Film Study GT vs UNC Def Breakdown

[Ibeeballin]

@dressedcheeseside whoa slow down on the apology tour. Schematically, we are still a Nickel base but there are things within the Defense we are doing a little different. Biggest 3 are: 1) Our cushion has shrunk by 2-3 yds 2) AJ has been a box Safety a lot more this year than past. 3) not bailing presnap


Remember, these are still the avg talent players that is currently 10th in the country in total D. We could say it’s the opponent, this same scheme struggled vs. GaSo, Mercer and made mediocre QBs look Elite

 

[dressedcheeseside]

@dressedcheeseside whoa slow down on the apology tour. Schematically, we are still a Nickel base but there are things within the Defense we are doing a little different. Biggest 3 are: 1) Our cushion has shrunk by 2-3 yds 2) AJ has been a box Safety a lot more this year than past. 3) not bailing presnap


Remember, these are still the avg talent players that is currently 10th in the country in total D. We could say it’s the opponent, this same scheme struggled vs. GaSo, Mercer and made mediocre QBs look Elite

OK, I get it. But those are tweeks, not wholesale scheme changes. The basic scheme is still the same. Is cushion depth really scheme change? If not, why the "nothing has really changed..." comment? Is it really the same scheme just ratcheted up to a more aggressive level?

All in all, I don't really care as long as we're better.

 

[InsideLB]

I said it in the defense thread....a lot of the improvement is just better fundamentals....tackling, getting off blocks, and covering more effectively, etc. We also appear to be fixing specific execution problems like defending the screen.

I do think you saw more slants and stunts vs UNC because we were executing them well. When it works you keep calling it. When it doesnt you simplify.

Now how you execute has a lot to do with the level of your competition. We will be sorely tested in the weeks to come. We need to keep working hard to get better. As IBB points out there is much more improvement to be made.

But at least we no longer make a bad or ho-hum offense look good. That's progress.

 

[dressedcheeseside]

I said it in the defense thread....a lot of the improvement is just better fundamentals....tackling, getting off blocks, and covering more effectively, etc.

Not to be his defense attorney, but this is exactly what PBR was saying.

 

[tech_wreck47]

Not to be his defense attorney, but this is exactly what PBR was saying.

I think by ibeballins video and comments make it obvious that its been more than just this. I'll agree those thing have gotten better, but all you have to do is turn the film on and see there are more slants, tighter coverage from the get go, and no back peddling at the snap.

 

[tech_wreck47]

I think we all need to give PBR an apology. I will, sorry man, you were right. Ibee totally backs up what you've been saying all along. I was actually on the talent vs scheme bandwagon originally and got convinced to switch sides by the grumbling masses with pitchforks and torches. Oh well.... here's the kicker:

Ibee: "To be honest, nothing has really changed..."

Hard to spin that one.

I'm just glad we're getting better results regardless of the reasons why. Players do improve throughout their careers. The same guy is often a much different/better player in his 4th year than he was in his first.

It could simply be the low level of competition so far. Boy, I sure hope not.

I think @Ibeeballin is saying scheme hasn't changed and we have done the same things we are doing now, just not as much. PBR if I'm not mistaken has said that everything is the same and it's just better execution. My opinion from the beginning is that it's the same scheme with a more aggressive play calling. Safeties playing up, tight coverage, no balling out at the snap, more stunts ect. I do agree they have gotten better fundamentally, but we have definitely changed up our approach in how we are playing teams or atleast how often we are doing things. I think playing more aggressive also allows guys not to think as much during a play, which allows the fundamentals to be better because they are not over thinking stuff. I've said it in the D thread. The players, CTR, and CPJ all deserve credit for how the D is playing. Hopefully the play from the D continues.

 

[Ibeeballin]

The question stemmed from whether our defensive woes were “Scheme vs. Talent” @PBR549 notion was scheme is not the problem, we just need better talent to execute the scheme”

Based what I’m seeing, tweaks have been made, but nothing major that make give a definitive answer and 8-9 of the same players that played on those 60th ranked defense are still there. So was there a drastic talent infusing replacing PJ/Gamble with Branch and Alexander? No

 

[dressedcheeseside]

The question stemmed from whether our defensive woes were “Scheme vs. Talent” @PBR549 notion was scheme is not the problem, we just need better talent to execute the scheme”

Based what I’m seeing, tweaks have been made, but nothing major that make give a definitive answer and 8-9 of the same players that played on those 60th ranked defense are still there. So was there a drastic talent infusing replacing PJ/Gamble with Branch and Alexander? No

Just because it’s mostly the same guys doesn’t mean the talent hasn’t improved. Each guy can easily be fundamentally better than they were last year.This could be due to better coaching or just plain ol’ maturation, or both.

 

[InsideLB]

My read is that this year we returned 8 of 11 guys on D, so this year we have a more veteran bunch. Thats going to help you play faster, know your assignments within the system better, and get things fixed more easily. If experience didnt matter no one would keep track of returning starters.

We shut down TN for a half before they found some stuff we couldnt handle. Screen and runs with draw action took advantage of aggression that lacked recognition and discipline. Quick throws to the perimeter exposed poor tackling.

It was a game we should have won anyway but didnt (too many mistakes in all 3 phases: 2 missed field goals, 2 fumbles lost, and a non-pitch on the 2-pt conversion).

Most teams show the most improvement between games 1 and 2. With JSU on short rest Pitt was most like game 2. We got a lot fixed on D as IBB points out. A lot fewer gaping holes, surer tackling, better communication, and shutting down the plays that were killing us.

The sort of adjustments you might expect from a veteran group. So is it talent or scheme? Sure sounds both to me.

 

[dressedcheeseside]

Another thing somebody noticed and AJ talked about in an interview is better communication pre-snap. That's not scheme change, just better fundamentals, experience and chemistry.

 

[iceeater1969]

The question stemmed from whether our defensive woes were “Scheme vs. Talent” @PBR549 notion was scheme is not the problem, we just need better talent to execute the scheme”

Based what I’m seeing, tweaks have been made, but nothing major that make give a definitive answer and 8-9 of the same players that played on those 60th ranked defense are still there. So was there a drastic talent infusing replacing PJ/Gamble with Branch and Alexander? No

Watching from field level, the dl IMO is firing off lower, w more force , and making a move to a gap much faster.

The biggest effect of this speed up is the lb don't take 2 wrong steps. Heck, they loik like they (dl and lb ) are running a coordinated defensive scheme ( which is what coaches have been asking for. )

What has clearly changed in the d b and safety is the pre snap movement. While this movement may be mostly eye candy, it does seem to give and extra read to the qb we've played to date. I would like to see more of this pre snap shifts (turn an loose= 2.5 sec to pass) with additional safety in line up.

Our front 7 are playing faster like p j said.
Like to see us try 8 occasionally

 

[InsideLB]

To add to my precious post, the defense I played on in college had one all-american DT and one all conference DT. Having domiment DL that make plays on their own is completely disruptive.

Venables first year at Clemson and Saban's first at Bama werent spectacular. Bring in a bumch of 4 & 5-star war daddy DL and suddenly you are cookin with grease.

I see our DL as improved as a unit, and with more depth and more of the quick-type DT that can slant hard and get there on stunts. We also have more threats than just Gamble to get to the QB.

We still dont have dominent rushers or guys you have to double every time, and imo we will likely struggle still to get pressure aga8minst the better O's.

 

[tech_wreck47]

The question stemmed from whether our defensive woes were “Scheme vs. Talent” @PBR549 notion was scheme is not the problem, we just need better talent to execute the scheme”

Based what I’m seeing, tweaks have been made, but nothing major that make give a definitive answer and 8-9 of the same players that played on those 60th ranked defense are still there. So was there a drastic talent infusing replacing PJ/Gamble with Branch and Alexander? No

Agree, IMO I think the more aggressive play calling has made a huge difference. I could be wrong, but it seems to me when you play "down hill" not bailing out, you're doing more slants ect it allows you to play faster and not necessarily think to much. It's kinda like riding a bike it's just second hand nature and that's why the guys are more fundamentally sound with tackling. When you arent playing down hill you can think to much which is never good IMO.

 

[Fatmike91]

In addition to what's been discussed, the other things that jump out at me are:

* Pressure from the front 4
* The overall play of AJ Gray

/

 

[Longestday]

@Ibeeballin I know that overall scheme has not changed as you have stated, but there has been changes as you have stated as well. I think the changes are understated.

I put forth that there has been some big changes with in the ?unchanged? nickel scheme.

• The cushion by itself is a huge change. Playing 8 yards off for CB and back peddling 2 safeties 15 yards back at snap is asking for underneath cuts to death.
• 3rd down play call is huge... don't call the stop the +20 yard plays when they only need 3 to 10 yards.
• The CB and nickel blitzs - unheard of in 2016
• The safety in the box - blitz or not - not often in 2016 all together
• Stunts and more of an attacking DL
• Do you remember seeing 2 LB trying to blitz through the same hole after letting everyone know what they were going to do... and both getting easily picked up by blockers - this has not happened in 2016
• Did you ever see a blitz canceled or changed in 2016 like 2017

I think a lot has changed and the players are also a year better. The players have said they went down in the number of plays. That is a big change.

This is more of a change in how the defense runs then the improvement in player ability.

 

[Whiskey_Clear]

The biggest difference between our good play thus far has been our play on the DL. Our guys controlled the line of scrimmage vs UNC and that's apparent in ballin's breakdown.

That allowed our backers to fill gaps and make plays. It allowed our corners to play tighter...at times (not every down). We were able to get some rush with 4 and when we did blitz we were able to do so sending one additional for the most part rather than everyone.

Our DBs aren't perfect but their play has improved imo and I think their experience is showing and will continue to....if.....our DL can continue to control the los. If / when they can't...everything behind them will appear to break down and the "scheme sucks" crowd will reappear in mass.

I've said for quite a while that our success, or lack thereof, is predicated on how well our DL performs. We will not dominate any of our remaining opponents on the DL outside of UVA (maybe). But I think the level of play on the DL has improved enough to allow us to compete against most. Just my opinion restated once again.

FWIW I believe PBR has similarly contended that our "deficit" on the DL has been our biggest issue the last several years.

Discipline and sound assignment ball at LB might be our biggest area for improvement at the moment. I'll let those with real football knowledge pass judgment there. But we are fairly young there still with Brant and Vic so that makes a bit of sense.

 

[dressedcheeseside]

The biggest difference between our good play thus far has been our play on the DL. Our guys controlled the line of scrimmage vs UNC and that's apparent in ballin's breakdown.

That allowed our backers to fill gaps and make plays. It allowed our corners to play tighter...at times (not every down). We were able to get some rush with 4 and when we did blitz we were able to do so sending one additional for the most part rather than everyone.

Our DBs aren't perfect but their play has improved imo and I think their experience is showing and will continue to....if.....our DL can continue to control the los. If / when they can't...everything behind them will appear to break down and the "scheme sucks" crowd will reappear in mass.

I've said for quite a while that our success, or lack thereof, is predicated on how well our DL performs. We will not dominate any of our remaining opponents on the DL outside of UVA (maybe). But I think the level of play on the DL has improved enough to allow us to compete against most. Just my opinion restated once again.

FWIW I believe PBR has similarly contended that our "deficit" on the DL has been our biggest issue the last several years.

Discipline and sound assignment ball at LB might be our biggest area for improvement at the moment. I'll let those with real football knowledge pass judgment there. But we are fairly young there still with Brant and Vic so that makes a bit of sense.

Speaking of the LB's, before the season, I fully expected one of the true freshman to break into the starting lineup. That has not happened. Not sure what that says especially that LB is our weakness on D.

 

[SidewalkJacket]

Speaking of the LB's, before the season, I fully expected one of the true freshman to break into the starting lineup. That has not happened. Not sure what that says especially that LB is our weakness on D.

If you watch TDR, JH, and BJS, they are clearly on another level athletically from our starters. However, while they make exciting plays on occasion, they have also been out of position/taken bad angles, etc. So, I think we have a combination of CTR's propensity to play older, more experienced guys at all costs coupled with the new LBs still picking up their responsibilities.

 

[Ibeeballin]

If you watch TDR, JH, and BJS, they are clearly on another level athletically from our starters. However, while they make exciting plays on occasion, they have also been out of position/taken bad angles, etc. So, I think we have a combination of CTR's propensity to play older, more experienced guys at all costs coupled with the new LBs still picking up their responsibilities.

Yeah, even though the young guys are more athletic, it’s hard to overcome a player with 3+ years in a system as a Freshman

 

[Madison Grant]

If you watch TDR, JH, and BJS, they are clearly on another level athletically from our starters. However, while they make exciting plays on occasion, they have also been out of position/taken bad angles, etc. So, I think we have a combination of CTR's propensity to play older, more experienced guys at all costs coupled with the new LBs still picking up their responsibilities.

You've hit on something. Our 2014 defense was not great statistically, but produced a lot more big plays and turnovers. That year we had a lot more experience, particularly in the secondary (DJ White and Chris Milton). This year, we've got multiple players who are now in their 2nd or 3rd year starting. Could be something beyond talent or scheme, namely experience.