Offensive and Defensive coordinators

[danny daniel]

How are you so sure its the OC’s calls and not the players failing to execute the plays?

You cannot always tell on pass plays but on something like second and one and he calls a pass for 4 yards (incomplete), that is a call. Gimmicks and shotguns on the goal line are calls.

 

[slugboy]

We should break down some game film on offense before we decide what we think about the offensive game plan.


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[UgaBlows]

You cannot always tell on pass plays but on something like second and one and he calls a pass for 4 yards (incomplete), that is a call. Gimmicks and shotguns on the goal line are calls.

What is wrong with a 4 yard pass when its 2nd and 1? I’m with you on gimmick plays like that swinging gate crap, I hate that garbage, it’s like admitting that you compete.

 

[danny daniel]

What is wrong with a 4 yard pass when its 2nd and 1? I’m with you on gimmick plays like that swinging gate crap, I hate that garbage, it’s like admitting that you compete.

I generally do not like 4 yard passes because of risk/reward. (first one was incomplete and stopped our drive. Second one was caught and fumbled for a turnover) A long pass in that situation may be worth the risk. I prefer to get the first down and then do whatever on the next play first down. I got use to us making short yardage, moving the chains, and scoring at a high percentage in the red zone. That helps you win. So far this O does not appear to be going in that direction.

 

[laoh]

Why are you guys so hung up on naming a starting QB? I remember Spurrier rotating Danny Wuerffel and can't remember the other dude's name, quite successfully back in the 90s.

 

[UgaBlows]

I generally do not like 4 yard passes because of risk/reward. (first one was incomplete and stopped our drive. Second one was caught and fumbled for a turnover) A long pass in that situation may be worth the risk. I prefer to get the first down and then do whatever on the next play first down. I got use to us making short yardage, moving the chains, and scoring at a high percentage in the red zone. That helps you win. So far this O does not appear to be going in that direction.

2nd and short, defense is expecting run, thats the perfect time for a pass. Our offense is a work in progress we need to pass at every opportunity to get better at it. Short completions build confidence. Warning this offense is Under construction, please be patient with our progress. Hell, Half of our fans are complaining that we promised pro-style passing and are not doing it enough, the other half want us to run more.

 

[slugboy]

Why are you guys so hung up on naming a starting QB? I remember Spurrier rotating Danny Wuerffel and can't remember the other dude's name, quite successfully back in the 90s.

Spurrier rotated a lot of QBs and was successful. Other teams have run the same plays we have and been successful, too. I’m watching pro teams run almost exclusively out of shotgun today.

After watching a couple of NFL games today, and a couple of NCAA games after our game, I’ve seen almost everything that’s been complained about on this forum done well as a key part of an effective offense. Except for the swinging gate play. And that’s just in the last two days.


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[BleedGoldNWhite21]

Why are you guys so hung up on naming a starting QB? I remember Spurrier rotating Danny Wuerffel and can't remember the other dude's name, quite successfully back in the 90s.

Was Spurrier also implementing an extremely different offense? I think the QB situation is only making the difficult transition on offense more difficult.

 

[slugboy]

Was Spurrier also implementing an extremely different offense? I think the QB situation is only making the difficult transition on offense more difficult.

His first years at Duke and at Florida? Yes.
Florida went from “2 yards and a cloud of dust” to “Fun and Gun”.

Spoiler

Technically it was “3 yards and a cloud of dust”. Somebody’s gonna correct me

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[UgaBlows]

His first years at Duke and at Florida? Yes.
Florida went from “2 yards and a cloud of dust” to “Fun and Gun”.

Spoiler

Technically it was “3 yards and a cloud of dust”. Somebody’s gonna correct me

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Well he was an “Evil Genius”

 

[LibertyTurns]

Was Spurrier also implementing an extremely different offense? I think the QB situation is only making the difficult transition on offense more difficult.

I don’t get all the angst about switching schemes. Every week’s a different game plan with different plays. Many are acting like we are asking the oil change dude to put the rag down at lunch and do brain surgery in the afternoon.

 

[forensicbuzz]

All I know is that there was only 1 QB that lead the Team down on two scoring Drives.... Tobias Oliver (the first one they pulled TO and let LJ hand the ball off to JP)

I think they better decide on 1 QB before they start ACC play as it (3 headed Qb) will not work agaisnt P5 Defenses!

you say that, but that doesn't make it true.

 

[MWBATL]

I go along with Clemson being really really good, but I don't think USF is as bad as some think.

Wisconsin says hello.

 

[slugboy]

I understand a lot of the frustration, and I’m certainly not a modern offensive or defensive guru, but I think some criticisms make sense to me and some don’t

(1) Regarding platooning QBs when “drastically” changing schemes: Johnson did that his first year. Shaw understood the system better than Nesbitt, but Nesbitt was tougher. He didn’t platoon 3 QBs, but he didn’t HAVE 3 QBs. If you remember the Gardner Webb game, you saw what happened when he got down to his third QB. We have the luxury of three QBs who can contribute.

Patenaude would love for one of them to take the next step and play head and shoulders above the rest—the only way that’s going to happen is to play them and see which one of them actually does separate themselves. So, we’ll have to platoon for now. Maybe for the entire season.

(2) We “don’t have the players for this system”. We swapped to a new strength and conditioning plan in late December/Early January. We had 7 or 8 months to catch up to what other teams have been doing for years. For our Sophomores, we’re about on an even footing with competitors, For upperclassmen, it’s going to take time to catch up.

The last time we made a transition, it took more than a season for our players to get into condition and for their responsibilities to become natural to them.

We’ve made uneven progress in training our players up for their new responsibilities. On defense, tackling has improved considerably, and I’m really happy there. The secondary has matured as quickly as I could hope.

I saw great things out of the defensive line yesterday.

There were still (as far as I can tell) problems with linebackers making reads. I would have hoped that would be a quick fix. I’m not sure how long that should take to fix, but I’m hoping it’s soon.

On offense, our passing mechanics seem to be getting better, but they’re not good yet. Some of our passes are still late, and some still inaccurate. We have open receivers, but we don’t see them. This is an area I hoped to see progress faster. We need to keep working on it, but until we get better, we’ll need to be more run-heavy if we want to score

For offensive blocking, I don’t think we’re doing a good job yet. Run blocking is OK, but in pass blocking I understand we’re don’t have our hips facing the right way and we’re not getting in the right positions. We’re in a position to get beat, and we’re not giving a lot of time to throw. This is also an area where I’d hoped for more progress.

(3) “Patenaude isn’t adapting his offense for the players he has.” I’m seeing the opposite. He’s run-heavy and using option because his players are comfortable blocking for it and making those reads. He’s giving TO and other quarterbacks high-percentage passes to build their skills and confidence (they’re mostly not getting the high completion percentages they should).

(4) We don’t have an “offensive identity” yet. I’m not sure what this phrase means—it’s vague. If it means “we don’t run this offense well yet”, then (a) that’s something else entirely and (b) we can talk about why.

If it means “the plays we called are bad because they didn’t work”, then I don’t know what to make of the comment at all. I think the answer to that is back in (2).

If it means that we “can’t impose our will on the other team” or “we don’t have a rhythm” and “we’re losing momentum”, those are the phrases I heard from coaches that were always just gibberish to me.

I know that coaches talk to reporters about “offensive identity”, but coaches say a lot of meaningless stuff to reporters.

(5) “We shouldn’t run a shotgun in 3rd and 2”. While I’ve watched a lot of teams do really well in a shotgun in 3rd and 2, I totally get taking a snap under center and being able to make a quick handoff. Maybe we don’t want our center to have to do too many things.


Short version: I haven’t seen a really good critique of the play calling or the offensive (or defensive) system yet. The frustration I can understand from what I’ve seen so far is that we haven’t developed all the skills and techniques we need to be successful two games into the season.

I wouldn’t give Patenaude a hard time about his play calling, but I would ask him why it’s taking so long for his QBs to get comfortable making the right reads and throwing accurately. I’d want to know from Key why we’re having trouble building our pass protection skills.

Maybe this just takes more time to develop than I’m ready for.




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[LibertyTurns]

For offensive blocking, I don’t think we’re doing a good job yet. Run blocking is OK, but in pass blocking I understand we’re don’t have our hips facing the right way and we’re not getting in the right positions. We’re in a position to get beat, and we’re not giving a lot of time to throw. This is also an area where I’d hoped for more progress.


(4) We don’t have an “offensive identity” yet. I’m not sure what this phrase means—it’s vague. If it means “we don’t run this offense well yet”, then (a) that’s something else entirely and (b) we can talk about why.

*Two of our 5 OL, DeFoor & Southers are from Pro-Style passing programs. Why are they having difficulty pass blocking? You’d think the non-pass blockers would be the issue.

*Anyone have any OL stats regarding time before the QBs throws? They have to hold a block for 2.9 secs to be effective. It would be interesting to know how close we are or are not.

*On identity, I think this is where the hype got ahead of us. We said we’d be rolling out Pro-style & we got not quite Pro-style. I expected screens, passes to TE, slant routes, stretching the field, etc. We saw some yesterday. Hope we see more.

 

[33jacket]

I understand a lot of the frustration, and I’m certainly not a modern offensive or defensive guru, but I think some criticisms make sense to me and some don’t

(1) Regarding platooning QBs when “drastically” changing schemes: Johnson did that his first year. Shaw understood the system better than Nesbitt, but Nesbitt was tougher. He didn’t platoon 3 QBs, but he didn’t HAVE 3 QBs. If you remember the Gardner Webb game, you saw what happened when he got down to his third QB. We have the luxury of three QBs who can contribute.

Patenaude would love for one of them to take the next step and play head and shoulders above the rest—the only way that’s going to happen is to play them and see which one of them actually does separate themselves. So, we’ll have to platoon for now. Maybe for the entire season.

(2) We “don’t have the players for this system”. We swapped to a new strength and conditioning plan in late December/Early January. We had 7 or 8 months to catch up to what other teams have been doing for years. For our Sophomores, we’re about on an even footing with competitors, For upperclassmen, it’s going to take time to catch up.

The last time we made a transition, it took more than a season for our players to get into condition and for their responsibilities to become natural to them.

We’ve made uneven progress in training our players up for their new responsibilities. On defense, tackling has improved considerably, and I’m really happy there. The secondary has matured as quickly as I could hope.

I saw great things out of the defensive line yesterday.

There were still (as far as I can tell) problems with linebackers making reads. I would have hoped that would be a quick fix. I’m not sure how long that should take to fix, but I’m hoping it’s soon.

On offense, our passing mechanics seem to be getting better, but they’re not good yet. Some of our passes are still late, and some still inaccurate. We have open receivers, but we don’t see them. This is an area I hoped to see progress faster. We need to keep working on it, but until we get better, we’ll need to be more run-heavy if we want to score

For offensive blocking, I don’t think we’re doing a good job yet. Run blocking is OK, but in pass blocking I understand we’re don’t have our hips facing the right way and we’re not getting in the right positions. We’re in a position to get beat, and we’re not giving a lot of time to throw. This is also an area where I’d hoped for more progress.

(3) “Patenaude isn’t adapting his offense for the players he has.” I’m seeing the opposite. He’s run-heavy and using option because his players are comfortable blocking for it and making those reads. He’s giving TO and other quarterbacks high-percentage passes to build their skills and confidence (they’re mostly not getting the high completion percentages they should).

(4) We don’t have an “offensive identity” yet. I’m not sure what this phrase means—it’s vague. If it means “we don’t run this offense well yet”, then (a) that’s something else entirely and (b) we can talk about why.

If it means “the plays we called are bad because they didn’t work”, then I don’t know what to make of the comment at all. I think the answer to that is back in (2).

If it means that we “can’t impose our will on the other team” or “we don’t have a rhythm” and “we’re losing momentum”, those are the phrases I heard from coaches that were always just gibberish to me.

I know that coaches talk to reporters about “offensive identity”, but coaches say a lot of meaningless stuff to reporters.

(5) “We shouldn’t run a shotgun in 3rd and 2”. While I’ve watched a lot of teams do really well in a shotgun in 3rd and 2, I totally get taking a snap under center and being able to make a quick handoff. Maybe we don’t want our center to have to do too many things.


Short version: I haven’t seen a really good critique of the play calling or the offensive (or defensive) system yet. The frustration I can understand from what I’ve seen so far is that we haven’t developed all the skills and techniques we need to be successful two games into the season.

I wouldn’t give Patenaude a hard time about his play calling, but I would ask him why it’s taking so long for his QBs to get comfortable making the right reads and throwing accurately. I’d want to know from Key why we’re having trouble building our pass protection skills.

Maybe this just takes more time to develop than I’m ready for.




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Its taking so long for the qbs to get comfortable to throw because its an nfl read system. These guys have never done it. They have to make protection calls. Read the d. Get on the same page with the wr. And make sure the rb knows what to do. Then, the wr and rb have to read the same thing. Add in 3 qbs who haven’t done it period. Not even anything close to it. Throw in an Ol learning too. So. When u think you stink. We are thinking alot and its hard to play good like that.

Of course its going to take long. I mean this notion that we can flip a switch is silly. This system is far more complex than the passing play may look for alot of the passes in the playbook

 

[knoxjacket]

Wisconsin says hello.

I’m not defending USF cause they suck (and sucked last year too) but Wisconsin is gonna be too 15 and will win the Big 10 West.

 

[GTFLETCH]

I understand a lot of the frustration, and I’m certainly not a modern offensive or defensive guru, but I think some criticisms make sense to me and some don’t

(1) Regarding platooning QBs when “drastically” changing schemes: Johnson did that his first year. Shaw understood the system better than Nesbitt, but Nesbitt was tougher. He didn’t platoon 3 QBs, but he didn’t HAVE 3 QBs. If you remember the Gardner Webb game, you saw what happened when he got down to his third QB. We have the luxury of three QBs who can contribute.

Patenaude would love for one of them to take the next step and play head and shoulders above the rest—the only way that’s going to happen is to play them and see which one of them actually does separate themselves. So, we’ll have to platoon for now. Maybe for the entire season.

(2) We “don’t have the players for this system”. We swapped to a new strength and conditioning plan in late December/Early January. We had 7 or 8 months to catch up to what other teams have been doing for years. For our Sophomores, we’re about on an even footing with competitors, For upperclassmen, it’s going to take time to catch up.

The last time we made a transition, it took more than a season for our players to get into condition and for their responsibilities to become natural to them.

We’ve made uneven progress in training our players up for their new responsibilities. On defense, tackling has improved considerably, and I’m really happy there. The secondary has matured as quickly as I could hope.

I saw great things out of the defensive line yesterday.

There were still (as far as I can tell) problems with linebackers making reads. I would have hoped that would be a quick fix. I’m not sure how long that should take to fix, but I’m hoping it’s soon.

On offense, our passing mechanics seem to be getting better, but they’re not good yet. Some of our passes are still late, and some still inaccurate. We have open receivers, but we don’t see them. This is an area I hoped to see progress faster. We need to keep working on it, but until we get better, we’ll need to be more run-heavy if we want to score

For offensive blocking, I don’t think we’re doing a good job yet. Run blocking is OK, but in pass blocking I understand we’re don’t have our hips facing the right way and we’re not getting in the right positions. We’re in a position to get beat, and we’re not giving a lot of time to throw. This is also an area where I’d hoped for more progress.

(3) “Patenaude isn’t adapting his offense for the players he has.” I’m seeing the opposite. He’s run-heavy and using option because his players are comfortable blocking for it and making those reads. He’s giving TO and other quarterbacks high-percentage passes to build their skills and confidence (they’re mostly not getting the high completion percentages they should).

(4) We don’t have an “offensive identity” yet. I’m not sure what this phrase means—it’s vague. If it means “we don’t run this offense well yet”, then (a) that’s something else entirely and (b) we can talk about why.

If it means “the plays we called are bad because they didn’t work”, then I don’t know what to make of the comment at all. I think the answer to that is back in (2).

If it means that we “can’t impose our will on the other team” or “we don’t have a rhythm” and “we’re losing momentum”, those are the phrases I heard from coaches that were always just gibberish to me.

I know that coaches talk to reporters about “offensive identity”, but coaches say a lot of meaningless stuff to reporters.

(5) “We shouldn’t run a shotgun in 3rd and 2”. While I’ve watched a lot of teams do really well in a shotgun in 3rd and 2, I totally get taking a snap under center and being able to make a quick handoff. Maybe we don’t want our center to have to do too many things.


Short version: I haven’t seen a really good critique of the play calling or the offensive (or defensive) system yet. The frustration I can understand from what I’ve seen so far is that we haven’t developed all the skills and techniques we need to be successful two games into the season.

I wouldn’t give Patenaude a hard time about his play calling, but I would ask him why it’s taking so long for his QBs to get comfortable making the right reads and throwing accurately. I’d want to know from Key why we’re having trouble building our pass protection skills.

Maybe this just takes more time to develop than I’m ready for.




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Spot ON... I thought DP was going to adapting his offense for the players he has... Bummer we might only win 2 games if true

 

[forensicbuzz]

*Two of our 5 OL, DeFoor & Southers are from Pro-Style passing programs. Why are they having difficulty pass blocking? You’d think the non-pass blockers would be the issue.

*Anyone have any OL stats regarding time before the QBs throws? They have to hold a block for 2.9 secs to be effective. It would be interesting to know how close we are or are not.

*On identity, I think this is where the hype got ahead of us. We said we’d be rolling out Pro-style & we got not quite Pro-style. I expected screens, passes to TE, slant routes, stretching the field, etc. We saw some yesterday. Hope we see more.

Disagree with the highlighted section 100%. What we are doing is 100% "pro-style." Pre-snap reads, route trees, blocking schemes, etc. are all absolutely "pro-style." The fact that we're not passing and still running options is what has people saying we jumped the scratch on the "pro-style" offense.

 

[forensicbuzz]

Spot ON... I thought DP was going to adapting his offense for the players he has... Bummer we might only win 2 games if true

I'm still more bullish than bearish with regards to total wins. I think the progression is going to be there and we'll win more than we lose.

I think we go into Duke 4-1 (3-2 at worst) and 7-1 or 6-2 into UVA. I like our chances against ViPiSU, and thus I can see us seriously contending for a spot in Charlotte.

We've got a long way to go to be good enough to do what I've suggested, but I think we can do that. Until we lose, I'm always going to think we're going to win.