Sugiura Says Bowl Game in 2015/16 "Not Going To Happen"

[GT1992]

But after we get the Bowl split from the other ACC teams in Bowl games don't we then come out ahead?

As I recall, the split occurs after expenses are deducted, so even though we share, every school is essentially encouraged to spend all the money.

 

[RonJohn]

But after we get the Bowl split from the other ACC teams in Bowl games don't we then come out ahead?

Yes we do. If you add the actual expenses associated with going to a bowl(travel, lodging, food, absorbed tickets) and subtract that from the expenses paid by the ACC(travel and absorbed ticket costs) it comes out negative. However, there is a revenue sharing deal for the teams in the ACC. You get a portion of the TOTAL bowl revenue that the ACC earns. GT gets a 1/14 share of not only a lower level bowl, but a 1/14 share of every bowl that an ACC team is in. If teams in the ACC decline to go to bowls, it lowers the revenue of EVERY ACC team. It all has to do with accounting practices. Football teams show that they lose money on trips to bowl games, but that only counts direct costs and direct revenue. There is a better description here:

http://regressing.deadspin.com/teams-in-the-orange-bowl-dont-make-any-money-and-othe-1494130032

 

[ClydeBrick]

But after we get the Bowl split from the other ACC teams in Bowl games don't we then come out ahead?

A program gets their split of other team's bowls whether they go bowling or not. So they best way to ensure you "make" money during bowl season is to stay home. However if everyone stays home, everyone gets nothing.

From this page:

ACC

$50 million base to the conference
$6 million to the conference for FSU (Rose Bowl – CFP semifinal)
$27.5 million to the conference for Georgia Tech (Orange Bowl)
Total: $83.5 million to the conference

Conference distribution model: all bowl revenue is divided equally after expense allotments for the participating teams and is included in annual distribution along with other conference revenue. The only exception is Notre Dame (as it relates to football revenue), which is handled separately under a conference agreement that has not been made public.

Expense allotment = a predetermined amount of expenses, not spend all you want - we'll split what is left.

 

[Skeptic]

Wow! You know it's been a tough year when K.S. has us questioning each other's intelligence!!

Imagine how Paul Johnson feels every Saturday.

 

[reubenjet]

Yeah, last Saturday had to suck for him!

 

[RonJohn]

A program gets their split of other team's bowls whether they go bowling or not. So they best way to ensure you "make" money during bowl season is to stay home. However if everyone stays home, everyone gets nothing..

The article that I linked to it shows that VT accounting showed that they lost $420k going to the Orange Bowl in 2010-2011. However, only counting their share of the Orange Bowl money, they got $1.6 million. So their net profit(Orange Bowl only) was $1.2 million. For the lower tier bowls, the payout is not as high, so you might lose money. However, it is no where near as high as stated.

 

[Skeptic]

The article that I linked to it shows that VT accounting showed that they lost $420k going to the Orange Bowl in 2010-2011. However, only counting their share of the Orange Bowl money, they got $1.6 million. So their net profit(Orange Bowl only) was $1.2 million. For the lower tier bowls, the payout is not as high, so you might lose money. However, it is no where near as high as stated.

By focusing on profit/loss from any bowl game, the other reasons for a bowl trip are diminished or ignored, and with those considered the "loss" might better be seen as an investment, oversimplifying, kind of a grocery store loss leader to get folks into the aisles, or perhaps more apt, newspaper circulation that costs money but results in higher ad rates.

Increased admission requests, and I have never seen any bowl year in which the following class was not higher in applications than the previous, and from that the increased revenue from out-of-state students, for instance (hey, college is a business, seriously, and professors are sometimes rated on how many students register for their classes, particularly the el cheapo summer courses, which are essentially all profit), TV exposure and revenue, both at the game and the following season, as in GT starting out in 2015 to fizzle with the losses; and the reward factor, not just for the players where all the focus is, but the band and cheerleaders, pom pom squads, etc., which work and rehearse so hard all season, and various staff positions that get little notice.

Unfortunately-- in my opinion -- it also extends to unseemly large numbers of administrators and hangers on who never show up at a game but get a free bowl trip and all the parties. My view is no-shows when "their" team is battling for titles should be banned from celebrating, or they can do it at home. Then of course there is recruiting, itself a subjective measurement maybe, but it doesn't take much to convince me that Tech's '14 success and the OB mashup helped immensely to eliminate any defections from the spring's recruiting class.

I am not arguing that a deficit of $400,000 for a bowl is insignificant. Just that you cannot make that the litmus test. In that event, no decision is necessary at all: lose money, stay home. Next problem.

 

[RonJohn]

I am not arguing that a deficit of $400,000 for a bowl is insignificant. Just that you cannot make that the litmus test. In that event, no decision is necessary at all: lose money, stay home. Next problem.

The point I was trying to make is that the "significant loses" are the only effect of creative accounting. VT showed a $420k loss, however going by their share of the Orange Bowl alone, they had a $1.2 million profit. If you go to the Sun Bowl, the share of the revenue is only about $140,000, so it would not cover a $420,000 deficit. However, if you don't go, every team in the ACC would lose the $140,000 that they would have gained had the team had gone. If three ACC teams decided not to go, you would lose more revenue than your loss for attending a low tier bowl.

As you pointed out, there are many advantages to going to a bowl game. The coaches would probably be willing to spend $400k to have an extra three weeks of practice. I have seen basketball teams decide not to go to a lower level basketball tournament, but I don't recall teams declining bowl games except for instances where they sit out to try to avoid NCAA sanctions later.

 

[UgaBlows]

Sometimes i wish Ken had a little homer in him and was a little less objective

 

[Supersizethatorder-mutt]

Sometimes i wish Ken had a little homer in him and was a little less objective

There are a few others who agree with you, but I like him just the way he is. Some of his articles this Fall have been very, very good, and he has proven he can cover the Jackets in a positive and factual manner without being a cheerleader. I like and respect him for that.

 

[swampsting]

Sometimes i wish Ken had a little homer in him and was a little less objective

If he did, he'd get pulled off the beat immediately.

 

[Skeptic]

The point I was trying to make is that the "significant loses" are the only effect of creative accounting. VT showed a $420k loss, however going by their share of the Orange Bowl alone, they had a $1.2 million profit. If you go to the Sun Bowl, the share of the revenue is only about $140,000, so it would not cover a $420,000 deficit. However, if you don't go, every team in the ACC would lose the $140,000 that they would have gained had the team had gone. If three ACC teams decided not to go, you would lose more revenue than your loss for attending a low tier bowl.

As you pointed out, there are many advantages to going to a bowl game. The coaches would probably be willing to spend $400k to have an extra three weeks of practice. I have seen basketball teams decide not to go to a lower level basketball tournament, but I don't recall teams declining bowl games except for instances where they sit out to try to avoid NCAA sanctions later.

The point about additional practices might be the best single reasons coaches like bowls. Even ahead of bonuses as hard as that is to believe. But it does give extra reps to the underclassmen while sliding the seniors out the door.