Mostly “Fire Geoff Collins”, some reminiscing, maybe bourbon or other distractions

[InsideLB]

If you look at it rationally, there is no way GT will fire Collins while he is in the 'fully guaranteed' part of his contract. Which also means fans thinking he might be fired if he starts slowly next year are likely wrong. The difference between firing him after say 4 games vs firing him after the season ends next year is around $4.5M. For that much money you you grit your teeth and wait 3 months.

IIRC Collins' contract was set up the way it was because of the expectations of both T Stan and Collins that it was going to take awhile to build the program they way they wanted.

Based on the roster I expected 3-4 wins this season. After we grabbed a bunch of good looking players in the portal I upgraded that to 4-5 wins. The media picked us to finish right where it finished—2nd to last in the coastal.

What I'm hoping is that we as fans are just being very impatient. However I have grave concerns about gameday coaching/getting things fixed that are broken (e.g. not giving up long pass after long pass). But I guess the contract will work as designed and we will either get something acceptable or not.

 

[Oldgoldandwhite]

IIRC Collins' contract was set up the way it was because of the expectations of both T Stan and Collins that it was going to take awhile to build the program they way they wanted.

That’s what scares me.

 

[InsideLB]

Praying that TStan was prescient. IMO some course correction is needed regarding gameday coaching/game planning.

Here is from when he was hired:

"What Collins does have, though, is something that few FBS coaches have in their first deal with a school – a seven-year term. The other six power-conference hires in this hiring cycle (as of Monday) were reported to have received either five- or six-year contracts. Of the other 13 current ACC coaches, the 10 whose initial contract lengths could be found online all started with contracts of either five or six years. Last year, Jimbo Fisher and Scott Frost were hired at Texas A&M and Nebraska, respectively, with 10- and seven-year deals with salaries that likely blow Collins’ out of the water.

Stansbury told the AJC that he did it because of his belief that shifting the offense and its personnel away from Johnson’s option offense will take time. Tech’s roster, for instance, has 16 running backs (including walk-ons) and no tight ends. (Johnson’s offense doesn’t use a tight end.) By comparison, the Temple roster that Collins assembled for the past two seasons has eight running backs and fullbacks and seven tight ends. A seven-year deal shows Stansbury’s commitment to invest in Collins for the long term.
“So that’s something I talked to (school president G.P. “Bud” Peterson) about early on, was I really felt like we needed to give the new head coach a seven-year contract, knowing that it was going to take a couple of years really to probably transition to whatever systems that they were ultimately going to want to run,” Stansbury said."

 

[InsideLB]

That’s what scares me.

Yup. You choose a dog and you are stuck with them.

 

[okiemon]

This is according to Ken Sugiura in the AJC earlier today (if true, I’m even more confused and/or surprised):

“Still, while the return was expected, it was not necessarily a given. Stansbury did have at his disposal the resources to make a change if he decided it was necessary, according to a person familiar with the situation.

That meant that high-level donors had enough concern about the state of the team that they were willing to foot the bill for a buyout that would have cost $10.5 million, according to the terms of his memorandum of understanding. (The total drops to $7.2 million after the 2022 season by the terms of the aforementioned agreement.)”

 

[Pointer]

IIRC Collins' contract was set up the way it was because of the expectations of both T Stan and Collins that it was going to take awhile to build the program they way they wanted.

Based on the roster I expected 3-4 wins this season. After we grabbed a bunch of good looking players in the portal I upgraded that to 4-5 wins. The media picked us to finish right where it finished—2nd to last in the coastal.

What I'm hoping is that we as fans are just being very impatient. However I have grave concerns about gameday coaching/getting things fixed that are broken (e.g. not giving up long pass after long pass). But I guess the contract will work as designed and we will either get something acceptable or not.

That is indeed how it was setup. And hopefully it can still work out that way and turn this thing around.

I just think many who guessed 3-4 wins at the beginning of the season did so because of the perceived top 5(or whatever) SOS. Seeing as how the schedule was actually infinitely more manageable, it kind of makes that point moot.

Still, weather some of us like it or not, they will get another season.

I still maintain that CGC knows a ton about defense and I really find it hard to believe that he would field such a terrible unit. I think the lack of resources here have forced the staff to focus more on recruiting and less on actual coaching, in order to setup their current successful class and the second year's. If we as Tech really want to go down the recruiting and talent route, the only way it will work for CGC is if more recruiting resources are put in place (even more so then the upgrade he got when he was hired, cause the last regime did not enjoy the same resources).

I would prioritize that over firing coordinators. If we want to go about this smartly and stay the course, I truly believe this is the route.

That being said, my personal preference (until CGC proves he can be a good HC) is to get Monken in here, let him run whatever offense and defense he wants, but maintain the recruiting resources/add to them. I think people would be pleasantly surprised at the talent we can lure in here. Couple the fact that Monken is also not married to the 3O and has allegedly claimed willingness to change offenses if necessary. Look at the 09 and 10 classes when PJ had proper funding. They were decent classes and paid off in the 2014 team (also had a 4* DT commit JC Lanier who covered to OL, but nonetheless, a 4* DT commit).

All that to say, don't fire coordinators in the off season. Hire more PR/Marketing/Recruiting guys to free up the coaches to actually... You know... Coach. That way we don't have a drop off in recruiting as well.

 

[Pointer]

This is according to Ken Sugiura in the AJC earlier today (if true, I’m even more confused and/or surprised):

“Still, while the return was expected, it was not necessarily a given. Stansbury did have at his disposal the resources to make a change if he decided it was necessary, according to a person familiar with the situation.

That meant that high-level donors had enough concern about the state of the team that they were willing to foot the bill for a buyout that would have cost $10.5 million, according to the terms of his memorandum of understanding. (The total drops to $7.2 million after the 2022 season by the terms of the aforementioned agreement.)”

I would hope and guess that TStan is giving CGC one final year and hope he's making it clear. If that's the case, it's a smart move as it increases the budget for a bigger hire if necessary next year, but also gives his guy a chance to turn it around. Plus there's lots of other openings right now and as much as some of y'all don't want to hear this, Tech is less attractive now, then when PJ retired. If CGC gets 6 wins next year, I'd let him go and the job suddenly doesn't look like such a dumpster fire. To me if CGC gets 8 or more wins, maybe he's on to something and it all clicks next year.

Either way, hope this is TStan playing the smart game. Taking a chance, but hedging his bet.

 

[JacketOff]

I would hope and guess that TStan is giving CGC one final year and hope he's making it clear. If that's the case, it's a smart move as it increases the budget for a bigger hire if necessary next year, but also gives his guy a chance to turn it around. Plus there's lots of other openings right now and as much as some of y'all don't want to hear this, Tech is less attractive now, then when PJ retired. If CGC gets 6 wins next year, I'd let him go and the job suddenly doesn't look like such a dumpster fire. To me if CGC gets 8 or more wins, maybe he's on to something and it all clicks next year.

Either way, hope this is TStan playing the smart game. Taking a chance, but hedging his bet.

I mostly agree, but I think 8 is a little steep for a retention requirement. I’d personally set the bar at a 7-5 regular season. The first 4 weeks of next year will tell us just about everything we need to know. Clemson will presumably be better and will be a tough game to win. Then we get a gimme game against WCU, and if that’s not a blowout it may be time to look elsewhere. We’ll be pretty evenly matched talent wise with Ole Miss, but they’ll be losing their QB to the NFL. They do have a freshman QB that was pretty highly rated with some good offers, but he will be playing in his first games unless they get a transfer to fill the spot. At home I’d like to win that game, or at the very least keep it close and have a chance to win. UCF in week 4 will determine everything for me. A team we’ll definitely have more talent than, and we played decent against in 2020. I know it’ll be on the road, but UCF isn’t the same team they were in 2017-18.

If we start next year 1-3 it’s time to cut ties. 2-2 we get to ride it out through the end of the year as that will be a pretty good sign, and we’d just need to go 4-3 against the Coastal and FSU to make a bowl which should be very manageable. And depending on how the year ends we could retain Geoff for one more year or make (hopefully) a more positive change. If we’re 3-1 after 4 weeks then Geoff is going to have a ton of support and hopefully things will be on their way up.

5 wins or less would be automatic firing
6-6 for me would be situational on retention
7-5 would more than likely be enough for me to want him to stay unless the year ended weird
8-4 would be definite retention

 

[LongforDodd]

I would hope and guess that TStan is giving CGC one final year and hope he's making it clear. If that's the case, it's a smart move as it increases the budget for a bigger hire if necessary next year, but also gives his guy a chance to turn it around. Plus there's lots of other openings right now and as much as some of y'all don't want to hear this, Tech is less attractive now, then when PJ retired. If CGC gets 6 wins next year, I'd let him go and the job suddenly doesn't look like such a dumpster fire. To me if CGC gets 8 or more wins, maybe he's on to something and it all clicks next year.

Either way, hope this is TStan playing the smart game. Taking a chance, but hedging his bet.

Who are we going to have on the O line next year? How many “starts” will be on the O line in our first game in 2022?

 

[gt02]

lol you ok buddy?

Remember when you were so hyped up on CGC?

Don’t feed the trolls.

 

[gt02]

That is indeed how it was setup. And hopefully it can still work out that way and turn this thing around.

I just think many who guessed 3-4 wins at the beginning of the season did so because of the perceived top 5(or whatever) SOS. Seeing as how the schedule was actually infinitely more manageable, it kind of makes that point moot.

Still, weather some of us like it or not, they will get another season.

I still maintain that CGC knows a ton about defense and I really find it hard to believe that he would field such a terrible unit. I think the lack of resources here have forced the staff to focus more on recruiting and less on actual coaching, in order to setup their current successful class and the second year's. If we as Tech really want to go down the recruiting and talent route, the only way it will work for CGC is if more recruiting resources are put in place (even more so then the upgrade he got when he was hired, cause the last regime did not enjoy the same resources).

I would prioritize that over firing coordinators. If we want to go about this smartly and stay the course, I truly believe this is the route.

That being said, my personal preference (until CGC proves he can be a good HC) is to get Monken in here, let him run whatever offense and defense he wants, but maintain the recruiting resources/add to them. I think people would be pleasantly surprised at the talent we can lure in here. Couple the fact that Monken is also not married to the 3O and has allegedly claimed willingness to change offenses if necessary. Look at the 09 and 10 classes when PJ had proper funding. They were decent classes and paid off in the 2014 team (also had a 4* DT commit JC Lanier who covered to OL, but nonetheless, a 4* DT commit).

All that to say, don't fire coordinators in the off season. Hire more PR/Marketing/Recruiting guys to free up the coaches to actually... You know... Coach. That way we don't have a drop off in recruiting as well.

I agree that CGC knows defense. Or at least he has been successful in coaching defenses. That’s why I don’t think it is a scheme issue but a culture issue. No one teaches schemes that lets WRs run wide open three times a game. But they do instill a culture that is more geared towards showmanship and big plays than discipline and that’s what happens.

 

[wvGT11]

This is according to Ken Sugiura in the AJC earlier today (if true, I’m even more confused and/or surprised):

“Still, while the return was expected, it was not necessarily a given. Stansbury did have at his disposal the resources to make a change if he decided it was necessary, according to a person familiar with the situation.

That meant that high-level donors had enough concern about the state of the team that they were willing to foot the bill for a buyout that would have cost $10.5 million, according to the terms of his memorandum of understanding. (The total drops to $7.2 million after the 2022 season by the terms of the aforementioned agreement.)”

I hope we're using some of that money towards better coordinators or assistants at the very least. Collins is pretty much on a life raft with the fan base , maybe not with Tstan.
He has one more season to get this right or he's done.
I really doubt next year is going to see a jump in attendance unless Collins wins a big time game for us.

 

[THWG]

I mostly agree, but I think 8 is a little steep for a retention requirement. I’d personally set the bar at a 7-5 regular season. The first 4 weeks of next year will tell us just about everything we need to know. Clemson will presumably be better and will be a tough game to win. Then we get a gimme game against WCU, and if that’s not a blowout it may be time to look elsewhere. We’ll be pretty evenly matched talent wise with Ole Miss, but they’ll be losing their QB to the NFL. They do have a freshman QB that was pretty highly rated with some good offers, but he will be playing in his first games unless they get a transfer to fill the spot. At home I’d like to win that game, or at the very least keep it close and have a chance to win. UCF in week 4 will determine everything for me. A team we’ll definitely have more talent than, and we played decent against in 2020. I know it’ll be on the road, but UCF isn’t the same team they were in 2017-18.

If we start next year 1-3 it’s time to cut ties. 2-2 we get to ride it out through the end of the year as that will be a pretty good sign, and we’d just need to go 4-3 against the Coastal and FSU to make a bowl which should be very manageable. And depending on how the year ends we could retain Geoff for one more year or make (hopefully) a more positive change. If we’re 3-1 after 4 weeks then Geoff is going to have a ton of support and hopefully things will be on their way up.

5 wins or less would be automatic firing
6-6 for me would be situational on retention
7-5 would more than likely be enough for me to want him to stay unless the year ended weird
8-4 would be definite retention

This is my thinking as well. The first 4 games next year will tell us what we need to do.

 

[okiemon]

I would hope and guess that TStan is giving CGC one final year and hope he's making it clear. If that's the case, it's a smart move as it increases the budget for a bigger hire if necessary next year, but also gives his guy a chance to turn it around. Plus there's lots of other openings right now and as much as some of y'all don't want to hear this, Tech is less attractive now, then when PJ retired. If CGC gets 6 wins next year, I'd let him go and the job suddenly doesn't look like such a dumpster fire. To me if CGC gets 8 or more wins, maybe he's on to something and it all clicks next year.

Either way, hope this is TStan playing the smart game. Taking a chance, but hedging his bet.

I mostly agree with you. But I was also surprised to read that TStan had enough committed money for a buyout this year.

 

[g0lftime]

Maybe he does have enough committed for a buyout this year. It also means the big money is not exactly content with what is happening and has lost patience. That makes the seat very hot next year.

 

[GT_05]

I’ve been watching body language the last 4 games or so and it isn’t great. Everyone looks bored.

I think everyone looks helpless, not bored. Our defense looks totally confused and I doubt there is much worse in sports than getting whipped on national TV and not having a clue how to stop it.

 

[SOWEGA Jacket]

In what world do some of you still believe Collins knows defense? How much data do you need? He road coat tails while an assistant. Once he became a head coach it all disappeared. I wonder why? Maybe because the coat tails at Miss St and Florida are gone. If the guy knew defense he wouldn’t have let this happen to his career. He is a dead coach walking and he, TStan, and all of us know it. He’s only being retained because of money not because there is faith in him. It’s just awkward. We will pay him because we can’t afford to fire him and he will stay because no one will pay him this much ever again. Its gonna be an odd 2 years.

 

[stech81]

I mostly agree with you. But I was also surprised to read that TStan had enough committed money for a buyout this year.

Then he needs to do it and not wait another year. Start pissing off the big money people he could be looking for a job.

 

[burdell151]

This is according to Ken Sugiura in the AJC earlier today (if true, I’m even more confused and/or surprised):

“Still, while the return was expected, it was not necessarily a given. Stansbury did have at his disposal the resources to make a change if he decided it was necessary, according to a person familiar with the situation.

That meant that high-level donors had enough concern about the state of the team that they were willing to foot the bill for a buyout that would have cost $10.5 million, according to the terms of his memorandum of understanding. (The total drops to $7.2 million after the 2022 season by the terms of the aforementioned agreement.)”

While Stansbury has said Collins is coming back, I don’t believe that can be 100% guaranteed if the money for a buyout is there. There’s one game left and if it’s as bad or worse than last week, well, things could get very interesting at 150 Bobby Dodd Way Saturday evening.

 

[Northeast Stinger]

In what world do some of you still believe Collins knows defense? How much data do you need? He road coat tails while an assistant. Once he became a head coach it all disappeared. I wonder why? Maybe because the coat tails at Miss St and Florida are gone. If the guy knew defense he wouldn’t have let this happen to his career. He is a dead coach walking and he, TStan, and all of us know it. He’s only being retained because of money not because there is faith in him. It’s just awkward. We will pay him because we can’t afford to fire him and he will stay because no one will pay him this much ever again. Its gonna be an odd 2 years.

I hope this isn’t true.