A Player's Perspective on Clemson game

[Animal02]

I am in a show me stage because other than the current AD and The uniforms, I don’t see the upside here. Is GT really going to beat other teams doing the same thing they are doing? We will see... and I’ll root OUR team on. but I hate the hate for CPJ.

This! Add to all the other issues is the fact that we offer a quarter of the degree programs that most of our competitors do. Contrary to the current popular group think opinion.....there is a limited subset of kids that will have an interest in pursuing one of those degrees and putting in an effort to obtain it. CPJ made the same mistake, thinking he could out recruit in GA. It will take a national effort to do it, and outside the metro area, 404 and ATL are pretty much meaningless.

 

[IM79]

Darn we really missed a chance to showcase a passing offense that would have gone 18/45 with 6 ints on the road against the #1 team. Would have really pumped up the recruits

Don’t worry about it. The game was on the ACC Network which is only available on about one cable system in Fairbanks Alaska or something. So nobody got to see our offense anyway.

 

[bke1984]

Failure to showcase passing isn’t what bothered me on Thursday. It was more of a failure to show any real structure to the offense. For much of the first half we just snapped the ball to TO and let him run QB keepers. It looked like an 8 year old playing NCAA Football on PlayStation that has no clue what plays are in the playbook, so he just snaps the ball and scrambles with the QB.

If you’re really going to “do what the players are good at” then why weren’t there more option looks out of the gun? Seems like you could have highlighted that stuff while incorporating a spread style passing attack in targeted bursts and still focussed on TO’s strengths.

There are other issues for sure, but given that they had Spring and Fall camps to come up with something we could run it was a little disappointing just how basic and primitive it was.

Honorable mention...the goal line stuff was atrocious. All this talk about highlighting our strengths and then you can’t line up and punch it in from the two with a program that has excelled at this for 10 years? Resorting to direct snaps and odd formations to fool the opposition in order to get two yards? Come on man...if that’s what we’re in for it’s going to be frustrating.

They need to pick a QB (I’d pick JG, but I trust them) and build a real offense around him for THIS YEAR. Then we live with the results...

 

[Animal02]

Failure to showcase passing isn’t what bothered me on Thursday. It was more of a failure to show any real structure to the offense. For much of the first half we just snapped the ball to TO and let him run QB keepers. It looked like an 8 year old playing NCAA Football on PlayStation that has no clue what plays are in the playbook, so he just snaps the ball and scrambles with the QB.

If you’re really going to “do what the players are good at” then why weren’t there more option looks out of the gun? Seems like you could have highlighted that stuff while incorporating a spread style passing attack in targeted bursts and still focussed on TO’s strengths.

There are other issues for sure, but given that they had Spring and Fall camps to come up with something we could run it was a little disappointing just how basic and primitive it was.

Honorable mention...the goal line stuff was atrocious. All this talk about highlighting our strengths and then you can’t line up and punch it in from the two with a program that has excelled at this for 10 years? Resorting to direct snaps and odd formations to fool the opposition in order to get two yards? Come on man...if that’s what we’re in for it’s going to be frustrating.

They need to pick a QB (I’d pick JG, but I trust them) and build a real offense around him for THIS YEAR. Then we live with the results...

Watch out.....you will be labeled a hater for comments like that.
Or should I say welcome to the club ?

 

[Lee]

@Lee The CPJ over GT triggered me... I think CPJ left at the right time too and know that a option coach could not be the next hire due to fans. CPJ needed to make a hard choice... he failed to do with Seahawk. He also owns Groh.

2008 APR change, GT becoming MIT II during the last 10 years, and a athletic director that tried to kill the GT program, the forced cheap hire of a DC (Roof), a program that invest less than any other ACC program....not a top 25 offense 8 of 11 years hurt the program. I think GT was lucky to have him through these changes and issues.

I don’t care how GT wins. Run or Pass does not matter. (Even though I am one of the few that see the advantage of the option).

I am in a show me stage because other than the current AD and The uniforms, I don’t see the upside here. Is GT really going to beat other teams doing the same thing they are doing? We will see... and I’ll root OUR team on. but I hate the hate for CPJ.

I understand. I didn’t lump you in with the group when I mentioned PJ over GT. I think you’ve been mostly quiet and fair from what I’ve read. I’m in my mid 30’s with 2 kids under 6 and still in the early stages of starting a business so I don’t have as much time as some to get on here so I could have missed something. But what I’ve read from you seems well thought out and rational. So again, that comment was not directed at you.

There are about 2-3 that I would put in that category. I responded directly to one. I don’t post often, I usually just read for information. Based on said person’s comments over an extended period of time I feel strongly that he either cares more about the previous coach than GT or dislikes the new coach more than he wants GT to succeed.

I agree with you that the AD’s have not been helpful to our program. Although, I think Drad is a solid AD. Not sure if we could have dug in a little more to find out that he was using us as a stepping stone though. I do feel we’ve got a good one now.

As for doing the same thing as everyone else, I would disagree here. I personally think Collins and company are innovative. Some of it’s cheesy and gimmicky, but the man knows how to sell. Branding is huge. Look what that did for Oregon. We don’t have Nike in our backyard throwing money and gear at us, but there are a lot of Atlanta based companies that if we could get on board could change the trajectory of our program. I’m not naive to believe this will all happen without winning games, but to expect the winning to just magically happen after we've combined for a 24-25 record over the last 4 seasons is not realistic. I also think a lot of what will differentiate us on the field now will be more on the defensive side.

I’m going to reserve judgement on the new offensive system until we get a few more games under our belt. Which may still be a bit too early if we don’t have the right pieces. I do think we will have an idea of what we have by mid year though.

We are on the same page in wanting our Jackets to win above all the noise. Let’s get the winning started this weekend!

 

[Lee]

You should go back and see why we have an indoor practice facility if you think PJ couldn't raise money. By all accounts PJ had a lot to do with reaching out to the Brock's and making that happen.

PJ should have retired 3 years ago after the 9 win season, he stayed too long. I think he got tired of hearing **** from bellyaching fans who don't know **** all the time (including boosters inasmuch as tech has them). I also think he was tired of dealing with the constant mis- characterization of his program and did a poor job of combating the negativity. He certainly wasn't apathetic towards recruiting. He was very vocal about getting more staff to help and worked to get some support additions. The apathy comments stem, in my opinion, from his unashamed bashing of the recruit ranking services - most of which he said is true.

Academics depends on degree, but who cares 90+% of athletes aren't engineers.

I’m not aware of PJ’s involvement in raising money for the facility. If true (and I have no reason to believe it’s not), kudos to him. I do think at that point, he had a lot more energy and excitement towards where we were going.

Again, I was a big supporter of him and the program. I did wish he would pass more, even when things were going well because I knew we would need it against the best of the best.

I agree with you that he should have retired 3 years ago as well. Not sure what happened because I have no inside info, but it just seemed like something changed after/during the 2015 season. He just didn’t seem like he had the same energy, the team seemed less disciplined than usual, and he seemed to have lost his fire (though it would come out occasionally).

He did some awesome things for the program, but it was definitely time for a change. I genuinely appreciate how he left as well. He could have made it difficult for us by forcing our hand and putting us behind with a buyout but he didn’t. I will always respect him even more for that.

Now let’s get the ball moving in the right direction with a win the weekend!

 

[Jacketsfan99]

I agree with Ton in that the offense has to have an identity and you run what you want to be in an effort to eventually be great at it.

The frustrating part to me is I have no idea what we are trying to be. Each interview seems to have a different take on what that is. Most spread offenses are run first offenses. The pass in the RPO is based on a read, otherwise the play is a run. So, how can you say you want to be balanced if the defense dictates run/pass based on their coverage? There is a ton of option (double, triple, zone read, RPO) in the traditional spread offense. It is built on it. So, if we are getting away from the option, does that mean we aren’t running the spread? If we are too scared to call the spread an option offense, we should have just implemented the air raid to draw a clear distinction between who we were and who we are now.

I will say I thought Dave P made a good choice by starting Oliver. He has played a lot and we were on the road in a rough environment. Experience to not panic as the starting QB was needed and I think Oliver played his heart out.

I don't have much to say, here, but was disappointed that we turned the ball over 4 times - it's hard to beat anybody when you do that - I see us improving as the players learn more and more of the play book . There's a lot of difference in a relaxed game at practice and an actual game so I'm looking for good things going forward.

 

[knoxjacket]

@Lee The CPJ over GT triggered me... I think CPJ left at the right time too and know that a option coach could not be the next hire due to fans. CPJ needed to make a hard choice... he failed to do with Seahawk. He also owns Groh.

2008 APR change, GT becoming MIT II during the last 10 years, and a athletic director that tried to kill the GT program, the forced cheap hire of a DC (Roof), a program that invest less than any other ACC program....not a top 25 offense 8 of 11 years hurt the program. I think GT was lucky to have him through these changes and issues.

I don’t care how GT wins. Run or Pass does not matter. (Even though I am one of the few that see the advantage of the option).

I am in a show me stage because other than the current AD and The uniforms, I don’t see the upside here. Is GT really going to beat other teams doing the same thing they are doing? We will see... and I’ll root OUR team on. but I hate the hate for CPJ.

RE: the APR excuse. It seems to me back in the GOL and CCG days all our players majored in Management but since PJ came aboard it’s all our gussied up history/sociology degrees.

 

[smokey_wasp]

Myself, included

 

[MWBATL]

Failure to showcase passing isn’t what bothered me on Thursday. It was more of a failure to show any real structure to the offense. For much of the first half we just snapped the ball to TO and let him run QB keepers. It looked like an 8 year old playing NCAA Football on PlayStation that has no clue what plays are in the playbook, so he just snaps the ball and scrambles with the QB.

If you’re really going to “do what the players are good at” then why weren’t there more option looks out of the gun? Seems like you could have highlighted that stuff while incorporating a spread style passing attack in targeted bursts and still focussed on TO’s strengths.

There are other issues for sure, but given that they had Spring and Fall camps to come up with something we could run it was a little disappointing just how basic and primitive it was.

Honorable mention...the goal line stuff was atrocious. All this talk about highlighting our strengths and then you can’t line up and punch it in from the two with a program that has excelled at this for 10 years? Resorting to direct snaps and odd formations to fool the opposition in order to get two yards? Come on man...if that’s what we’re in for it’s going to be frustrating.

They need to pick a QB (I’d pick JG, but I trust them) and build a real offense around him for THIS YEAR. Then we live with the results...

I think you captured what I felt better than I did and I like what you said better than what I said.

 

[stech81]

RE: the APR excuse. It seems to me back in the GOL and CCG days all our players majored in Management but since PJ came aboard it’s all our gussied up history/sociology degrees.

Who cares, if you love Tech as much as you hate CPJ you would be a great fan.

 

[dressedcheeseside]

Play to win with what you have... pandering to potential recruits by altering your game plan is a slippery slope...

So practicing what you preached is pandering?

 

[GTpdm]

Branding is huge. Look what that did for Oregon. We don’t have Nike in our backyard throwing money and gear at us, but there are a lot of Atlanta based companies that if we could get on board could change the trajectory of our program. I’m not naive to believe this will all happen without winning games, but to expect the winning to just magically happen after we've combined for a 24-25 record over the last 4 seasons is not realistic.

Not disagreeing with you entirely, but I’m not sure you should be holding up the Nike/Oregon partnership as an example of what branding can accomplish. Over the past four years, they are 18-18 in their conference, and 21-21 overall against P5 competition. That is a huge drop-off from the preceding six years, when they were collectively 50-6 (89%) in conference and 59-10 (85%) vs P5. Basically, since their appearance in the first CFP, they’ve been a non-issue in college football.

Examined in that context, their flashy (I’d actually say gaudy) ‘bling’ uniforms come off as empty hype, not substantive branding.

 

[smokey_wasp]

So practicing what you preached is pandering?

I must have missed where CGC made any specific promises regarding what our run/pass distribution would be in the first few games. All he said is we are going to be "spread/pro-style" which is intentionally vague and that we are going to be "player based" rather than "scheme based". He hasn't been "preaching" anything, regarding the offense.

We all know if we threw 35 times for 100 yards and 6 picks in game 1, you'd be saying "Why didn't CGC put his players in position to succeed?" or "why is he trying to shoehorn the players into something they don't fit?". Just admit there is nothing the new coach can do to win you over, because it's glaringly obvious.

 

[Longestday]

Coaching matters, recruiting matters, AD matters, and money matters...

You can’t fix stupid, no offense intended as you most likely feel the same way about me.but I do like rehashing the argument and refining my thoughts.

APR is a reality and not an excuse... a coach and school not willing to bend rules is the only way you can call APR an excuse. Black hats do have advantages....

 

[Longestday]

The new coach can win people over by winning... just like the old coach could have kept more people on board by winning more....

 

[smokey_wasp]

The new coach can win people over by winning... just like the old coach could have kept more people on board by winning more....

Of course that's true, but I'd like to think he'd get more than 1 game to do it.

 

[Longestday]

Fans only require one win a week....

The expectation monster got a lot of fans... they thought the type of Clemson loses where due to running the option... see what I did there?

The “you” in my post APT above is focused on those talking APR as an excuses.

 

[wvGT11]

I like how people are determining the team is bad after just one game against the defending national champs at home with a whole new staff and offense / defense and the first real.game the team has had under the transition. One player speaks out and its like the sky is falling. Reminds me of the start of Atlanta United this season.
It didn't go our way, so we move on to the next.
As the coaches have said we will tailor things to the players abilities . If that means we are more run heavy then so be it until we get the pass game down. We got lucky with the cpj transition due to the athletes we already had.

Sent from my Pixel 3 using Tapatalk

 

[dressedcheeseside]

I must have missed where CGC made any specific promises regarding what our run/pass distribution would be in the first few games. All he said is we are going to be "spread/pro-style" which is intentionally vague and that we are going to be "player based" rather than "scheme based". He hasn't been "preaching" anything, regarding the offense.

We all know if we threw 35 times for 100 yards and 6 picks in game 1, you'd be saying "Why didn't CGC put his players in position to succeed?" or "why is he trying to shoehorn the players into something they don't fit?". Just admit there is nothing the new coach can do to win you over, because it's glaringly obvious.

The game day O was a shocker to just about everyone. This thread is in response to a former GT SA who expressed the same dismay. I wonder how other former players feel because a big part of the culture change was getting them on board. Time to put your money where your mouth is if you want to keep those guys around the program.