Why Georgia Tech likely will never adopt the shotgun again

[ATL1]

He is Mike Leach of the ground game.

 

[WrexRacer]

When Friedgen was here, we ran multiple offenses (including option) from different formations. We weren't "worth an (expletive) at any of them"?

Riiiiight.... Maybe it's the coach who isn't "worth an (expletive)" at anything other than "his" offense.

I discussed the shotgun with someone who knows Johnson well. He explained why we won't run shotgun. Because "Johnson is stubborn" is the explanation he gave.

And with regard to the diamond and Vad Lee, as the article points out, we beat Duke 38-14 and rarely ran it again. It didn't work? Another GTSwarm myth. I guess losing to Duke while they outscore us 40-6 is a "better option".

The Fridge actually ran very few plays out of a lot of formations. Most of the pre snap movement was to get a read on how the D was defending. Johnson tries to run his plays out of very few formations to not give away anything to the defense.

Johnson isn't stubborn. He's calling plays he think will work. His disciples run different formations because they have their own preferences.

 

[ATL1]

Johnson isn't stubborn.

 

[RonJohn]

Johnson isn't stubborn. He's calling plays he think will work. His disciples run different formations because they have their own preferences.

It is common knowledge in the college football forums world that college coaches don't know anything. They don't know formations. They don't know how to select starting players. They don't know when to change plays, formation, or players. College coaches just think that years and years of long weeks studying and analyzing football count for something. That experience is nothing compared to the knowledge of forum posters who maybe played high school football and spend Saturday afternoon drinking beer and screaming at the TV. Those are the guys who actually have a vast knowledge of football.

 

[okiemon]

[*]Will we run shotgun again? Probably, just not under CPJ.
[/LIST]

This. To say “GA Tech will never run the shotgun again” is a bit short-sighted.




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[Skeptic]

When Friedgen was here, we ran multiple offenses (including option) from different formations. We weren't "worth an (expletive) at any of them"?

Riiiiight.... Maybe it's the coach who isn't "worth an (expletive)" at anything other than "his" offense.

I discussed the shotgun with someone who knows Johnson well. He explained why we won't run shotgun. Because "Johnson is stubborn" is the explanation he gave.

And with regard to the diamond and Vad Lee, as the article points out, we beat Duke 38-14 and rarely ran it again. It didn't work? Another GTSwarm myth. I guess losing to Duke while they outscore us 40-6 is a "better option".

actually -- I was at the game -- Tech left at least two TDs on the field and maybe a third. That silly formation was a sop to Lee who couldn't run from under center. Two mistakes: Johnson for recruiting him, Lee for accepting. Besides when your O lineman (Braun) dismisses it, then forget about it.

 

[ATL1]

It is common knowledge in the college football forums world that college coaches don't know anything. They don't know formations. They don't know how to select starting players. They don't know when to change plays, formation, or players. College coaches just think that years and years of long weeks studying and analyzing football count for something. That experience is nothing compared to the knowledge of forum posters who maybe played high school football and spend Saturday afternoon drinking beer and screaming at the TV. Those are the guys who actually have a vast knowledge of football.

actually -- I was at the game -- Tech left at least two TDs on the field and maybe a third. That silly formation was a sop to Lee who couldn't run from under center. Two mistakes: Johnson for recruiting him, Lee for accepting. Besides when your O lineman (Braun) dismisses it, then forget about it.

"That silly formation"

 

[GTRX7]

We have had 2 LOSING seasons -(one bad, and probably would have been 5-7 this yr) of last 3.The Offense is the engine for this train.It didn't really get it done.Any partial change that helps will be appreciated.

We also had two above average seasons in the last four (one with a historically great offense). Would you rather have had four 7-win seasons in a row?

Listen, I am not thrilled with what our offense did this year, and I have concerns whether we will improve next year, but I believe we still finished top 25 in offensive efficiency.

 

[Ash]

I totally get Coach's reasoning for not doing it. I believe not having the right QB makes a huge difference in being able to run plays out of the 'gun.

I also know we need to install some sort of package/wrinkle to keep the opposing team guessing. If we are not going to develop a real passing game that is. We are extremely predicable in how we line up, conference teams and UGA are getting used to what we do.

 

[lv20gt]

actually -- I was at the game -- Tech left at least two TDs on the field and maybe a third. That silly formation was a sop to Lee who couldn't run from under center. Two mistakes: Johnson for recruiting him, Lee for accepting. Besides when your O lineman (Braun) dismisses it, then forget about it.

Do you remember the first games we played with our current offense under Johnson? We did much better in our first game from the diamond than we did from our first game under Johnson. As far as leaving points on the board, we do that in just about every game so that isn't really limited to the diamond. Also, Lee could run from under center. He had no problem running it the year before against UNC. The problem all year in 2013 was our OL fell to pieces and couldn't block anyone. Largely because of injuries.

The biggest mistake was Johnson half -assing putting in a new wrinkle when he didn't want to.

 

[ATL1]

The biggest mistake was Johnson half -assing putting in a new wrinkle when he didn't want to.

& telling recruits he was gonna mix in more passing/auxiliary packages.

 

[dressedcheeseside]

Why don't we have multiple formations? Well, actually, we do. We have variations of our base formation, quite a few of them. Why don't we vary even more than that? Now that's a good question, but one with a very simple answer: time. We don't have time to practice more stuff and be good at all of it. Actually, we don't have enough time to practice the stuff we already run and be good at all of it.

Don't forget, we also vary our blocking assignments, too. There's plenty of variation in our offense as is. There's a lot to digest, understand and master. Master is the key word and we haven't. We have to run it faster than the defense can react to it and we must be perfect in our execution. The better/more athletic the defense, the more perfect and faster we have to be to have success with it. But it can be done, we've proven that in the past.

The problem in '17 was we weren't perfect or fast enough to beat the defenses on our schedule. It wasn't just qb, either. Just about every position on our offense needs to improve. Some of the improvements are tiny but have a big effect. Timing and spacing are small corrections that could yield huge gains. Those things come with repetition and familiarity among teammates.

We don't need to be more multiple. We need to be better at what we already do (or try to do).

 

[ATL1]

Why don't we have multiple formations? Well, actually, we do. We have variations of our base formation, quite a few of them. Why don't we vary even more than that? Now that's a good question, but one with a very simple answer: time. We don't have time to practice more stuff and be good at all of it. Actually, we don't have enough time to practice the stuff we already run and be good at all of it.

Don't forget, we also vary our blocking assignments, too. There's plenty of variation in our offense as is. There's a lot to digest, understand and master. Master is the key word and we haven't. We have to run it faster than the defense can react to it and we must be perfect in our execution. The better/more athletic the defense, the more perfect and faster we have to be to have success with it. But it can be done, we've proven that in the past.

The problem in '17 was we weren't perfect or fast enough to beat the defenses on our schedule. It wasn't just qb, either. Just about every position on our offense needs to improve. Some of the improvements are tiny but have a big effect. Timing and spacing are small corrections that could yield huge gains. Those things come with repetition and familiarity among teammates.

We don't need to be more multiple. We need to be better at what we already do (or try to do).

Yet Army & Navy can?

 

[dressedcheeseside]

Yet Army & Navy can?

Their schedule isn't as tough as ours. Army played and beat Duke, so what, other than that it was tOSU, who killed them, and a bunch of nobodies. We would have had similar results with Navy's schedule as they did, they lost to all the hard teams they played.

 

[ATL1]

Their schedule isn't as tough as ours. Army played and beat Duke, so what, other than that it was tOSU, who killed them, and a bunch of nobodies. We would have had similar results with Navy's schedule as they did, they lost to all the hard teams they played.

Navy still uses various formations and did so when they won 10 games. Army plays teams on a level playing field. I don't think this argument holds weight. I can't think of another team that plays completely from under center.

 

[1939hotmagic]

If Army and Navy manage to incorporate some shotgun into their offenses, using it some even when not in desperate third- and fourth-and-forever situations, I as a mere fan confess to finding it perplexing that Tech can't (or won't) manage to have a shotgun package to use in those 3rd-and-15+, and particularly 4th-and-forever situations when a drive must be maintained, a score must be had on the possession, or else the game will be lost. All the moreso if the QB has been getting pressured all game, and he could really use that extra second to look over things, to have a few more yards distance from the defense when the ball is snapped. One need not revamp the entire offense just to have a special package of plays ("series") from a particular formation to use in a specific situation, under certain distinct conditions.

 

[Techster]

In all honesty, you know why coaches don't do certain things and rely on what they've done? Because it's what they know, and what they're comfortable with. Is Jim Harbaugh or David Cutcliffe going to run our Flex Option? Maybe a play or two for some "surprise" effect to catch the defenses off kilter, but they are not going to feature it because quite frankly they don't know the intricacies of running our offense which requires know how to look at the defense to adjust blocking. CPJ will school them all day on that...just as they would most likely school CPJ on their offenses. CPJ is the foremost expert on this offense, and he operates it on a PHD level. But that expertise drops significantly down if he has to run another offense. He could probably do it, but then see 2013.

I've long given up on CPJ trying to "adjust" his offense. I held out hope for a while, but I've realized CPJ is who he is. In all honesty, after seeing what happened in 2013, is it really in GT's best interest for him to try something new now? The only way I'd have confidence in CPJ trying something else now is if he brought in someone from the outside....like what Gus Malzahn did this year with Chip Lindsey, and what Lane Kiffen did with Kendall Briles. Jimbo Fisher, he of the "pro style" offense even hired Darryl Dickey the offensive coordinator at Memphis to modernize his attack at Texas AM. I don't think he'll ever do that, so until CPJ leaves, I wouldn't expect anything other than what we have.

The Flex option has taken us to 3 ACCCG, 2 OB's, and an ACC Title. Like it or not, that's the horse we're going to ride until CPJ rides off into the sunset with it.

 

[ATL1]

If Army and Navy manage to incorporate some shotgun into their offenses, using it some even when not in desperate third- and fourth-and-forever situations, I as a mere fan confess to finding it perplexing that Tech can't (or won't) manage to have a shotgun package to use in those 3rd-and-15+, and particularly 4th-and-forever situations when a drive must be maintained, a score must be had on the possession, or else the game will be lost. All the moreso if the QB has been getting pressured all game, and he could really use that extra second to look over things, to have a few more yards distance from the defense when the ball is snapped. One need not revamp the entire offense just to have a special package of plays ("series") from a particular formation to use in a specific situation, under certain distinct conditions.

I mean it's not like they already don't exist in your offense. He has shotgun plays in his offense. Gun plays allows for some really good run/pass options for the QB & really work well in the seem and the flats. Same with screens. Though Tech doesn't screen much from center either.

A couple of other things I noticed. Army uses a tailback by committee approach. CPJ likes to lock in on one back. A blend approach may have worked to Tech's benefit.

 

[GT Man]

Vad Lee

 

[jgtengineer]

Yet Army & Navy can?

Army and Navy both don't do the blocking variations we do at least not as much anyway. I don't know if that is preference by the coaches or ability.