Retaining Players in the Portal Era

[LongforDodd]

Harrison Moore and Graham Knowles

Ah, yes. That’s it. Graham Knowles. Thanks

 

[FlatsLander]

Why?

Singleton posted a Tech is Home at the end of 2023.

 

[vamosjackets]

Graduation rate increasing, by itself, doesn’t tell you anything about watering down fields.

Graduation rates increasing by lowering graduation standards does water stuff down.

Graduation rates increasing by being better at teaching and supporting students improves the overall talent base in a field.

Of course, many schools do it by the former approach. But let’s not react by romanticizing the shaft and assuming teaching skills and support skills are irrelevant. We should want to produce more skilled graduates, it’ll be good for all of us in the long run.

In the era of "online classes", "distance learning", "alternative assessments", drastically more transfers in and out of institutions, etc. Which one of these two options do you think is more likely?

 

[g0lftime]

In the era of "online classes", "distance learning", "alternative assessments", drastically more transfers in and out of institutions, etc. Which one of these two options do you think is more likely?

Joe Burrow said all his classes were online his senior year at LSU. Never had to go on campus.

 

[cpf2001]

In the era of "online classes", "distance learning", "alternative assessments", drastically more transfers in and out of institutions, etc. Which one of these two options do you think is more likely?

We were talking about GT’s graduation rate. And GT certainly does have a lot of online classes and programs. So do you think a GT degree isn’t worth as much anymore?

Or is GT just less run by *******s?

 

[Randy Carson]

In the era of "online classes", "distance learning", "alternative assessments", drastically more transfers in and out of institutions, etc. Which one of these two options do you think is more likely?

Joe Burrow said all his classes were online his senior year at LSU. Never had to go on campus.

Around '79 or '80, I had switched from ME to IM, and I was sitting in my first economics class. The professor handed out the syllabus and said that our grade would be based upon a mid-term and a final. No class participation was required.

I read the book and only went back to that classroom twice. Once for the mid-term and once for the final.

Pretty sure I got an A...but don't hold me to it.

 

[GoldZ]

In the era of "online classes", "distance learning", "alternative assessments", drastically more transfers in and out of institutions, etc. Which one of these two options do you think is more likely?

This sheds light on things that most over 50 have known for years. It started in the 60s and hasn't let up. Those under 50 haven't seen both sides to know.

Colleges and the Dumbing Down of America — Minding The Campus

For decades, international testing data have shown that the United States, for all its leadership in technological innovation and economic success, has been, at best, so-so in teaching fundamental knowledge to young Americans. Moreover, the situation appears to have worsened, aggravated by the...

www.mindingthecampus.org

 

[stinger78]

This sheds light on things that most over 50 have known for years. It started in the 60s and hasn't let up. Those under 50 haven't seen both sides to know.

Colleges and the Dumbing Down of America — Minding The Campus

For decades, international testing data have shown that the United States, for all its leadership in technological innovation and economic success, has been, at best, so-so in teaching fundamental knowledge to young Americans. Moreover, the situation appears to have worsened, aggravated by the...

www.mindingthecampus.org

This began with creating multiple standards for “success” based on social outcomes rather than educational ones.

As in all pursuits, when a PhD has to produce “original” work, at some point that work can cross from fact to fantasy. This is particularly true in the social sciences where there tends to be a lot of subjectivism.

IMPO, a lot of “original” research in education the last 40-50 years has been and is pure baloney.

 

[Vespidae]

We were talking about GT’s graduation rate. And GT certainly does have a lot of online classes and programs. So do you think a GT degree isn’t worth as much anymore?

Or is GT just less run by *******s?

Hard to say. After Covid, there was a requirement (speaking for myself) that all classes have to be enabled for remote access … just in case.

So every class, even live classes, are on video which is either distributed live or archived so students take can view later. Content is also available digitally. There aren’t books anymore.

Now, instructors CAN require live attendance. I do. In fact, if a student misses more than two classes for any reason (excused or not), that student receives an Incomplete. Three or more is an F.

Some classes are just better online (volume course, usually an elective), others not so much.

 

[g0lftime]

Hard to say. After Covid, there was a requirement (speaking for myself) that all classes have to be enabled for remote access … just in case.

So every class, even live classes, are on video which is either distributed live or archived so students take can view later. Content is also available digitally. There aren’t books anymore.

Now, instructors CAN require live attendance. I do. In fact, if a student misses more than two classes for any reason (excused or not), that student receives an Incomplete. Three or more is an F.

Some classes are just better online (volume course, usually an elective), others not so much.

When I was at GT physics required 3 quarters of class work. It was later changed to 2 quarters and it was some sort of self study booklet. I was not familiar with the good nor bad of it but it seemed very different from the prior requirements.
That was in the early 70's. Several requirements changed around that time. Foreign language, technical writing and public speaking were dropped from the catalog. Number of quarter hours were reduced for graduation. Not sure when drownproofing was dropped but likely when more co-Ed's started enrolling.
Cabrera told me last year at an alum function that Tech is harder to get into now but easier to get out. It was a handful when I was there plus Vietnam draft hanging over us.

 

[Vespidae]

Cabrera told me last year at an alum function that Tech is harder to get into now but easier to get out. It was a handful when I was there plus Vietnam draft hanging over us.

I think you are exactly right. It’s harder to get into, but nobody drops out.

This however, is my pet peeve. It is now the practice to let students drop a class up to the day of the final. Why? The school earns the full tuition AND the student is guaranteed a high GPA. Not a good practice IMO.

 

[g0lftime]

I think you are exactly right. It’s harder to get into, but nobody drops out.

This however, is my pet peeve. It is now the practice to let students drop a class up to the day of the final. Why? The school earns the full tuition AND the student is guaranteed a high GPA. Not a good practice IMO.

I think they drop F's if repeated and passed. Back in the 60's abd 70's the majority of Tech students had failed at least one class and it stayed on your transcript.

 

[Vespidae]

I think they drop F's if repeated and passed. Back in the 60's abd 70's the majority of Tech students had failed at least one class and it stayed on your transcript.

I don’t think that’s the case anymore. I just processed a drop AFTER the student failed the final and the course. Again, it’s about the money.

If I could change anything, it would be to prohibit drops after the tenth day.

 

[g0lftime]

I don’t think that’s the case anymore. I just processed a drop AFTER the student failed the final and the course. Again, it’s about the money.

If I could change anything, it would be to prohibit drops after the tenth day.

It may be that freshmen could replace an F. It sure wasn't that way at all when I was there. Maybe they changed the policy again.

 

[forensicbuzz]

I think they drop F's if repeated and passed. Back in the 60's abd 70's the majority of Tech students had failed at least one class and it stayed on your transcript.

They stayed on the transcript when I was there in the late 80's and early 90's. Also, some of my masters-level engineering classes were videotaped in the mid-90's. I used to go to the library and check them out when I did my MS while working full-time. Elastic-Plastic Fracture Mechanics was a bear.

 

[Vespidae]

It may be that freshmen could replace an F. It sure wasn't that way at all when I was there. Maybe they changed the policy again.

It doesn’t matter to me except that an F properly reflects the record.

 

[g0lftime]

They stayed on the transcript when I was there in the late 80's and early 90's. Also, some of my masters-level engineering classes were videotaped in the mid-90's. I used to go to the library and check them out when I did my MS while working full-time. Elastic-Plastic Fracture Mechanics was a bear.

May have been for freshmen classes only or even first semester only. I read it somewhere a while back. The school administration definitely got kinder and gentler between 1967 and 1971 (my Navy years) which I attribute to Vietnam affecting our entire societal attitudes.

 

[forensicbuzz]

It doesn’t matter to me except that an F properly reflects the record.

To me, I like Pass/Fail classes, with a failing grade being a representation of what would be an acceptable reflection of what percentage of the knowledge should be retained. I'm also a HUGE fan of open book and take-home tests. No one should have to memorize equations. I've worked in engineering for 35 years and NOT ONCE in my career have I EVER had to create a solution without my library of resources.

 

[cpf2001]

Open book (or at least extensive prof-provided study material) and/or take home are great ways to even things out a bit for the kids who aren’t in frats or other groups with bunches of word too.

 

[GoldZ]

Anyone who got out of GT with a degree but couldn’t get in to MIT or an Ivy is an example of the flaw with the “just flunk em” approach.

Those schools wash people out in high school. GT did it in college (still does, but to a lesser extent, with better support and higher entry requirements now).

That four year difference isn’t a hard and fast “this is the right point to flunk em” line. Nobody here would say it’s lowering standard to hire a GR grad instead of an Ivy grad.

But people on a Harvard or MIT forum might!

And people here might say hiring someone with a TAMU degree is. Neither is correct.

Harvard's Business School has a long track record of accepting a high % of GT grads into their MBA program, including my sorry arse. Tech was much much harder than Harvard's MBA program.