General News about Key and his Staff

[stech81]

They also started actually practicing and being held accountable. If I understood the comments correctly, practice until C*****s left was: Not at full speed, Not in full pads, Not full contact, No competition drills 1s-vs-1s. Under such conditions I don't understand how an OL can gel. I don't understand how you could possible decide who the best performing linemen were until an actual game.

CGC used the old one potato. Two potato to pick the starters but the ones who could dance the best he wanted on the sidelines to cheer.

 

[RonJohn]

O line played pretty damn well against georgia and we still didn’t do too much. The offense looked a little better, but aside from the first scripted drive the play calling didn’t seem too imaginative.

The difference between the first drive and the rest of the game could be because the mutts adapted better than we did. It isn't necessarily that the entire series was scripted.

The o linemen that played the entire game were two freshmen and three sophomores. (Albeit adjusted because of COVID year) If they had started actually practicing they way they should last Spring, I think there is a high chance that we wouldn't be barely missing a bowl game. We would be getting ready to go to Charlotte. With all of the complaints about players and lack of talent on this forum, I think that with the right coaching this team could have won 10 games.

 

[LongforDodd]

Really up and coming. I still hope to get back to Atlanta before we have kids, mostly for GT and the Braves, but Alabama isn’t all bad.

Don't come to ATL to raise kids. I've been here most of my life, spent most of it wihin 20 mins of campus raising a family, and, IMO, the greater ATL area is certainly not what it used to be. The worst part among many factors is the traffic. Horrible and ATL's growth is making it worse by the year. We're looking to move when I retire in 2023 and I've been reading good things also about Huntsville.

 

[BainbridgeJacket]

I’d want to think of the units as consistent teams where the defensive staff all plays well together. But, to keep things simple, let’s do Wins Against Replacement (WAR) without a stat like that for the coaches.

Our defense is #39 in DFEI. It was good this year. (Tulane, believe it or not, was #25). Our Offense was #108 in OFEI this year. Yes, we went down two QBs during the year, but the offense ranking stayed below 90 all year, even when Sims and Pyron were around.

So, if you have to pick your battles and use your resources effectively, the place you make changes is on offense.

Before I start on offense, I will say this on defense—you could move Semore to mainly Special Teams and Thacker back to LB and solve the punting issues and the staffing balance. We mainly use 2 LB, so it’s a question of “do you want to do this”? Alternatively, if you really like Semore as an LB coach, Thacker could be DC and Special Teams Coordinator. You might lose someone on defense, but I hope not.

For OC, the $850k for Long is already spent, so financially think of him as a “free” OC since his salary is a sunk cost. Is it worth another $800k or thereabouts to bring in someone else? Probably. Especially if Weinke was doing the signal calling the last two games—that means that Long isn’t really working as your OC. We didn’t put up good numbers in the TE position and our PFF ratings in that position were pretty low (including blocking), so unless Long recruits like mad, he’s not a high WAR OC or TE coach. You also need an OL coach, so if your OC is also the OL coach, that works really well. The more likely scenario is that the OC is also the QB coach, which means Weinke is out of a spot. Eley is working at RB coach right now instead of Daniels. I think that’s more “you’re a coach and we have a hole here, can you fill in?”. My guess is that Eley goes back to being an analyst next season or coaches a different position.

Unless you leave Long as OC or promote Weinke to OC, there is a game of musical chairs that happens on offense. I think that it’s most likely that we hire a new OC and there are wholesale changes on offense. I think both of the two primary OCs that have been mentioned as targets are also QB position coaches, so Weinke would need to move to a different spot, or become an analyst, and that’s the minimum change. Godsey could coach TE, but I don’t think he’ll be coming here. It’s more likely that there’s a completely new offensive coaching staff next season, or maybe one or two return, if you have a new OC.

The other option to me is Weinke as OC and filling the TE and OL slots. That’s two coaching positions—Long and the OL coach. You could do that with two OL coaches where one did GCG and the other did T+TE. Or the TEs could get lumped in with the WRs or the RBs, or have their own coach.

If you want to bring in Pruitt or Charles Kelly as DC, they both coach secondary, which means that Tillman would be gone and Thacker would be gone. You wouldn’t really improve your secondary that much. I don’t know why you would want to replace Turner.

So, my guesses from most likely to least likely

1. New OC and significant coaching changes on offense.
2. Weinke becomes OC and we hire OL and TE coaches (the continuity option)
3. Godsey comes in as OC and TE coach, we keep Weinke, and there are a 1-2 additional changes in the offensive staff
4. Long stays, hire OL coach. (the other continuity option)

On defense, my guesses are (1 most likely, and then less likely):

1. Coaching staff stays pretty much as-is.
2. Thacker leaves and we promote Turner or Tillman to DC
3. Key brings in Kelly or Pruitt and we lose Tillman and Thacker.
4. Key brings in another DC that coaches LB and we lose Thacker and Semore.

I think the defense is going in the right direction, and I don’t see the need for wholesale changes. If you do change the defense, it better be a major out-of-the-gate improvement.

BTW, here’s the list from RamblinWreck.com. It’s out of date. Mike Daniel’s link goes to nowhere.

• David Turner – Assistant Head Coach (Defense)/Defensive Run Game Coordinator
• Chip Long – Offensive Coordinator/Tight Ends
• Andrew Thacker – Defensive Coordinator
• Travares Tillman – Defensive Backs/Defensive Pass Game Coordinator
• Del Alexander – Wide Receivers
• Mike Daniels – Running Backs
• Larry Knight – Defensive Line
• Jason Semore – Linebackers/Special Teams
• Chris Weinke – Quarterbacks

If the rumor that Weinke did the play calling against UNC and UGA is true (and it was just something posted here and on other boards), then that might explain the play calling. Also, the last two games don’t help Long that much if he wasn’t calling plays.

Man, what did Mike Daniels DO?!? A recruit's household pet?!?! It's strange how we're purging all reference to him.

 

[Vespidae]

One of the "rules" of good organization management is that during a period of rapid change, keep at least a few things constant. They become a lighthouse or a safety net for people who are trying to deal with a lot of change.

Long is here for at least another year and $850K is not chump change. I would say if you want to change the staff who are not on contract, fine. Keep the coordinators and the basic football philosophy. Key will have plenty to change after his first full year and the freedom to do so. You don't have to make the CFB playoffs your first year. Just get things stable and playing your brand of football.

 

[AugustaSwarm]

To get back on track, I’d personally like to see the defensive staff retained, at least for the most part. The defense this year was the most competent defense I think I’ve seen since 2008. The offense on the other hand needs a lot of work. I’m hoping he hires a quality OC. Someone mentioned weinke and TC as CO-OCs which sounded like a nice idea. Get TC back and give him a raise and title bump. The other options will probably have to come from someone doing well at a G5 school.

I agree. We need some stability and the defense is the only side of the ball that was serviceable - and honestly our D was pretty good. I'm okay retaining the defensive side and continuing to build something good.

On O, we need an overhaul. Keep Long as OC if we need to, but I hope it's crystal f'ing clear that he is out of rope and things need to DRASTICALLY improve this year.

The biggest thing we need to fix IMO is special teams. We need a total turnaround on ST...

 

[DaDodd]

Fire Long and make Weinke OC.
Elevate Chaney to OL coach.
Bring back Choice as RB coach. (Since Key may take less money it will free some money up for assistants)
Keep Thacker as DC and the rest of the defensive staff.
Hire a ST coordinator.

 

[Fatmike91]

One of the "rules" of good organization management is that during a period of rapid change, keep at least a few things constant. They become a lighthouse or a safety net for people who are trying to deal with a lot of change.

Long is here for at least another year and $850K is not chump change. I would say if you want to change the staff who are not on contract, fine. Keep the coordinators and the basic football philosophy. Key will have plenty to change after his first full year and the freedom to do so. You don't have to make the CFB playoffs your first year. Just get things stable and playing your brand of football.

Nope. If the rumors are true about the last two games (Weinke prepping the QBs and calling the plays) then Long needs to go and it's not even a discussion.

We showed massive progress in the last two games of the year. We played like a competitive football team - and that was with our 3rd and 4th string QBs.

From what I've seen Weinke stays - especially if he has trust with our young QB...

/

 

[TechBurn]

nm

 

[malak05]

Our QB room doesn't looks so terrible next year. We will have a Good Freshman and 2 Juniors that are serviceable in certain roles
- Pyron has all the tools, heart, and drive to be a top QB in ACC let him get healthy and he will be very very good especially if the O-line continues to improve.
- Gibson with enough prep work and game plan is a decent backup that can manage a game to help win a game or two if need during season due to injury.
- Phommachanh is a wrinkle guy that can be rolled in on occasions to stretch and attack at times. His role with Pyron as QB would be limited as Pyron can do both but he's a nice piece to have if it's him and Gibson

 

[RonJohn]

One of the "rules" of good organization management is that during a period of rapid change, keep at least a few things constant. They become a lighthouse or a safety net for people who are trying to deal with a lot of change.

Long is here for at least another year and $850K is not chump change. I would say if you want to change the staff who are not on contract, fine. Keep the coordinators and the basic football philosophy. Key will have plenty to change after his first full year and the freedom to do so. You don't have to make the CFB playoffs your first year. Just get things stable and playing your brand of football.

That is a good philosophy. However, IF the reports about Long not calling plays in the last two games are accurate, that changes the situation. You said that you took over an organization and changed it from almost going under to being very profitable. If you had an upper manager who was incompetent, would you have kept him on staff to maintain continuity? I seriously doubt it.

I don't know if those reports are true. Even if true, there might be some circumstances around it that make it a non-issue. IF it is true that play calling was taken away from Long AND the reason is that he wasn't trusted, then the other coaches know it and the players know it. IF that is the case, you can't keep him on staff, or you lose accountability.

 

[Vespidae]

Nope. If the rumors are true about the last two games (Weinke prepping the QBs and calling the plays) then Long needs to go and it's not even a discussion.

We showed massive progress in the last two games of the year. We played like a competitive football team - and that was with our 3rd and 4th string QBs.

From what I've seen Weinke stays - especially if he has trust with our young QB...

/

If we had the $850K to burn, Key would not be coach.

 

[Vespidae]

That is a good philosophy. However, IF the reports about Long not calling plays in the last two games are accurate, that changes the situation. You said that you took over an organization and changed it from almost going under to being very profitable. If you had an upper manager who was incompetent, would you have kept him on staff to maintain continuity? I seriously doubt it.

I don't know if those reports are true. Even if true, there might be some circumstances around it that make it a non-issue. IF it is true that play calling was taken away from Long AND the reason is that he wasn't trusted, then the other coaches know it and the players know it. IF that is the case, you can't keep him on staff, or you lose accountability.

I do not know the situation with Long and don't really care if he stays or goes. But, it is $850K and had we placed that as a guarantee, Fritz would most likely have been selected. So, it's not immaterial.

Re your question, I was put in charge with 17 direct reports and corporate HR flew down to fire them all during the changeover. I said no ... asking, "Who is going to do the work?" So, I kept everyone ... moving some into different roles but it was the same faces. In Year 2, I replaced half of them and in Year 3, the rest. Easy.

 

[UgaBlows]

Fire Long and make Weinke OC.
Elevate Chaney to OL coach.
Bring back Choice as RB coach. (Since Key may take less money it will free some money up for assistants)
Keep Thacker as DC and the rest of the defensive staff.
Hire a ST coordinator.

Chaney at OL is interesting. And you have to wonder, did Choice leave mainly to get away from Geoff, or just for more money?

 

[Oldgoldandwhite]

One of the "rules" of good organization management is that during a period of rapid change, keep at least a few things constant. They become a lighthouse or a safety net for people who are trying to deal with a lot of change.

Long is here for at least another year and $850K is not chump change. I would say if you want to change the staff who are not on contract, fine. Keep the coordinators and the basic football philosophy. Key will have plenty to change after his first full year and the freedom to do so. You don't have to make the CFB playoffs your first year. Just get things stable and playing your brand of football.

Didn’t we just pay $200 thousand to a search firm?

 

[Augusta_Jacket]

And you have to wonder, did Choice leave mainly to get away from Geoff, or just for more money?

 

[Vespidae]

Didn’t we just pay $200 thousand to a search firm?

And?

 

[Ash]

There seems to be a lot of support for keeping Thacker around here. What a difference a year makes!

 

[bobongo]

Didn’t we just pay $200 thousand to a search firm?

They could be put to work doing something useful, I guess, but I wonder if our coach would need or welcome input from them regarding his staff.
Only Key knows the answer to that question. Or maybe the search didn't cover assistant coaches.

 

[SunBum]

GT shafted once again! I thought I'd get some of my free-time back once the HFC was named. But here I still am, refreshing every 10 minutes...