing my distaste for him because I’m not hoping he fails like some. I am for GT. Have been since I was about 5, was when I put on the uniform (different sport), and will be until I die. I want what’s best for the program. If you, or anyone else didn’t think it was time for a change, then you weren’t paying attention. The man himself knew it was time and quit (which I’m thankful for).

This does not mean I will not question things that the new coach or anyone on staff do. Quite the opposite. I was very frustrated with how long Oliver stayed in the game last Thursday. I did not have a problem with the offense we started the game with. It actually made a ton of sense to me. My issue was with how long we stayed with it once we weren’t moving the ball consistently and it was obvious TO could not complete the throws we needed him to make.

Lastly (sorry for the long response), I agree with you that a coach alone is not going to fix all the problems we have. Money goes a lo g way to helping with that. The last guy couldn’t raise money if he had to and I’m sure he would tell you the same thing. It almost seemed beneath him. The new guy can and has. To do that, you need to create a buzz, do something different and differentiate yourself from what was here before. Whether any if us like it or not, GT was not viewed highly by almost anyone around the country save some Navy and Ga Southern folks (and ILovetheoption here). What he is doing needed to be done. I don’t thi k he has done anything egregious towards the previous regime. Some may not like it, but emphasizing what we are doing going forward is different than what we’ve done in the past is just telling the truth.

If you’re concern is academics, I will just say (from experience) that is overblown. I “got out” with a higher GPA from GT than I did in HS. Now I worked a lot harder because HOPE was most of my scholly in my sport, but this is not the major hurdle most think it is.
 

forensicbuzz

21st Century Throwback Dad
Messages
8,851
Location
North Shore, Chicago
And we burned them a couple of times with Graham back there and tried to do it TO but it wasn’t successful. We just don’t really have the guys to be effective at both. I am reserving that opinion a bit on Graham because we haven’t really seen him pass and run a whole lot. I think we know exactly what we have with TO. Slippery runner who can operate a basic option offense. But he isn’t a passer and a new scheme isn’t going to magically make him have it either.

The fact that Lucas still can’t seem to get snaps just tells me that maybe he just isn’t the guy. Hard to say because we haven’t seen him get decent playing time.
Against the #1 team in the nation and The National Champions. It remains to be seen if we can do it against the likes of USF or UVA.
 

pbrown520

Ramblin' Wreck
Messages
586
Not sure why you called me out specifically. Cheese is essentially giddy about the way the game went and going out of his way to undermine anything the new staff is going. It’s clear his allegiance is greater for CPJ than it is GT. I’ve said nothing about you. All I did was prove how ignorant his post was yet again. He never responds which means he either knows he’s wrong, but won’t admit it or got tired of being called out and ignored me. Either way is fine by me.

But since you called me out specifically, I’ll respond. I’ll start by saying that I was a huge supporter if PJ when he was hired. So much so that I bet a Bama friend of mine that we would get to a National Championship game before they did with Saban (clearly wrong on that one. Was 22 at the time). PJ started losing me when he told Vad something like: “don’t plan on ever doing that again”after the 4 td pass game against Duke in whatever year that was. Ironically (or not) this is one of the last times we beat Duke. This started me thinking that his offense and perception as an “option genius” trumped winning. He didn’t officially lose me until 2017. It just seemed like his ego never went away and only got worse, he valued “his offense” more than winning and his total apathy towards recruiting just turned me off.

As for the new coach, I don’t plan expressing my distaste for him because I’m not hoping he fails like some. I am for GT. Have been since I was about 5, was when I put on the uniform (different sport), and will be until I die. I want what’s best for the program. If you, or anyone else didn’t think it was time for a change, then you weren’t paying attention. The man himself knew it was time and quit (which I’m thankful for).

This does not mean I will not question things that the new coach or anyone on staff do. Quite the opposite. I was very frustrated with how long Oliver stayed in the game last Thursday. I did not have a problem with the offense we started the game with. It actually made a ton of sense to me. My issue was with how long we stayed with it once we weren’t moving the ball consistently and it was obvious TO could not complete the throws we needed him to make.

Lastly (sorry for the long response), I agree with you that a coach alone is not going to fix all the problems we have. Money goes a lo g way to helping with that. The last guy couldn’t raise money if he had to and I’m sure he would tell you the same thing. It almost seemed beneath him. The new guy can and has. To do that, you need to create a buzz, do something different and differentiate yourself from what was here before. Whether any if us like it or not, GT was not viewed highly by almost anyone around the country save some Navy and Ga Southern folks (and ILovetheoption here). What he is doing needed to be done. I don’t thi k he has done anything egregious towards the previous regime. Some may not like it, but emphasizing what we are doing going forward is different than what we’ve done in the past is just telling the truth.

If you’re concern is academics, I will just say (from experience) that is overblown. I “got out” with a higher GPA from GT than I did in HS. Now I worked a lot harder because HOPE was most of my scholly in my sport, but this is not the major hurdle most think it is.

You should go back and see why we have an indoor practice facility if you think PJ couldn't raise money. By all accounts PJ had a lot to do with reaching out to the Brock's and making that happen.

PJ should have retired 3 years ago after the 9 win season, he stayed too long. I think he got tired of hearing **** from bellyaching fans who don't know **** all the time (including boosters inasmuch as tech has them). I also think he was tired of dealing with the constant mis- characterization of his program and did a poor job of combating the negativity. He certainly wasn't apathetic towards recruiting. He was very vocal about getting more staff to help and worked to get some support additions. The apathy comments stem, in my opinion, from his unashamed bashing of the recruit ranking services - most of which he said is true.

Academics depends on degree, but who cares 90+% of athletes aren't engineers.
 

TheSilasSonRising

Helluva Engineer
Messages
3,729
PJ never played Bobby Johnson at Vandy. I suppose PJ makes the ACC schedule. Edited to say, he played Bobby Johnson in 2009, my bad.

Truth is we had as much production in this last game as PJ had the last 3 years, which isn't saying much. It also was one of the worst defensive performances we have had too.

I personally just don't care for all the pressers with the coach speak, but that's how this staff rolls from Collins on down. The thing that is really good from the staff is the positivity, even though it is usually over the top.


Never said he did. Ever hear of CCG? Or were you at the first games of new coaches in 2002 or 2008?

Maybe an obsession with one certain coach?
 

Longestday

Helluva Engineer
Featured Member
Messages
2,856
@Lee The CPJ over GT triggered me... I think CPJ left at the right time too and know that a option coach could not be the next hire due to fans. CPJ needed to make a hard choice... he failed to do with Seahawk. He also owns Groh.

2008 APR change, GT becoming MIT II during the last 10 years, and a athletic director that tried to kill the GT program, the forced cheap hire of a DC (Roof), a program that invest less than any other ACC program....not a top 25 offense 8 of 11 years hurt the program. I think GT was lucky to have him through these changes and issues.

I don’t care how GT wins. Run or Pass does not matter. (Even though I am one of the few that see the advantage of the option).

I am in a show me stage because other than the current AD and The uniforms, I don’t see the upside here. Is GT really going to beat other teams doing the same thing they are doing? We will see... and I’ll root OUR team on. but I hate the hate for CPJ.
 

GaTech4ever

Helluva Engineer
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1,526
@Lee I am in a show me stage because other than the current AD and The uniforms, I don’t see the upside here. Is GT really going to beat other teams doing the same thing they are doing?

I’m still on the fence about this as well. But that’s why Collins is selling the academics + Atlanta + tradition so hard. No other school has that trifecta. So I think the goal is to get competitive and be in the ballpark of the teams we want to compete with, and then every few years the breaks go our way (just like they have in the past) and we overachieve.

I think ideally we’d have a higher floor with this approach due to being able to sustain injuries because of increased depth, the overall talent increase, and (hopefully) a more consistent defense.
 
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