Moses Wright next year

[YlJacket]

Can you give a few examples? Not being sarcastic, I'm honestly curious.

Since this actually seems to be an issue I will point folks to the roster for the teams CJP talks about wanting to emulate in his "get old - stay old" strategy - ND and UVA and others.

ND seniors Colson and Matt Ferrell started slow as freshmen. Bonzi averaged 5 points in 12 min as a FR to 20 points as a SR. Ferrell started at 1 point in 4 min as a freshman to 18 as a SR.
For UVA Devon Hall started out at 1 point in 10 min and now averages about 12. Isiah Wilkins had about the same stats as a FR.

I won't claim that Wright (or Cole) are going to burst back on the scene as all ACC sophomores. Like Red I actually think it will be their JR year where we really see the jump. In reality the issue with these 2 this year compared to these other teams is we actually had to use them as rotation players. ND, UVA would redshirt a player like Moses and no one would be able to see the warts until they had time to smooth them out a fair amount. We didn't have that luxury and I hope folks don't go off the deep end thinking this is the finished product.

 

[iopjacket]

After getting into this discussion, I looked at his HS stats which included 41% 3 point shooting (I could not find the number of shot attempts). I know the college line is 12" further out and he is changing his shooting style, but that is an incredible drop in efficiency. Hopefully Moses can get his shooting mechanics worked out.

 

[GTbball2016]

Never, ever trust high school stats. I think I saw the great Ronnie Fields miss every 3 pointer he ever shot but Farragut said he shot 50% from 3

 

[Peacone36]

After getting into this discussion, I looked at his HS stats which included 41% 3 point shooting (I could not find the number of shot attempts). I know the college line is 12" further out and he is changing his shooting style, but that is an incredible drop in efficiency. Hopefully Moses can get his shooting mechanics worked out.

So was Chris Bolden

In HS it’s so different, in college the players close faster, they are bigger to get into you shot more, the crowds are typically louder and more raucous, you’re on television, the NBA scouts are in the stands.

IMHO your mechanics need to be perfect and repeatable in college. Moses just looks like a folded up lawn chair when he shoots, I think that’s a problem.

 

[lv20gt]

So was Chris Bolden

And he was a 30%+ shooter here. People are, rightfully imo, lamenting the loss of Q because he was able to stretch the floor from the 4 spot and he was about a 30% shooter as well. I don't think anyone's arguing that he'll be a 45% shooter for us. But to act like him shooting 6% on a fairly low sample size tells the entire story is weird to me. He's playing the 4. If he can be a 30+% shooter that really just takes open looks then he'll be good with what else he brings to the table.

 

[Silk3]

You dont have to be that good a shooter to shoot a decent percentage from 3 if your just taking wide open 3’s to keep the defense honest, on maybe 1-2 attempts a game.

 

[YlJacket]

Bonzi hit 14% from 3 as a freshman but improved to 30-40% as a JR/SR. But he only takes a couple per game. And it does keep the defense honest.

 

[tbglover]

Never, ever trust high school stats. I think I saw the great Ronnie Fields miss every 3 pointer he ever shot but Farragut said he shot 50% from 3

Fortunately for Fields at the time he didn't need a 3 point shot. Farragut may have counted the And 1's as 3 pointers

 

[RamblinRed]

There are basically 3 things you have to look at when projecting how well (and how quickly) a player can replicate HS 3-pt shooting at the college level.

The first is that the line is a foot deeper. So if a player is really having to use all their effort to make three's at a HS level they are going to have to add strength to hit it at the college level. This is actually one area that Curtis had an advantage in. He played in a prep league that used the college 3-pt line - Travis Jorgenson had as well.

Second, where is the player's release point. Do they have good form where they release high, from on top of the forehead, or is it more of a push shot. If it is the latter than the player will likely have to modify their shot in college. At the college level where first, schools are going to study film on you, and second, have bigger more athletic players that close out faster a low release point shot is harder to get off and more likely to be blocked. This is another area where Curtis' film stood out, he had a very high, very quick release pattern.

Third, the speed of the shooting motion. Some kids hit a high percentage in HS, but have a very slow motion - Chris Bolden was sort of like this. The problem here is once again defenses are much bigger and faster in college and you are less likely to get the shot off. Alot of players have to learn how to speed up their shot to be successful in college.

I didn't get to see any shooting video on Moses in HS so I had no idea how to know if Moses would be able to be a respectable 3-pt shooter in college, and how quickly. The only video i saw showed a kid with fantastic athleticism, but didn't really show off anything else.

It sounds like from those that saw him in person or on video that at the very least issues one and two were likely to have to be improved on in college, less sure on issue 3.
If Moses can become a 30% 3-pt shooter that would be enough imo. But it is a long ways from 6% to 30%. What gives me pause is that many of his threes were wide open with no defensive pressure and they were mostly not even close to going in.

As i think i mentioned before I would develop Moses as a slashing combo forward. I don't really see him asa pure 4. He looks very uncomfortable playing around the post. He looks most comfortable when he is on the move and slashing toward the basket.

Good news is he still has plenty of time (3 yrs) to develop.

 

[slugboy]

@RamblinRed - This may be the wrong thread, but at this point, what do you see as the starting 5 next year? And 2nd question, would it make sense for Wright to redshirt in year 2 (and is that feasible)?

PG - Alvarado
SG - Devoe
SF - Okogie
PF - Cole
C - AD

Either
G: Alvarado
G: Haywood (CGB)
F: Okogie
F: Cole/Wright
C: Gueye/Transfer? (What if Ogbonda gets healthy???)

Or
G: Alvarado
G: Haywood (CGB)
G: Phillips
F: Okogie
C/F: Gueye/Cole/Wright/Transfer

Not sure if we go 3-guard or not next year, at least some of the time. Haywood was one of our top five players last year. I'd be surprised to see him not start next year. Also expect to see a lot of Phillips. I think the second lineup could happen a good bit.

Rk              Player eFG%    3PAr  OBPM DBPM   BPM
1          Josh Okogie .475    .313   4.9  2.0   6.9
2          Ben Lammers .465    .031   0.1  5.5   5.6
3        Jose Alvarado .538    .489   3.3  0.9   4.2
4    Curtis Haywood II .524    .742   1.7  1.1   2.7
5      Abdoulaye Gueye .474    .072  -1.4  3.7   2.3
6       Tadric Jackson .487    .293   0.6 -0.6   0.0
7            Evan Cole .508    .349  -1.4  1.1  -0.3
8       Brandon Alston .443    .393  -0.9 -1.2  -2.1
9         Moses Wright .316    .272  -5.7  2.2  -3.6
10        Justin Moore .167    .222 -11.5  0.0 -11.4
11   Sylvester Ogbonda .600    .000 -13.6  2.0 -11.6
12        Malachi Rice .000    .000 -18.8 -1.8 -20.6
13         Avi Schafer .000    .000 -12.5 -9.8 -22.3
14                        Jon Brown -21.2 -2.2 -23.4
15         Evan Jester .000   1.000 -20.6 -9.6 -30.2

Provided by CBB at Sports Reference: View Original Table
Generated 3/10/2018.

 

[LargeFO]

^ Devoe says hi for some PT

 

[RamblinRed]

Little early but here is my best early guess.

Jose, Devoe, Josh and AD start in 4 of the 5 spots.
The fifth spot depends upon what the staff wants to start in.
If it is a big lineup then i'd go with Evan or the big they sign this spring.
If it is a small ball lineup then Okogie moves from 3 to 4 and one of Haywood or Phillips move into the starting lineup.

Much like Jose, I think Devoe starts from day 1. Due to his ballhandling and shooting ability (as well as size) you can play him anywhere from 1-3 though I think he will primarily play at the 1 and 2.

I pretty much expect GT to have 3 guards and 2 pretty solid ballhandlers on the floor at all times. (I see Jose and Devoe as Primary ballhandlers and Phillips and Haywood as secondary ballhandlers.)

 

[brandon_cox]

There are basically 3 things you have to look at when projecting how well (and how quickly) a player can replicate HS 3-pt shooting at the college level.

The first is that the line is a foot deeper. So if a player is really having to use all their effort to make three's at a HS level they are going to have to add strength to hit it at the college level. This is actually one area that Curtis had an advantage in. He played in a prep league that used the college 3-pt line - Travis Jorgenson had as well.

Second, where is the player's release point. Do they have good form where they release high, from on top of the forehead, or is it more of a push shot. If it is the latter than the player will likely have to modify their shot in college. At the college level where first, schools are going to study film on you, and second, have bigger more athletic players that close out faster a low release point shot is harder to get off and more likely to be blocked. This is another area where Curtis' film stood out, he had a very high, very quick release pattern.

Third, the speed of the shooting motion. Some kids hit a high percentage in HS, but have a very slow motion - Chris Bolden was sort of like this. The problem here is once again defenses are much bigger and faster in college and you are less likely to get the shot off. Alot of players have to learn how to speed up their shot to be successful in college.

I didn't get to see any shooting video on Moses in HS so I had no idea how to know if Moses would be able to be a respectable 3-pt shooter in college, and how quickly. The only video i saw showed a kid with fantastic athleticism, but didn't really show off anything else.

It sounds like from those that saw him in person or on video that at the very least issues one and two were likely to have to be improved on in college, less sure on issue 3.
If Moses can become a 30% 3-pt shooter that would be enough imo. But it is a long ways from 6% to 30%. What gives me pause is that many of his threes were wide open with no defensive pressure and they were mostly not even close to going in.

As i think i mentioned before I would develop Moses as a slashing combo forward. I don't really see him asa pure 4. He looks very uncomfortable playing around the post. He looks most comfortable when he is on the move and slashing toward the basket.

Good news is he still has plenty of time (3 yrs) to develop.

Based on these criteria, how would you rate the shots of the incoming freshman?

 

[slugboy]

^ Devoe says hi for some PT

Wouldn’t surprise me either way-I was just trying to guess “starters”, and I’m sure there will be surprises and changes in the season. I think it will be harder to start as a freshman next year.

On the other question, I’m coming around to the idea that we won’t see fifth year starters, so redshirts may not make much sense.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

 

[LargeFO]

I'd be shocked if Devoe doesn't play at least 20 minutes a game.

 

[jayparr]

I'd be shocked if Devoe doesn't play at least 20 minutes a game.

30 per!

 

[RamblinRed]

I'll be surprised if Devoe isn't playing at least 30 mpg.
i think it was Evan Daniels that commented he thought Devoe would be a starter and a top 3 scorer for GT as a FR.

 

[YlJacket]

Just as a follow up to the earlier discussion on Moses - UVA has 5 redshirt kids and 4 who played significant minutes tonight. Salt, Hall, Diakete and Hunter. Hunter is a Redshirt Freshman who scored 10 points tonight. If or rather when we have the program going the way we want - and anywhere near where UVA is now - we will redshirt any kid like Moses or Cole and we wouldn't see them until they have a year in the dungeon with the strength coach and a year working on things like release points.

 

[LargeFO]

I'll be surprised if Devoe isn't playing at least 30 mpg.
i think it was Evan Daniels that commented he thought Devoe would be a starter and a top 3 scorer for GT as a FR.

Error by me- post was meant to say 30 not 20.

 

[Peacone36]

Just as a follow up to the earlier discussion on Moses - UVA has 5 redshirt kids and 4 who played significant minutes tonight. Salt, Hall, Diakete and Hunter. Hunter is a Redshirt Freshman who scored 10 points tonight. If or rather when we have the program going the way we want - and anywhere near where UVA is now - we will redshirt any kid like Moses or Cole and we wouldn't see them until they have a year in the dungeon with the strength coach and a year working on things like release points.

Was wondering where you were headed with this and I liked where it ended up.

They also have another redshirt kid on the bench (I’m assuming the 5th kid) names Jay Huff who is going to be a MONSTER when/if he figures it out defensively