GT @ Syracuse 2/22 @ 4pm

[Deleted member 2897]

Syracuse beat us last time by 34 points. But of course that was without multiple key players.

Syracuse just lost to #11 Louisville by 24 points. But prior to that had beat #8 Florida State.

They also recently to both NC State and Wake Forest.

So which Syracuse will show up?

Which Georgia Tech will show up?

Who the hell knows. But its a log jam in the ACC standings. If we can finish at 10-10 or 11-9, we'll finish in the top half for sure (skip the play-in game), and especially at 11-9 we could finish 6th. We haven't finished at 0.500 in ACC play in 13 years. We haven't finished 2 games above 0.500 since we made the national championship game 16 years ago (off a 9-7 conference record). Its been 25 years since we've finished more than 2 games over 0.500 in ACC play. Yes we still technically have a chance to do that.

 

[CuseJacket]

Syracuse beat us last time by 34 points. But of course that was without multiple key players.

Syracuse just lost to #11 Louisville by 24 points. But prior to that had beat #8 Florida State.

They also recently to both NC State and Wake Forest.

So which Syracuse will show up?

Which Georgia Tech will show up?

Who the hell knows. But its a log jam in the ACC standings. If we can finish at 10-10 or 11-9, we'll finish in the top half for sure (skip the play-in game), and especially at 11-9 we could finish 6th. We haven't finished at 0.500 in ACC play in 13 years. We haven't finished 2 games above 0.500 since we made the national championship game 16 years ago (off a 9-7 conference record). Its been 25 years since we've finished more than 2 games over 0.500 in ACC play. Yes we still technically have a chance to do that.

As @bwelbo likes to say, fake news

Syracuse lost to Florida State by 3.

They lost to NC State and beat Wake Forest, though I suppose you didn't state whether they won or lost those games. The NC State game can be explained by Hughes going down 3 minutes in. Otherwise Cuse safely wins that game, and I usually hesitate on hypothetical proclamations like that.

Last night was bad 'Cuse + the real Louisville team.

'Cuse will be favored by 6-7 on Saturday. There is a chance they could end the season above .500, which is contrary to my opinion ahead of our first meeting with them. This is in part a credit to coaches + players improving to a degree I did not expect, and part the ACC being a dumpster fire I did not expect to last all year.

 

[Deleted member 2897]

As @bwelbo likes to say, fake news

Syracuse lost to Florida State by 3.

They lost to NC State and beat Wake Forest, though I suppose you didn't state whether they won or lost those games. The NC State game can be explained by Hughes going down 3 minutes in. Otherwise Cuse safely wins that game, and I usually hesitate on hypothetical proclamations like that.

Last night was bad 'Cuse + the real Louisville team.

'Cuse will be favored by 6-7 on Saturday. There is a chance they could end the season above .500, which is contrary to my opinion ahead of our first meeting with them. This is in part a credit to coaches + players improving to a degree I did not expect, and part the ACC being a dumpster fire I did not expect to last all year.

I must have googled the wrong year to get so many things backwards. That’s ridiculous. I’m not old enough to be that incompetent.

 

[Deleted member 2897]

As @bwelbo likes to say, fake news

Syracuse lost to Florida State by 3.

They lost to NC State and beat Wake Forest, though I suppose you didn't state whether they won or lost those games. The NC State game can be explained by Hughes going down 3 minutes in. Otherwise Cuse safely wins that game, and I usually hesitate on hypothetical proclamations like that.

Last night was bad 'Cuse + the real Louisville team.

'Cuse will be favored by 6-7 on Saturday. There is a chance they could end the season above .500, which is contrary to my opinion ahead of our first meeting with them. This is in part a credit to coaches + players improving to a degree I did not expect, and part the ACC being a dumpster fire I did not expect to last all year.

6-7 point underdogs feels about right. I mean they beat the dog snot out of us last time - we can’t expect to be predicted to win. Their KenPom is reasonable, and it’s a road game. This would be a huge win.

 

[CuseJacket]

The recipe for making it difficult for 'Cuse remains the same. Be physical, especially on the interior. Unfortunately that's not been us and certainly wasn't in game 1.

If you go down the starting 5, GT has the advantage at most positions.

Alvarado > Girard
Devoe > Boeheim
Any GT SF < Hughes
Wright = Dolezaj (maybe slight edge to Wright)
Banks > Sidibe

Basically we have the edge in the back court and front court, but not on the wing. The difference on the wing is big though as Hughes is a top 10 if not 5 ACC player, and therefore will be the best player on the court.

Probably comes down to turnovers and who gets hot, with the edge to Cuse for being at home and trying to "get right".

 

[Deleted member 2897]

The recipe for making it difficult for 'Cuse remains the same. Be physical, especially on the interior. Unfortunately that's not been us and certainly wasn't in game 1.

If you go down the starting 5, GT has the advantage at most positions.

Alvarado > Girard
Devoe > Boeheim
Any GT SF < Hughes
Wright = Dolezaj (maybe slight edge to Wright)
Banks > Sidibe

Basically we have the edge in the back court and front court, but not on the wing. The difference on the wing is big though as Hughes is a top 10 if not 5 ACC player, and therefore will be the best player on the court.

Probably comes down to turnovers and who gets hot, with the edge to Cuse for being at home and trying to "get right".

Yep. I’m going to bee-lieve that we win our last 7 games until proven that we don’t.

Not just because I’m a fan, but I’d love to hear Pastner grovel to the committee about how the second half team is a different team with all our players...then it doesn’t matter and we don’t get an NCAAT bid, Ken Seguira will write a piece about we don’t deserve it, we’ll all moan and complain and ... well, I need a drink.

 

[YlJacket]

The recipe for making it difficult for 'Cuse remains the same. Be physical, especially on the interior. Unfortunately that's not been us and certainly wasn't in game 1.

If you go down the starting 5, GT has the advantage at most positions.

Alvarado > Girard
Devoe > Boeheim
Any GT SF < Hughes
Wright = Dolezaj (maybe slight edge to Wright)
Banks > Sidibe

Basically we have the edge in the back court and front court, but not on the wing. The difference on the wing is big though as Hughes is a top 10 if not 5 ACC player, and therefore will be the best player on the court.

Probably comes down to turnovers and who gets hot, with the edge to Cuse for being at home and trying to "get right".

I take your point with the comparisons, but the matchups don't really work that way with the SYR zone. And FWIW I don't like the matchup that zone gives us with our new and improved non Princeton offense of the last several games being who can get the ball and drive from the top of the key. That obviously ain't gonna work against that zone so we will have to relearn how to pass, cut and move defenses again. Moses at the foul line and DeVoe from the wing will be key.

Last time we gave up almost 100 points. We do that again and it doesn't matter what happens on the offensive end. We lose big. I am not sure if our zone or man is a better way to go but we have to keep this game in the 70s to really have a shot. My deep seeded GT BB scars tell me that this is the game Buddy returns to form with a 20 point game on 7 shots or something like that. We have to come up with a way to defend this time.

6-7 sounds about right but with the rollercoaster ride all the teams in the mosh pit of the ACC have been on - who knows.

 

[Connell62]

I have said since our game against Cuse where we got destroyed that we would have this one marked on the calendar and that we would get the W. I still believe that and I am predicting the mild upset on Saturday. That said, it will not be easy.

We're going to have to do something that we haven't done very well lately and that is make some trey's. Expect to see Jose in the high post. He is great at either knocking down the foul-line jumper, dumping off to our bigs, or finding the open shooter in this postion. He has owned Syracuse in the past, but I suspect Boeheim knows this already and will adjust for it. Someone is going to have to knock down a few shots so that they cannot completely take that away from us. It is our key to winning this game.

Bubba has been quiet offensively over the last several games, but this is the game where he can be a huge factor for us. He should get plenty of open looks, and it is imperative that he is aggressive shooting the ball. With that said, we must move the ball and get points in the paint will be crucial.

This would be a great time for our swarming defense to make an appearance. My guess is that we will play our zone. We have held some great shooting teams to percentages in the teens, and we must take that away from the Orange. @CuseJacket can school me here, but I think that their chances of winning go way down when they don't make a high % of threes.

Most of all, I think that we see our competitive spirit in this game. Our boys should be as pissed off about our first performance as I was, and I suspect that will have us focused and ready to play. Jackets win a nail biter and great overall game!!

Can't wait for Saturday.

 

[Silk3]

I hope we man up and dont zone them w the way they can shoot. Hughes basically won the game in atl in first 5 minutes.

 

[ESPNjacket]

They are very vulnerable on their defensive glass. Usher, Wright, and Cole need to get on the offensive boards and make them pay.

 

[tsrich]

At this point, I think all our games come down to how many turnovers we have. If we keep that <13, we will win more often than not - ND being the weird outlier.

 

[CuseJacket]

I take your point with the comparisons, but the matchups don't really work that way with the SYR zone. And FWIW I don't like the matchup that zone gives us with our new and improved non Princeton offense of the last several games being who can get the ball and drive from the top of the key. That obviously ain't gonna work against that zone so we will have to relearn how to pass, cut and move defenses again. Moses at the foul line and DeVoe from the wing will be key.

Last time we gave up almost 100 points. We do that again and it doesn't matter what happens on the offensive end. We lose big. I am not sure if our zone or man is a better way to go but we have to keep this game in the 70s to really have a shot. My deep seeded GT BB scars tell me that this is the game Buddy returns to form with a 20 point game on 7 shots or something like that. We have to come up with a way to defend this time.

6-7 sounds about right but with the rollercoaster ride all the teams in the mosh pit of the ACC have been on - who knows.

I hear you. My point was mainly about raw ability the minute they hit the floor. Even with my comparison, my caveat was to say that it doesn't make us the better team or that the match-up is advantageous to us.

Expanding but not directed at you:
Unfortunately I don't think we have a great way of slowing them down offensively, without giving up something on the other end. Hughes, Boeheim and Girarad all have the green light from NBA+ range. That either takes us out of zone or opens up the lane for Dolezaj who is crafty enough to make hay.

In man, Buddy simply needs to be face-guarded by someone to be taken out of the game. Don't allow him to raise up off the catch, even from NBA range. Problem is faceguarding Boeheim opens up driving lanes for Hughes, who is already capable from deep himself. Girard in many ways play much like Alvarado... maybe a little more score first, but he's shown he can get it done.

For the first time in a while, Cuse' issues are on the other end. They are top 30 offensively, but barely in the top 150 defensively. The zone is a sieve, in large part due to what they give up by playing Girard and Boeheim. Boeheim is slooooooow. Girard is not long. Then you have a center playing behind them that has gathered 4+ fouls/game for 10 consecutive games. He fouled out in 11 minutes last night. Not a big deal when you have a bench, but they play 6.

Like @ESPNjacket said, you need to pound-pound-pound and pound some more inside. Go at the big guys and force 2 of of the 3 (Sidibe, Dolezaj, Guerrier) into foul trouble, then their production falls off a cliff on both ends with Edwards (true frosh center who only plays in emergency). The most successful way of doing this as proven this year is to have physical big men who attack with the ball and also hit the glass. While we are ok at that, I'd argue our bigs play a more finesse game relatively speaking.

 

[CuseJacket]

I have said since our game against Cuse where we got destroyed that we would have this one marked on the calendar and that we would get the W. I still believe that and I am predicting the mild upset on Saturday. That said, it will not be easy.

We're going to have to do something that we haven't done very well lately and that is make some trey's. Expect to see Jose in the high post. He is great at either knocking down the foul-line jumper, dumping off to our bigs, or finding the open shooter in this postion. He has owned Syracuse in the past, but I suspect Boeheim knows this already and will adjust for it. Someone is going to have to knock down a few shots so that they cannot completely take that away from us. It is our key to winning this game.

Bubba has been quiet offensively over the last several games, but this is the game where he can be a huge factor for us. He should get plenty of open looks, and it is imperative that he is aggressive shooting the ball. With that said, we must move the ball and get points in the paint will be crucial.

This would be a great time for our swarming defense to make an appearance. My guess is that we will play our zone. We have held some great shooting teams to percentages in the teens, and we must take that away from the Orange. @CuseJacket can school me here, but I think that their chances of winning go way down when they don't make a high % of threes.

Most of all, I think that we see our competitive spirit in this game. Our boys should be as pissed off about our first performance as I was, and I suspect that will have us focused and ready to play. Jackets win a nail biter and great overall game!!

Can't wait for Saturday.

I hate to say it this way, but with our roster (good, not elite), they're simply going to have to miss 3's vs. having them taken away. A lot of that is a credit to them though. See prior post. That doesn't mean we can't take more of them away than last game - that's a must, and better recognition regardless of man vs. zone would alleviate most of what we saw last game.

I agree with your point about Alvarado, and I think Pastner said as much following the first game. Alvarado at the high post can help create movement, but it's not the cut-and-dry solution that having aggressive bigs is vs. this year's very average 2-3 zone.

One nuance that GT fans may notice. Cuse has gotten a little more hybrid 2-3 a la GT. You'll see a staggered guard set at times that is nearly a 1-3-1, which was a midseason adjustment to account for their issues on that end of the court.

 

[YlJacket]

I hear you. My point was mainly about raw ability the minute they hit the floor. Even with my comparison, my caveat was to say that it doesn't make us the better team or that the match-up is advantageous to us.

Expanding but not directed at you:
Unfortunately I don't think we have a great way of slowing them down offensively, without giving up something on the other end. Hughes, Boeheim and Girarad all have the green light from NBA+ range. That either takes us out of zone or opens up the lane for Dolezaj who is crafty enough to make hay.

In man, Buddy simply needs to be face-guarded by someone to be taken out of the game. Don't allow him to raise up off the catch, even from NBA range. Problem is faceguarding Boeheim opens up driving lanes for Hughes, who is already capable from deep himself. Girard in many ways play much like Alvarado... maybe a little more score first, but he's shown he can get it done.

For the first time in a while, Cuse' issues are on the other end. They are top 30 offensively, but barely in the top 150 defensively. The zone is a sieve, in large part due to what they give up by playing Girard and Boeheim. Boeheim is slooooooow. Girard is not long. Then you have a center playing behind them that has gathered 4+ fouls/game for 10 consecutive games. He fouled out in 11 minutes last night. Not a big deal when you have a bench, but they play 6.

Like @ESPNjacket said, you need to pound-pound-pound and pound some more inside. Go at the big guys and force 2 of of the 3 (Sidibe, Dolezaj, Guerrier) into foul trouble, then their production falls off a cliff on both ends with Edwards (true frosh center who only plays in emergency). The most successful way of doing this as proven this year is to have physical big men who attack with the ball and also hit the glass. While we are ok at that, I'd argue our bigs play a more finesse game relatively speaking.

Dang - been a while since I have been so viciously attacked So let me return with a left hook Actually interesting thoughts - my reaction though is I don't see us winning an offensive shootout with anyone - even a sieve of a 2-3 zone. So I guess either we have to find a way to really defend them or we just have to pray for turbulence from the 3 point area. I know we aren't winning the game from 3 so put the jet stream out there.

Your and ESPN's view that we need to pound the ball inside kind of mirror's my view that our recent offensive structure/success isn't going to work against the zone even recognizing the limitations of SYR guards defensively. Simply won't be able to drive through the whole zone regardless of how big a sieve it may be. And while I like Jose getting the ball at the foul line, he is one of 2 legit shooters we have and it won't take a genius to know collapse the zone when he gets it and dare us to shoot off a kickout. I would rather have Jose on the wing to draw the forward up and have Moses dump it to Banks on the block high/low.

Usher may be the key in that he likely is the one who draws Hughes and could be the one who gets to the offensive glass from the wing. Would be good to see him really step up this game.

 

[CuseJacket]

Dang - been a while since I have been so viciously attacked So let me return with a left hook Actually interesting thoughts - my reaction though is I don't see us winning an offensive shootout with anyone - even a sieve of a 2-3 zone. So I guess either we have to find a way to really defend them or we just have to pray for turbulence from the 3 point area. I know we aren't winning the game from 3 so put the jet stream out there.

Your and ESPN's view that we need to pound the ball inside kind of mirror's my view that our recent offensive structure/success isn't going to work against the zone even recognizing the limitations of SYR guards defensively. Simply won't be able to drive through the whole zone regardless of how big a sieve it may be. And while I like Jose getting the ball at the foul line, he is one of 2 legit shooters we have and it won't take a genius to know collapse the zone when he gets it and dare us to shoot off a kickout. I would rather have Jose on the wing to draw the forward up and have Moses dump it to Banks on the block high/low.

Usher may be the key in that he likely is the one who draws Hughes and could be the one who gets to the offensive glass from the wing. Would be good to see him really step up this game.

Didn't think I was disagreeing with you all that much, rather nuancing what you said, then just going stream of consciousness as a spin-off.

I shouldn't have spoken in absolutes in my last reply to you. I think we can slow them down, or at least show a pulse unlike last game. But we're not going to stop them like we have in prior years.

Double-edged sword as you point out with Alvarado, but I think the "Alvarado at the high post" thought process is based on past success. In theory you throw Bubba and Devoe out on the wing, and that keeps the floor spread. In our best years vs. the 2-3 with Pastner I don't think we've ever had a singular attack. We've always tried to be multiple.

 

[ESPNjacket]

Usher may be the key in that he likely is the one who draws Hughes and could be the one who gets to the offensive glass from the wing. Would be good to see him really step up this game.

I'd like to see Usher in the high post some. He is a decent passer and could pound the boards from there after kicking it out to Jose, Devoe, and Parham.

 

[YlJacket]

Didn't think I was disagreeing with you all that much, rather nuancing what you said, then just going stream of consciousness as a spin-off.

I shouldn't have spoken in absolutes in my last reply to you. I think we can slow them down, or at least show a pulse unlike last game. But we're not going to stop them like we have in prior years.

Double-edged sword as you point out with Alvarado, but I think the "Alvarado at the high post" thought process is based on past success. In theory you throw Bubba and Devoe out on the wing, and that keeps the floor spread. In our best years vs. the 2-3 with Pastner I don't think we've ever had a singular attack. We've always tried to be multiple.

You were not disagreeing much at all. Allow me some silliness. Kind of my release from other nonsense.

 

[AE 87]

I think we take care of business Saturday. I expect a lot of hard baseline cuts behind the zone from Jordan and Evan.

 

[lv20gt]

This will be an interesting game to see just how much an impact Alvarado and Usher make. At the very least we should be able to better control Hughes and Boeheim and not let them go off for 60 by themselves . I don't think Cuse will get to 97 again, but I don't expect this game to be won in the 60s. I think we need to put up at least 75 to win which probably means knocking down some outside shots to open things up. Now would be a great time for Bubba to go off.

Cuse has lost 3 in a row and 5 of the last 6 so that could either have them desperate and playing hard or if we can manage to get an early lead work in our favor.

 

[Connell62]

I'd like to see Usher in the high post some. He is a decent passer and could pound the boards from there after kicking it out to Jose, Devoe, and Parham.

Agreed..I think we will see that, but he must play under control. When he starts trying to do too much, it has a tendency to implode.

Moses should also play a big role from there. I think we have the tools to score against the zone, can we do it.