Thacker out at DC, now Safeties coach

[ibeattetris]

The way folks on here talk about our D after the UCF game is interesting. Did it look different, yes. Was it enough to get some wins - sure. But let’s not forget we ended the year with the 85th ranked total defense and the 84th ranked scoring defense. That’s still pretty damn bad. Where we excelled was in turnovers. In fact we finished the year ranked 4th in total turnovers. While you can have an aggressive game plan to force turnovers you’re not going to force 20+ year in and year out. Thacker’s defenses have been in the bottom half (mostly near the bottom) every year he’s been here. It was time to change.

Our Total D last year was largely influenced by the fact that our offense never did anything. Of the year’s Thacker coached here, last year wasn’t one to gripe on. He definitely gets to own the disasters that were the previous three.

 

[MWBATL]

Just play press man and bring 5-6 guys every play. That’s all I ask if we get beat 50-10 at least they earned it instead of playing 15 yards off the ball and giving up 3rd and 5’s all day.

I have to admit that was my biggest frustration (out of many) last Saturday. If we play bend- but- don’t- break NFL style defense I will give upon this…

 

[kg01]

Our Total D last year was largely influenced by the fact that our offense never did anything. Of the year’s Thacker coached here, last year wasn’t one to gripe on. He definitely gets to own the disasters that were the previous three.

Our complete and total inability to punt and kick field goals is killing us from the inside as well.

I mean, how fkng hard can it be to find a punter? I ain't lookin for Harvin 2.0. Just a regular boring a** punter. Just catch it and kick it somewheres. Don't bobble it, don't bumfuddle with it, no need to side kick it. Just catch the thing and kick it down the field. IDGAF if it gets downed at the 1. I'll settle for regular-degular touch backs or fair catches. Don't care.

Kinda tired of watching punts like this ..

Can't live like this no mo, man.

 

[bke1984]

Our Total D last year was largely influenced by the fact that our offense never did anything. Of the year’s Thacker coached here, last year wasn’t one to gripe on. He definitely gets to own the disasters that were the previous three.

Weak excuse. There are plenty of teams with bad offenses that have defenses that produce. It was better, but still wasn’t great - and take away half turnovers and it was bad.

 

[bigrabbit]

Everyone on here looking for improvement on D, lots of ideas about schemes, how to coach. Quick reminder, compared to last year, we’re now playing without a couple guys not so easy to replace:

Ace Eley: led the team 118 tackles, 3.5 sacks, three pass deflections, four forced fumbles.
Charlie Thomas: 112 tackles, 10.5 tackles for loss, two sacks, two interceptions, two forced fumbles and two fumble recoveries, returned for a total of 114 yards …Ranked nationally in solo tackles per game (5th – 5.9), fumbles recovered (22nd – 2) and total tackles per game (22nd – 9.3)

 

[ibeattetris]

Weak excuse. There are plenty of teams with bad offenses that have defenses that produce. It was better, but still wasn’t great - and take away half turnovers and it was bad.

Our defense was 67th last year in defensive points per drive. It’s bad, but we were 112th the year before and 94th the year before that.

Our raw D FEI rank was 67th last year and due to strength of schedule was ranked overall at 41.

I’m not giving excuses and have called for Thacker’s head since the first year. That doesn’t mean that last year’s defense wasn’t okay.

Edit to say, GT is currently 113th in defensive points per drive

 

[Northeast Stinger]

Everyone on here looking for improvement on D, lots of ideas about schemes, how to coach. Quick reminder, compared to last year, we’re now playing without a couple guys not so easy to replace:

Ace Eley: led the team 118 tackles, 3.5 sacks, three pass deflections, four forced fumbles.
Charlie Thomas: 112 tackles, 10.5 tackles for loss, two sacks, two interceptions, two forced fumbles and two fumble recoveries, returned for a total of 114 yards …Ranked nationally in solo tackles per game (5th – 5.9), fumbles recovered (22nd – 2) and total tackles per game (22nd – 9.3)

Such an obvious fact to be overlooked by so many. Not many teams not named Ohio State, uga, or Clemson could lose that defensive production and plug in new players just as good.

My prediction is that the defense will dramatically improve but probably not for a couple of years. That’s how it is with all but a few teams.

 

[AugustaSwarm]

All true, but better than being fired 4 games into the season. Wouldn't be surprised if this move, allows thacker to retain a job , but end of season he moves on .

Agreed. This seems like a good way to do it. It allows this staff to maintain some semblance of consistency and allows Thacker to start looking/planning. I'm sure on a personal level, no one holds anything against Thacker - so a soft landing is ideal for everyone.

 

[AugustaSwarm]

Agreed, but if Batt did give input, I think it was more “you need to do something”, not specifically telling him what the something had to be. I hope our press guys ask Key some pointed questions about the change of heart.

I doubt it was a change of heart, honestly. What do you expect Key to say publicly? Key probably has confidence in Thacker as a coach, just not in the role he was in. So he made a change. He sees everything we see and then a WHOLE lot more. It surely was not a rushed or panicked decision and was likely in the back of Key's mind for quite some time (ergo having a Co-DC). Kudos to Key for pulling the trigger. Hopefully it works out for everyone.

 

[slugboy]

Everyone on here looking for improvement on D, lots of ideas about schemes, how to coach. Quick reminder, compared to last year, we’re now playing without a couple guys not so easy to replace:

Ace Eley: led the team 118 tackles, 3.5 sacks, three pass deflections, four forced fumbles.
Charlie Thomas: 112 tackles, 10.5 tackles for loss, two sacks, two interceptions, two forced fumbles and two fumble recoveries, returned for a total of 114 yards …Ranked nationally in solo tackles per game (5th – 5.9), fumbles recovered (22nd – 2) and total tackles per game (22nd – 9.3)

And the year before last, people were asking why we didn’t have someone better than Ace Eley starting, and whether Keion White would be good once he finally came off of his injury. Last year, they played great.

Eley and Thomas had better years last year than they did the year before. Linebacker play the year before wasn’t great, but when other defenders graduated, they stepped up and LB was decent for us last year. When you only have four years with a player, you expect another player to step up into the role when people graduate.

Yes, you lose production when players graduate. Teams fill that with the next player up or a transfers. Our younger players (like Tatum and Efford) and our transfers (like Moala) are supposed to step up, and other players around them are supposed to step up.

By the way, there’s falling off when a player graduates or transfers out, and there’s falling off a cliff. I expected regression on the defense, but not THIS. Players on a P5 team should be better than THIS.

Here are the top 5 players from last year’s defense:

			Tack					Def					Fumb
Rk	Player	G	Solo	Ast	Tot	Loss	Sk	Int	Yds	Avg	TD	PD	FR	Yds	TD	FF
1	Ayinde Eley	12	57	61	118	9.5	3.5					3	2	0	0	4
2	Charlie Thomas	12	71	41	112	10.5	2.0	2	28	14.0	0	2	2	114	0	2
3	Keion White	12	29	25	54	14.0	7.5					1
4	Miles Brooks	12	34	18	52	2.5	0.0	3	37	12.3	1	7	1	0	0	0
5	Clayton Powell-Lee	12	31	17	48	1.0	0.0	1	1	1.0	0	2	3	0	0	0
6	KJ Wallace	11	29	17	46	3.0	1.0	1	0	0.0	0	1

Provided by CFB at Sports Reference: View Original Table
Generated 10/3/2023.

Here is the year before. You’re always losing somebody

			Tack					Def					Fumb
Rk	Player	G	Solo	Ast	Tot	Loss	Sk	Int	Yds	Avg	TD	PD	FR	Yds	TD	FF
1	Quez Jackson	12	45	57	102	7.0	2.0					1	2			1
2	Ayinde Eley	11	42	46	88	2.5	0.5					1
3	Juanyeh Thomas	12	37	39	76	5.0	1.0	1	6	6.0	0	5				2
4	Charlie Thomas	12	35	35	70	10.0	3.0	2	0	0.0	0	0	1			1
5	Tariq Carpenter	11	40	25	65	1.0	0.0					2				1
6	Wesley Walker	10	24	20	44	0.0	0.0					2	1			2

Provided by CFB at Sports Reference: View Original Table
Generated 10/3/2023.

We lost a lot of other players too—Domenick and Walton, for example. We lose some to the portal, and we need to get new players in to replace them. We got Eley and White from the portal—while you might not expect everyone to be as good as White, you do expect the players you get from the portal to contribute to a good solid defense.

 

[CEB]

Everyone on here looking for improvement on D, lots of ideas about schemes, how to coach. Quick reminder, compared to last year, we’re now playing without a couple guys not so easy to replace:

Ace Eley: led the team 118 tackles, 3.5 sacks, three pass deflections, four forced fumbles.
Charlie Thomas: 112 tackles, 10.5 tackles for loss, two sacks, two interceptions, two forced fumbles and two fumble recoveries, returned for a total of 114 yards …Ranked nationally in solo tackles per game (5th – 5.9), fumbles recovered (22nd – 2) and total tackles per game (22nd – 9.3)

You are not wrong, but I would point to a different handful of guys. we knew all along that Thomas, Eley and White, were gone after last year. Not that those guys are easy to replace, but if you are going to be successful, you have to have answers for known departures.
What I think is more understandable and unfortunate is the inability to replace the loss of a Akeo stone, Zamari Walton, and Sylvain in short order. We were counting on those guys for both leadership and production all spring and summer. Losing two of them to late transfer and losing Sylvain almost as soon as the season started was a huge blow to this defense. Its not an excuse… Attrition is part of college football, but losing those three difference makers was very difficult to replace in short order

 

[Oakland]

I doubt it was a change of heart, honestly. What do you expect Key to say publicly? Key probably has confidence in Thacker as a coach, just not in the role he was in. So he made a change. He sees everything we see and then a WHOLE lot more. It surely was not a rushed or panicked decision and was likely in the back of Key's mind for quite some time (ergo having a Co-DC). Kudos to Key for pulling the trigger. Hopefully it works out for everyone.

I'm just wondering here:
How much would Tech have to pay Thacker not to coach?
Not firing Thacker was it somewhat of a face saving thing for Key or Batt since Thacker was retained?
Is it smart to retain someone on the staff who has been demoted?
Does having Thacker coaching the safeties really help?
Was the problem really with Thacker or a group of defensive players who really aren't capable of playing at this level?
Does the new guy get a pay raise?

I think we will see some defensive coaches moving on after this season.

 

[LongforDodd]

I'm confident it is. If you don't think the roster is good enough to hold BGSU to less than 38 you're equating our defensive roster with that of Eastern Illinois. We're better than that. We've got a coaching and scheme issue

I'm hoping too that we can get better results with a new coaching attitude but...

 

[Northeast Stinger]

You are not wrong, but I would point to a different handful of guys. we knew all along that Thomas, Eley and White, were gone after last year. Not that those guys are easy to replace, but if you are going to be successful, you have to have answers for known departures.
What I think is more understandable and unfortunate is the inability to replace the loss of a Akeo stone, Zamari Walton, and Sylvain in short order. We were counting on those guys for both leadership and production all spring and summer. Losing two of them to late transfer and losing Sylvain almost as soon as the season started was a huge blow to this defense. Its not an excuse… Attrition is part of college football, but losing those three difference makers was very difficult to replace in short order

Yep, no excuse but, still, Tech has never been a program that could seamlessly do “next man up” like the factories. At least not in my lifetime of watching Tech. Late attrition is hard for schools like us.

 

[slugboy]

I'm just wondering here:
How much would Tech have to pay Thacker not to coach?
Not firing Thacker was it somewhat of a face saving thing for Key or Batt since Thacker was retained?
Is it smart to retain someone on the staff who has been demoted?
Does having Thacker coaching the safeties really help?
Was the problem really with Thacker or a group of defensive players who really aren't capable of playing at this level?
Does the new guy get a pay raise?

I think we will see some defensive coaches moving on after this season.

How much would Tech have to pay Thacker not to coach?
That’s not it. Even at $650k salary per year, that’s not it.
Not firing Thacker was it somewhat of a face saving thing for Key or Batt since Thacker was retained?
Key has fired people. Demoting Thacker doesn’t save any face for Key or Batt compared to firing Thacker. Keeping Thacker on means “he’s a great coach with a lot of potential, but it’s too early for him to be a P5 DC”.
Is it smart to retain someone on the staff who has been demoted?
Even with the right attitude, I think getting demoted will grind at almost anyone. For some people, it’s a bad move—even for most people.
I think this means “we believe in him as a coach, and he’ll do a better job than someone that we pull in from outside at this late stage”
Does having Thacker coaching the safeties really help?
Probably. Our corners and nickels are getting blocked and having trouble in run defense. It might help for Tillman to give them extra attention, and Thacker played safety—he knows the position.
Was the problem really with Thacker or a group of defensive players who really aren't capable of playing at this level?
Likely “BOTH”, plus other factors, too.
Does the new guy get a pay raise?
Sherrer isn’t new, but this is a change in role. Probably, but he was being paid as a co-DC, so it’s probably not as big a bump as you might think

I think we will see some defensive coaches moving on after this season.
Unless there’s a massive turnaround on defense over the next 7 games, you’ll see something.

There are defensive coaches that Key has been a fan of.

 

[SunBum]

And really, what else could he do, he's not going to find a new DC hire from anywhere that's going to leave his current position in mid-season. And, no matter, at least he is doing something and not just sitting on his a** !

I know a guy...

 

[AugustaSwarm]

I'm just wondering here:
How much would Tech have to pay Thacker not to coach?
Not firing Thacker was it somewhat of a face saving thing for Key or Batt since Thacker was retained?
Is it smart to retain someone on the staff who has been demoted?
Does having Thacker coaching the safeties really help?
Was the problem really with Thacker or a group of defensive players who really aren't capable of playing at this level?
Does the new guy get a pay raise?

I think we will see some defensive coaches moving on after this season.

These are all fair questions. We don't know the timeline or any details for this. For all we know, Thacker asked to be removed. We'll likely never hear the details.

I will say this: firing a coach mid-season is always hard on the team moving forward. You're missing an important staff position in addition to possibly losing players (mentally) who may not like or agree with the firing.

As time goes on, we'll get answers to some of these questions. For me, the details of how we arrived here don't matter. It's more important that GT acted quickly. You can't ask players and fans to buy in and take things seriously if you continue to accept an *** whooping from a team that you paid to come play you.

 

[inGTwetrust]

The defense struggling is not surprising. We were middle of the road last year and we feasted on turnovers (top 10 nationally) to get there.

Combine the fact that we aren’t forcing turnovers like we did last year with the fact that we average < 1 sack a game (excluding Wake as that is an outlier) and it should be no surprise to anyone. Not sure a new play caller is fixing anything this year. Off-season will be big for the defensive coaching staff.

 

[Oakland]

You are not wrong, but I would point to a different handful of guys. we knew all along that Thomas, Eley and White, were gone after last year. Not that those guys are easy to replace, but if you are going to be successful, you have to have answers for known departures.
What I think is more understandable and unfortunate is the inability to replace the loss of a Akeo stone, Zamari Walton, and Sylvain in short order. We were counting on those guys for both leadership and production all spring and summer. Losing two of them to late transfer and losing Sylvain almost as soon as the season started was a huge blow to this defense. Its not an excuse… Attrition is part of college football, but losing those three difference makers was very difficult to replace in short order

I can understand Walton going, but I would like to know the story on Stone. One week he is finishing up spring practice with us and a week or two later he is at Ole Miss with Walton.

 

[Augusta_Jacket]

I can understand Walton going, but I would like to know the story on Stone. One week he is finishing up spring practice with us and a week or two later he is at Ole Miss with Walton.