The 2008 Defensive Line

Techster

Helluva Engineer
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12,616
Pretty interesting to see how the 2008 defensive line is doing these days:

Michael Johnson: 4 star TE recruit turned into a DE
Drafted in 3rd Round with Bengals
Just signed a 5 year $43.75 million ($24m guaranteed) with Tampa (after coming off a $11m franchise tag year)

Vance Walker: 2 Star DL from S. Carolina
Drafted in 6th round by Atlanta, signed as a free agent by LA Raiders
Just signed a 3 year $13m ($3.75 guaranteed) with Kansas City

Darryl Richards: 4 Star DL from Louisiana
Drafted 6th round by New England. Lasted 2 years in the League

Derrick Morgan: 4 Star DE from Pennsylvania
Drafted 1st round by the Tennessee Titans.

I've always thought that player development and good scouting is more important than recruiting "stars", and I think the 2008 DL is proof of that.

In MJ, the staff was able to develop an outstanding DE from a guy that was an athlete at TE. In Vance, the staff scouted a great under the radar prospect, and developed him into one of the better DTs in the ACC. They supplemented scouting and player development with the ability to recruit high end DL prospects (Richards, Morgan)..of course, they didn't just sign them and let them play, they also developed their 4 star talent.
 

DCSS

Ramblin' Wreck
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637
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Tennessee
Pretty interesting to see how the 2008 defensive line is doing these days:

Michael Johnson: 4 star TE recruit turned into a DE
Drafted in 3rd Round with Bengals
Just signed a 5 year $43.75 million ($24m guaranteed) with Tampa (after coming off a $11m franchise tag year)

Vance Walker: 2 Star DL from S. Carolina
Drafted in 6th round by Atlanta, signed as a free agent by LA Raiders
Just signed a 3 year $13m ($3.75 guaranteed) with Kansas City

Darryl Richards: 4 Star DL from Louisiana
Drafted 6th round by New England. Lasted 2 years in the League

Derrick Morgan: 4 Star DE from Pennsylvania
Drafted 1st round by the Tennessee Titans.

I've always thought that player development and good scouting is more important than recruiting "stars", and I think the 2008 DL is proof of that.

In MJ, the staff was able to develop an outstanding DE from a guy that was an athlete at TE. In Vance, the staff scouted a great under the radar prospect, and developed him into one of the better DTs in the ACC. They supplemented scouting and player development with the ability to recruit high end DL prospects (Richards, Morgan)..of course, they didn't just sign them and let them play, they also developed their 4 star talent.

Are you saying we just sign players now and let them play without developing them?
 

Techster

Helluva Engineer
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12,616
Are you saying we just sign players now and let them play without developing them?

Haha...no. I was just saying it's not like the previous staff signed the 4 Star guys and just forgot about them.

Don't forget, Derrick Morgan played 2/3rds of his career under CPJ's staff...and he was a 1st rounder.
 

Ggee87

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Didn't Giff Smith recruit and coach those guys?
Giff was a good one that we let walk after Tenuta was fired. Wommack was hired instead of him for DC. Hes a cousin of mine so I enjoyed having him at GT. Definitely had alot to do with coaching these guys up to their potential.
 

GTNavyNuke

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Three 4 stars make the NFL. This supports the 4 & 5 star theory that they are better athletes and more likely to be better players. Yes 2 stars and walk ons can make it, but the odds are much much less.

We get three stars, strengthen them as they grow up and coach them up. It takes longer and is less likely to yield results than the "oven ready" 4 and 5 stars. So we are put at a disadvantage two ways; first that the players we get take longer to develop and are less likely to be stars and, second, we get fewer players since the ones we get fill the rosters. But its very satisfying to watch when we do it with someone like Godhigh. He probably won't play much in the NFL, but he was my favorite player doing more with less.
 

dressedcheeseside

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Giff was a good one that we let walk after Tenuta was fired. Wommack was hired instead of him for DC. Hes a cousin of mine so I enjoyed having him at GT. Definitely had alot to do with coaching these guys up to their potential.
I don't think Tenuta was fired. He wanted the head job and didn't get it. I think he left because his feelings were hurt. Also, we didn't let Giff walk, he moved up to the NFL. Maybe he would have stayed to be our DC, but he wasn't ready for that.
 

jayparr

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Three 4 stars make the NFL. This supports the 4 & 5 star theory that they are better athletes and more likely to be better players. Yes 2 stars and walk ons can make it, but the odds are much much less.

We get three stars, strengthen them as they grow up and coach them up. It takes longer and is less likely to yield results than the "oven ready" 4 and 5 stars. So we are put at a disadvantage two ways; first that the players we get take longer to develop and are less likely to be stars and, second, we get fewer players since the ones we get fill the rosters. But its very satisfying to watch when we do it with someone like Godhigh. He probably won't play much in the NFL, but he was my favorite player doing more with less.
Amen for that Bro!!!
 

Ggee87

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I don't think Tenuta was fired. He wanted the head job and didn't get it. I think he left because his feelings were hurt. Also, we didn't let Giff walk, he moved up to the NFL. Maybe he would have stayed to be our DC, but he wasn't ready for that.
He wanted to be in the NFL for sure. But that was after the fact of not getting the position as DC @ GT. He was a great recruiter, thats what i miss the most. He knows the area so well and just has one of those personalities that draw you in. Very good talker and could win over recruits fairly well.
 

Rodney Kent

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Pelton has just told us that Tech's defensive line will not be any better this year. In my opinion, he made a damning statement of his MOP regarding coaching. He stated that he was looking for a star. He also stated that the competing defenders for a starting position have very little experience, because they did not play much last year; that the starters stayed in the game most of the time.

This is exactly a prime formula for failure. The linemen do not need individuial stars, they need teamwork, and all need to contribute equally for success. The first teamers should never, never, never, never, never, stay in the game all the time. It is imperative that the substitutes play a at least 30-40 % of every game to keep all of the defensive linemen fresh. A fresh substitute is hugely more effecient than a tired first stringer. No wonder Williams decided to leave and his brother refused to consider Tech in his recruiting.

This is a formula for failure and disaster. I place this on CPJ; the buck stops with him. It is up to him to insure that the substitutes play an adequate amount of time during the games to keep the first teamers fresh and to keep fresh players in the game. No wonder Tech loses many games in the 3rd and 4th quarters. No wonder Tech can never win overtime games. The blind leading the blind and both will fall in the ditch. This once again proves it is not the players, it is the systems of the coaches that decides winning and losing. This actually makes me mad to thing a coach would be so foolish.

Maybe, CPJ's total obsession with the offense is his downfall with the overall efficiency of the team. It is hard to fathom a Head Coach allowing an assistant to coach with this kind of mentality toward substitutes and looking for stars. If the quality of the defensive line will only be effective with a few stars in the line, then we do not need a defensive line coach; just get the stars and do away with the defensive line coach. By the way, I do not mean recruting stars, I am referring to playing stars.
 

00Burdell

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CPJ does not micromanage the defense.

If the starters were in for the whole game, its not because Roof wasn't paying attention. Its because Roof was paying attention.

What we need is depth and while not having any isn't a good reflection of our recruiting, I'm glad we didn't torch a bunch of redshirts in a crash-n-burn strategy. 4 years hence, we will be happy we didn't sacrifice last year's freshmen.
 

SidewalkJacket

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This is a formula for failure and disaster. I place this on CPJ; the buck stops with him. It is up to him to insure that the substitutes play an adequate amount of time during the games to keep the first teamers fresh and to keep fresh players in the game. No wonder Tech loses many games in the 3rd and 4th quarters. No wonder Tech can never win overtime games. The blind leading the blind and both will fall in the ditch. This once again proves it is not the players, it is the systems of the coaches that decides winning and losing. This actually makes me mad to thing a coach would be so foolish.

Wow, cuz... you really don't understand college football game management do you? Too much "mass sub" option in NCAA '14? It doesn't work like the video game.
 

alaguy

Helluva Engineer
Messages
1,117
Pelton has just told us that Tech's defensive line will not be any better this year. In my opinion, he made a damning statement of his MOP regarding coaching. He stated that he was looking for a star. He also stated that the competing defenders for a starting position have very little experience, because they did not play much last year; that the starters stayed in the game most of the time.

This is exactly a prime formula for failure. The linemen do not need individuial stars, they need teamwork, and all need to contribute equally for success. The first teamers should never, never, never, never, never, stay in the game all the time. It is imperative that the substitutes play a at least 30-40 % of every game to keep all of the defensive linemen fresh. A fresh substitute is hugely more effecient than a tired first stringer. No wonder Williams decided to leave and his brother refused to consider Tech in his recruiting.

This is a formula for failure and disaster. I place this on CPJ; the buck stops with him. It is up to him to insure that the substitutes play an adequate amount of time during the games to keep the first teamers fresh and to keep fresh players in the game. No wonder Tech loses many games in the 3rd and 4th quarters. No wonder Tech can never win overtime games. The blind leading the blind and both will fall in the ditch. This once again proves it is not the players, it is the systems of the coaches that decides winning and losing. This actually makes me mad to thing a coach would be so foolish.

Maybe, CPJ's total obsession with the offense is his downfall with the overall efficiency of the team. It is hard to fathom a Head Coach allowing an assistant to coach with this kind of mentality toward substitutes and looking for stars. If the quality of the defensive line will only be effective with a few stars in the line, then we do not need a defensive line coach; just get the stars and do away with the defensive line coach. By the way, I do not mean recruting stars, I am referring to playing stars.

RK,
I agree that the DL needs a blow as much as possible but in a close game how much can you do that with er, "lesser" talent. It is a function of heat,# of plays, 3 and outs, score, ball location,etc. . That is one place where the coaches earn their money-decision on subs at key times.Also, maybe our subs were flat - not good enough.
otoh-with the advent of the hurry-up OFFs and more plays the need goes up so you are correct in worrying about it--my concern is even having enough REAL DTs.We've had a HORRENDOUS recent history with DTs and yet we go this yr without signing even one.THEN Atkins leaves. I'm sure the new coach is going to notice the dearth of talent there even if PJ doesn't.
 

Rodney Kent

Ramblin' Wreck
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Location
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To all: Any second string sub is ALWAYS better than a tired regular period. It does not make any difference to me what you thing about it, that is the truth. If you don't believe it, ask a medical expert that knows the body and its functions. Also, to the remark about playing the video games, I have never played one and will never play one. For most of you, I have been following football before you were a gleam in your father's eye, so your condescending remarks are meaningless to me.
 

Squints

Helluva Engineer
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To all: Any second string sub is ALWAYS better than a tired regular period. It does not make any difference to me what you thing about it, that is the truth.

No it's not. Just because you believe it true doesn't make it so. You're being ridiculous.

If you don't believe it, ask a medical expert that knows the body and its functions.

Since you're the one making the absolute ultimatum you should be the one to show the evidence.

For most of you, I have been following football before you were a gleam in your father's eye, so your condescending remarks are meaningless to me.

How long you've been following football is meaningless to everyone if you keep throwing out unsubstantiated "facts."
 

swampsting

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I don't think Tenuta was fired. He wanted the head job and didn't get it. I think he left because his feelings were hurt. Also, we didn't let Giff walk, he moved up to the NFL. Maybe he would have stayed to be our DC, but he wasn't ready for that.

Besides, Giff had coached for PJ at Southern already and I don't think PJ was going to stand in his way of trying his hand in the NFL. Giff is still very well thought of at Southern.
 

Ibeeballin

GT Athlete
Messages
4,884
To all: Any second string sub is ALWAYS better than a tired regular period. It does not make any difference to me what you thing about it, that is the truth. If you don't believe it, ask a medical expert that knows the body and its functions. Also, to the remark about playing the video games, I have never played one and will never play one. For most of you, I have been following football before you were a gleam in your father's eye, so your condescending remarks are meaningless to me.

LOL... So by your assertion, a tired Nesbitt < 100% Jaybo/Tevin or a tired D Morgan < 100% Egbuniwe & etc?

I appreciate your opinion, but that is simple not true. When those lungs give out on you, that is when that mental toughness, will, and raw talent kicks in and your second string can't simply provide all of those attributes.

MJ and DRich were both 3*s
 
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