Hire Fast, Fire Slow?

[bobongo]

We can find the savior in the savings bin of wall mart who will have great success and just love the culture of GT so much he won't move on.

Yup. That'll work.

Well, it had better work because we don't have the money to shop at Harrod's.

 

[4shotB]

Well, it had better work because we don't have the money to shop at Harrod's.

There is nothing wrong with buying your suits at Walmart. Or Harrods. What makes most of the remaining GT fans unhappy is we want to have the tailored suits but pay WalMart prices. Most of those who have left here or the stadium have figured out what Gt wants. And their tastes are not aligned with those of our management. Our management is content with running a Dollar Tree and there is absolutely nothing in the world wrong with that.

 

[RonJohn]

There is nothing wrong with buying your suits at Walmart. Or Harrods. What makes most of the remaining GT fans unhappy is we want to have the tailored suits but pay WalMart prices. Most of those who have left here or the stadium have figured out what Gt wants. And their tastes are not aligned with those of our management. Our management is content with running a Dollar Tree and there is absolutely nothing in the world wrong with that.

I don't lay all, or even most of, the blame with management. If fans are unwilling to provide the funds, the GTAA has no other choice than to be bargain hunters. The school is limited in how much money it can provide to athletics, so the rest must come from fans.

 

[4shotB]

I don't lay all, or even most of, the blame with management. If fans are unwilling to provide the funds, the GTAA has no other choice than to be bargain hunters. The school is limited in how much money it can provide to athletics, so the rest must come from fans.

It's a chicken and egg situation. If the school management had been invested going back decades then we would have more fan support. But you can't fake it and expect to fool all of the fans. Some of us, yes. But the majority are voting with their feet and wallets.

 

[RonJohn]

It's a chicken and egg situation. If the school management had been invested going back decades then we would have more fan support. But you can't fake it and expect to fool all of the fans. Some of us, yes. But the majority are voting with their feet and wallets.

What I was pointing out is that "school" management is limited by law/regulation in what they can provide from a financial standpoint. The school and/or students fees can only provide a maximum of 10% of the budget for athletics. The other 90% is required to come from athletics. (tickets, merchandise, broadcast rights, donations, etc.) According to the last numbers I saw, the money from the school and student fees was very close to 10% of the overall budget. The broadcast rights are part of the contract with the ACC, and there isn't much that the GTAA can do to increase that revenue. The ONLY way to increase revenue for the GTAA is from fans/boosters. The GTAA cannot spend money that it doesn't have. (Unless they want to put athletics in several hundred millions of dollars worth of debt, oh wait...)

It has been a pet peeve of mine for a while that GT fans complain that GT athletics don't spend enough money, while at the same time complaining about ticket prices, concessions prices, merchandise prices, etc. I am afraid that boosters are going to have to step up next year or GT football will just regress even more. I think that ticket revenue is going to decrease by a large amount next year. Unless CGC is able to turn things around, GT will have less revenue to work with and have to pay both a buyout and a new coach.

 

[Vespidae]

I am afraid that boosters are going to have to step up next year or GT football will just regress even more

You are correct. Tech has "reasonable" revenue but as I recall, a lot of long-term debt as well. If Tennessee wants a new facility, BOOM - the Haslams write $100 million check. Tech will never raise money like that but ... needs to improve while also being better stewards of the resources they do have.

 

[Skeptic]

Not sure what Doren being at NIU nearly a decade ago has to do with anything other than yet another cheap shot with no point.

Anyways, Doren has a 56.6% winning % at NCSU and has never won the division much less the conference. He's slightly out performing what we had with Chan Gailey and it got him paid 5 mil a year after the second time finishing ranked in 9 years there. Like I said, even if we went bargain bin hunting and struck well, we'd still have pay to keep.

Also were nay coaches hired this year similar to Doren when he was hired out of NIU? Successful stint at a lower level program? Maybe from a place like Louisiana? Wonder what that type of coach commanded in terms of salary.

Doeren got the extension because a) he does seem to have solid teams every, and b) in 2031 State beat Clemson in two OTs, I think. Good coach, sour disposition.

 

[Randy Carson]

I don't lay all, or even most of, the blame with management. If fans are unwilling to provide the funds, the GTAA has no other choice than to be bargain hunters. The school is limited in how much money it can provide to athletics, so the rest must come from fans.

It's a chicken and egg situation. If the school management had been invested going back decades then we would have more fan support. But you can't fake it and expect to fool all of the fans. Some of us, yes. But the majority are voting with their feet and wallets.

An individual or group comes up with a bright idea for a new product. It's a struggle to take it to market, but a few folks are convinced to invest some seed money, and the company begins to grow. With hard work, luck and market acceptance, the product and the company are a success. As a result, the initial investors are hugely rewarded while the consumers benefit from use of the product - even a product that they didn't know they needed before it appeared.

Applying this to our situation, if the AA wants to succeed, then it needs to find some venture capitalists willing to put up the NECESSARY money required to succeed. Money for facilities, coaches, marketing, etc. Those funds are not going to come from ticket sales to the buying public which has lost faith in the management team. That would be putting the cart before the horse. A good product on the field would translate into butts in the stands and it becomes self-sustaining. AT. THAT. POINT. And not before.

If you build it, they will come. And in order to build it, you have to invest in all things necessary to produce a superlative product and create "raving fans".

You'd think that Tech's "money men" would understand this.

 

[Heisman's Ghost]

You didn't exactly mention age, but I kind of infer age from "grizzled" vet. Some have made comments in other threads about CGC being a young coach. He was 47 when he came to GT. CCG was 48 when he came to GT. CPJ was 50 when he came to GT. From an age standpoint, they were all almost the same.

EDIT: I went back and looked at CGOL, he was 48 or 49 when promoted to interim HC.

George is the one that I wonder about sometimes. I think that some big programs really missed the boat with him. Given the resources of say, Michigan, Penn State, or Clemson he would have won a national championship as a head coach.

 

[Heisman's Ghost]

You might want to brush up on your statistics. Average employee tenure in most F500 organizations is < 3 years. For executives, it's < 2. In the business I ran, turnover averaged 100% every 18 mos. Recruiting was a way of life, so was training. As my ME professor, S Peter Kezios said, "Identify the constraints and deal with them." One by one.

I was fortunate (or unfortunate) to have been involved in probably at least 20 different businesses in my 35 year career. Some large (very large), some small. Short cycle, long cycle. B2B, B2C. Every one of them said, "That stuff doesn't work here. We're different." Really? Setting a vision and goal for the organization doesn't work? Installing KPI's and dashboards? Installing feedback mechanisms and milestone checks? Looking at process and how functions support the long-term goal? Replacing underperforming personnel? Obviously, I disagreed.

One story illustrates this that IS sports. Gene Stallings, former head coach at Alabama, where he won the natty in 1992 ... was asked to what did he attribute his coaching style. Interestingly enough, he did NOT mention Bear Bryant, for whom he had served. No. It was Tom Landry and the Dallas Cowboys. Gene explained that Tom was an ENGINEER by training and set up a system with goals, objectives, KPI's, dashboards for players by position, week and trend. He said that ... is where he truly learned how to coach. And who learned from Gene? Dabo Swinney.

Flame all you want. But I don't see ANY organizational skills with Geoff and a barely modest amount with TStan. If Dabo were our coach (not likely), I'm sure the first thing he would do is install a management system. My two cents ...

He may not have mentioned the Bear for some good reasons having to do with how he was treated as a player. When he was an assistant at Alabama he famously told the Tide players in 1961: "...Tech players hit hard in the first quarter but they don't in the fourth quarter." In 1965, in his first head coaching job at Texas A&M, Stallings managed a big upset in whipping Tech. Dodd did not forget. In 1966, I witnessed with my parents the ONLY time I can recall Tech running up a score in the fourth quarter. Tech was playing A&M again and after a 3-3 tie at halftime had put the game away with a third and fourth quarter scoring explosion. With about a minute to play, Tech scored again and Dodd called for an onside kick which Tech recovered and wonders of wonders threw a long pass with just seconds to play for a final TD. I thought my father was going to have a heart attack. Everyone thought Dodd was a pushover...Bear Bryant knew better and after that game so did Gene Stallings.

 

[boger2337]

We can't compete with the money. We need to think outside the box.

We can compete. That's the problem. The money and people are there. They just don't care and don't give enough.

 

[bobongo]

We can compete. That's the problem. The money and people are there. They just don't care and don't give enough.

Well then, we won't compete with the money.

 

[Randy Carson]

Anyone want to Google the budgets of the athletic departments at Tech and UGA?

 

[bobongo]

Anyone want to Google the budgets of the athletic departments at Tech and UGA?

According to what I googled, Ugag just about doubles Tech in revenue, ~150,000,000 to ~75,000,000.

Ga. Tech Athletics Projecting $1.8M Surplus On $78.5M Revenue For '21

Georgia Tech's newest athletics budget update is projecting $78.5M in revenues this FY, and the department now projects a $1.8M surplus for the year, which would reduce the $13.6M deficit in the fund balance to $11.8M.

www.sportsbusinessjournal.com

JUST IN: UGA Approves $150 Million Budget for 2022

The University of Georgia has released its approved 2022 athletic budget with it coming in north of $150 million. The following statement was released by the

www.si.com

 

[Randy Carson]

That pretty much sums up the relative states of the programs. Any questions?

 

[RonJohn]

That pretty much sums up the relative states of the programs. Any questions?

I have stated this before in other discussions. The difference in conference revenue is close to $20 million. That means that even ignoring the ACC vs SEC argument, they pull in more than $50 million more than us in tickets/merchandise/donations/etc. Our entire budget is only a little bit higher than the difference that they bring in from those items. GT fans need to stop worrying about what the school does with money and what the big donors do with their money. GT fans need to start supporting GT athletics.

 

[Randy Carson]

I have stated this before in other discussions. The difference in conference revenue is close to $20 million. That means that even ignoring the ACC vs SEC argument, they pull in more than $50 million more than us in tickets/merchandise/donations/etc. Our entire budget is only a little bit higher than the difference that they bring in from those items. GT fans need to stop worrying about what the school does with money and what the big donors do with their money. GT fans need to start supporting GT athletics.

Build a better mou...football program, and the world will beat a path to your door.

 

[forensicbuzz]

George is the one that I wonder about sometimes. I think that some big programs really missed the boat with him. Given the resources of say, Michigan, Penn State, or Clemson he would have won a national championship as a head coach.

After the ND debacle, I don't think he ever had a chance with the big boys. Had he not fibbed on his CV, he might have made it big at ND.

 

[laoh]

I have thought about your question a bit before responding. While i would question the motives and intelligence of any one who would take this job, i reflected back on to myself in my younger days. Twice I took on tasks or jobs that people cautioned me not to take. I refused to listen because the advantages of being a young man is that you are full of p*** and vinegar. Everybody thinks they are superman at that age. That is why I tend to give Coach Collins a bit of empathy - I am convinced that he thought he was THE GUY. Didn't we all when we were his age? (this question will only make sense to those of us in our 'autumn" or 'winter" seasons in life).

PS...I am glad I accepted the challenges back then. Great learning experiences that helped me later on. And the fact that I accepted them gave me greater opportunities down the road. Playing it safe is for losers.

Um, Collins was 47 when he got hired.

 

[4shotB]

Um, Collins was 47 when he got hired.

I know. To some of us, that is young. Sadly enough.