Expectations for the 2021 season

[GoJacketsInRaleigh]

Yep...CPJ has several of those...but they are outliers rather than the norm...WTF moments are all Collins has produced. Even in his two big wins duhU and F$U required some really bad plays by the opposition for us to win.

Yeah, I'm pretty sure most coaches best wins require the other team to make bad plays. They also require your team to make good plays too.

 

[GoJacketsInRaleigh]

Triple option is a play not an offense. The Triple can be run out of the I, the split back Veer, the wishbone, the flex bone, the full house and the wing T. And he won 9 games his first time out and beat UGA.
And kind of Funny about that Nesbitt was a running QB and Dwyer had considered going to Navy.

The Triple Option...Goose Style

Was it your or your sidekick that were whining about mental gymnastics this week? Your replies are so predictable.

 

[CuseJacket]

I didn't say the 2009 team. I said 2008, CPJs first year.
2009 just showed what good coaching, very good players, and scheme can achieve...11 wins.

Take on 4* player

Anthony Williams

DE

McDonough, GA

6'4"

235

5.8

He was a 4 star. In the 2010 class, remember him...me neither. Maybe a testament to Al Groh.

As for transfers, let's see them play at Tech then I will tell you my opinion.

Ah gotcha, my bad on 2008 vs 2009. Either way, the results you are offering are based on 1) a top 20 recruiting class, and 2) seasoning of those players to see results (2 years on campus). The timing of that would be this year for Collins' (though only top 25), if the experiment that you've already graded is going to be apples to apples.

Yes, I do remember Anthony Williams. Not sure why you don't. He was not a DT. How does our 4* DT commit compare to your expectations of Tech's ability to recruit?

Point taken on transfers. Do you acknowledge that we took significantly more last year than any year prior and therefore it skewed our HS recruiting rankings (we took fewer HS recruits, otherwise the class would have been rated higher)?

 

[THWG]

I didn't say the 2009 team. I said 2008, CPJs first year.
2009 just showed what good coaching, very good players, and scheme can achieve...11 wins.

Take on 4* player

Anthony Williams

DE

McDonough, GA

6'4"

235

5.8

He was a 4 star. In the 2010 class, remember him...me neither. Maybe a testament to Al Groh.

As for transfers, let's see them play at Tech then I will tell you my opinion.

And as for 2010.
This might explain a fair amount of the drop off, other than the loss to Kansas..a WTF moment

Georgia Tech won’t confirm anything until after the game, but word on the street is QB Joshua Nesbitt broke his right forearm while diving to tackle a Virginia Tech Hokies defender late in the second quarter. Nesbitt left the field and soon went to the locker room early. Tevin Washington has been filling in, and the offense has stalled for the most part.

If scheme is the most important thing like you claim, why are you pointing to Nesbitt's injury as derailing the 2010 season? A good scheme should overcome player deficiencies, right?

Or is it that good players are needed to make any scheme look good?

 

[Coloradojacket]

Ah gotcha, my bad on 2008 vs 2009. Either way, the results you are offering are based on 1) a top 20 recruiting class, and 2) seasoning of those players to see results (2 years on campus). The timing of that would be this year for Collins' (though only top 25), if the experiment that you've already graded is going to be apples to apples.

Yes, I do remember Anthony Williams. Not sure why you don't. He was not a DT. How does our 4* DT commit compare to your expectations of Tech's ability to recruit?

Point taken on transfers. Do you acknowledge that we took significantly more last year than any year prior and therefore it skewed our HS recruiting rankings (we took fewer HS recruits, otherwise the class would have been rated higher)?

So as for rankings, I have always said..for those that live and die on recruiting, that the ranking system is not correct as it does take into account numbers. Example

In 2013 we were ranked 84th but only recruited 14 players.
I take average stars.
But again this is if you put a lot of emphasis on that
That 2013 class included Corey Griffin, PJ Davis, Ricky Jeune, Harrison Butker, Shamire Devine. So out of 14 players these guys stood out. And many were 2 stars.

 

[Coloradojacket]

If scheme is the most important thing like you claim, why are you pointing to Nesbitt's injury as derailing the 2010 season? A good scheme should overcome player deficiencies, right?

Or is it that good players are needed to make any scheme look good?

Ask any coach if he lost his Senior 3 year starting quarterback mid season what he thinks would happen.

Scheme means utilizing my players strengths and overcoming weaknesses. If my best offensive tackle is getting whipped by the guy across from him, I am going to scheme by maybe having the guard down block on that DT instead.

 

[Coloradojacket]

Ah gotcha, my bad on 2008 vs 2009. Either way, the results you are offering are based on 1) a top 20 recruiting class, and 2) seasoning of those players to see results (2 years on campus). The timing of that would be this year for Collins' (though only top 25), if the experiment that you've already graded is going to be apples to apples.

Yes, I do remember Anthony Williams. Not sure why you don't. He was not a DT. How does our 4* DT commit compare to your expectations of Tech's ability to recruit?

Point taken on transfers. Do you acknowledge that we took significantly more last year than any year prior and therefore it skewed our HS recruiting rankings (we took fewer HS recruits, otherwise the class would have been rated higher)?

And just one other thing. Those players, none of whom had played in CPJs offense were seasoned in that offense. If you saw the spring game that year you were probably thinking we would not win a game all season. We were predicted to only win 3. So I look at this season as something between 2007 and 2008. But I do not expect the same results.

 

[Northeast Stinger]

I think many if not most of us share these concerns too Colorado. The results have not been pretty and this is a young staff experience wise. They are reasonable ones to have based on what we see. However, (I think) the poster is asking for a little more balance in your posts. what gives you reason to be hopeful? what made you buy season tickets this year?

This is a reasonable response to legitimate concerns. Here is the way I process the concern vs the hope.

The concern is that CGC has not demonstrated top level coaching ability evidenced by players looking unprepared as well as sub par adjustments during games.

The hope is that he is young, new, still growing into the job and will eventually get there given his apparent work ethic.

The second hope is that the first two years he was focused on juice and playing fast and wanted to establish that as a priority before getting players too busy thinking rather than playing.

Better players will help some of this but the concerns are real and hope, though not a strategy for success, still seems like a reasonable response until more data comes in this year.

 

[smokey_wasp]

4, I will be disappointed. 5, I will be ok. 6+ I will be ecstatic. <4, bummed and asking questions

 

[Northeast Stinger]

Sorry but it's asinine to say Collins should have been running a triple option offense because that's the players he inherited. Did CPJ run an offense to fit Gailey's players? No, he jammed his triple option in immediately and then had a temper tantrum every time someone called it a triple option instead of a spread offense.

Sorry, but I'm calling your BS what it is. You just have an axe to grind.

Point of order, “Triple Option” offense was coined by negative recruiters against Tech. Tech fans who repeated that played into the negative recruiting strategy of our rivals.

Spread Option Offense was the correct description since in most games we only ran an actual triple option play between 20% to 30% of the time.

 

[Coloradojacket]

Point of order, “Triple Option” offense was coined by negative recruiters against Tech. Tech fans who repeated that played into the negative recruiting strategy of our rivals.

Spread Option Offense was the correct description since in most games we only ran an actual triple option play between 20% to 30% of the time.

And to add...just because I can, the current RPO is basically a triple option play. The QB reads the Tackle and either gives to the running back or pulls it. If he pulls then he can run or can throw a hitch pass out to a slot or WR. It just doesn't utilize a trailing back. If you wanted to extrapolate further, every time the QB pitches in the TO ala CPJ, it could be considered a pass.

 

[YJMD]

Point of order, “Triple Option” offense was coined by negative recruiters against Tech. Tech fans who repeated that played into the negative recruiting strategy of our rivals.

Spread Option Offense was the correct description since in most games we only ran an actual triple option play between 20% to 30% of the time.

Yes, although triple option isn't even one play. It's just any play that has 2 option reads resulting in 3 possible ball carriers. I wouldn't say spread option is the "correct" description, but it is more accurate than triple, and it's what CPJ called it.

 

[Northeast Stinger]

And to add...just because I can, the current RPO is basically a triple option play. The QB reads the Tackle and either gives to the running back or pulls it. If he pulls then he can run or can throw a hitch pass out to a slot or WR. It just doesn't utilize a trailing back. If you wanted to extrapolate further, every time the QB pitches in the TO ala CPJ, it could be considered a pass.

Yep, all true.

I have often thought some fans just don’t like the way the Flex-bone looks. Like it hurts their eyes. They seem to even not like it when it produces a 40 yard pass play for a touchdown. There is also circumstantial evidence that some recruits are put off by the unfamiliar look of the offense.

I was endlessly fascinated by the intricacies of the blocking and the way the offense could morph instantly into something different to take advantage of a weakness the defense had shown. I also liked that the chess game was sometimes drawn out with the checkmate not revealing itself to the third or fourth quarter.

 

[stech81]

I just like to win I don't care what offense we run or what anyone calls it. But if the defense doesn't drastically improve fact is this year will be like the last 2 years.

 

[GoJacketsInRaleigh]

Point of order, “Triple Option” offense was coined by negative recruiters against Tech. Tech fans who repeated that played into the negative recruiting strategy of our rivals.

Spread Option Offense was the correct description since in most games we only ran an actual triple option play between 20% to 30% of the time.

Wait, you mean coaches want to push phrases to the media to sell their program? Color me SHOCKED! But if Collins does it......

 

[YellowJacket55]

I agree with your point about 2009. Except you're wrong about one thing. They were Juniors, not Sophomores. Burnett and Morgan left for the draft after the season. The results of 2009 were three (3) seasons later, not immediately, following the top 20 class of 2007.

Apples to apples, more time is needed for CGC's first class to play through. They're starting their 2nd season this year, even without allowing any grace for a broken 2020 preseason. Logically, your point further helps explain why results fell off in 2010.

I'm good with your acknowledgement that last year's 49 ranking is missing context. Disagree with your take on net impact of transfers last year, but I don't think data is going to change your mind based on past attempts. Furthermore we're recruiting at a top 25 pace so far this year, including a 4* DT commit. Curious to hear what you think of that. Still TBD on where we finish this year.

I’ve been following recruiting fairly closely, so I’d like to add to this something we should be excited about. The composite four star guys are awesome, but something I’ve noticed is the three stars we are getting are the higher tier/more desirable ones. CPJ era most three stars were in that sub 1000 ranking. Geoff Collins 3 stars are commonly top 500, which makes a huge difference in the depth of the class without even considering the MUCH improved top end. I think there are 7 guys in 2022 committed now that are rated a 4 star on at least one service. Colorado also mentioned the 2021 class being lowly ranked, but this just doesn’t tell the full story. The 2021 recruiting cycle was completely destroyed by COVID, and not being able to get our message across in person clearly had an impact. Not to mention, it was still a higher quality class than what we’re used to, the average rating is actually solid! Just a smaller class hurts rankings (class of 16). Comp. to the 2017 class which has a similar national ranking but a significantly lower average rating you will see what I mean. The future is bright, let’s all be patient, CGC’s only recruiting classes are true sophomores and freshman, let’s hope how hard he hit the transfer portal helps ease the transition. Looking forwards to a full stadium this fall!

 

[ncjacket79]

Coastal Carolina.

Which is what?

 

[Coloradojacket]

Which is what?

The offense centers around the backfield with a variety of different looks that showcases 20 and 21-personnel.

A running back typically lines up next to the quarterback, while one tailback is behind the signal-caller in a pistol formation.

The offensive line has pulling guards with inside and outside zone blocking.

The quarterback will read the defensive end within an RPO to determine whether a handoff should be made, to attack the perimeter in the run game or to find a one-on-one matchup in the passing game.

It is also called a spread option. Our current offense is call Shotgun Spread. Most commonly run in Texas Highschool football....even if it is advertised as a Pro Scheme...whatever that means

 

[Ibeeballin]

"39 running backs and OL that block instead of dive on the ground and trip people"

See it is this kind of comment that attacks the CPJ staff and shows you know very little about football. Ask some of CPJs lineman if his blocking schemes were more complex than what we do now. I know a few and they will tell you zone blocking is easy compared to what they had to learn.

But it’s factual though

There we 15-16 RBs on the roster

OL was taught to cut and scoop block. If they missed the cut block, they were taught to roll

OL was no more complicated than any other scheme.

You know a few but do you know many what will tell you that?

I want to hear more about this Texas offense

 

[Coloradojacket]

But it’s factual though

There we 15-16 RBs on the roster

OL was taught to cut and scoop block. If they missed the cut block, they were taught to roll

OL was no more complicated than any other scheme.

You know a few but do you know many what will tell you that?

I want to hear more about this Texas offense

Here
Taken from https://texashsfootball.com/coachs-corner-benefits-drawbacks-spread-offense/
Covers CDP and Tech to a t.

What is A Spread Offense?

My definition of A “typical” spread offense is A 4 wide (10 personnel), 1 back, shot-gun or pistol set formation. Throwing the football is associated with this as well as lots of points being scored and an up-tempo being used to stress the defense out. Huddling is not only frowned upon, it’s discouraged.

What’s not a Spread Offense?

Any offense that has this in its name: Wing T, Flex-Bone, Jumbo, Muscle, Gigantic, Battleship, Tank, Double Wing, Single Wing, triple wing, etc. etc. Also typically involved with these offenses are a huddle, sometimes running a player on and off the field with the play, 3-point stances by the OL, more than 1 RB, a Fullback and/or a TE or two, and the QB taking the snap from under Center. And last but certainly not least, a total disregard for how many defenders line up in the Tackle box.

Now that this has been established, I need to first state that the offense any coach runs needs to be the offense that fits his current personnel best. You can’t run a spread offense just because “everyone else is doing it”, and conversely you probably shouldn’t run the Double Wing if you have spread players. Even with top level college programs, you recruit for what you want to run, but you will always change slightly what you are doing based on the players you have at that time.

Now that the basics have been established, let’s get to the heart of the matter, the benefits/drawbacks of running the spread offense:

Benefits (+’s):

-You spread the defense out and force their 2 nd and 3 rd level defenders to play in space (on an island)

-You spread them out, you have less guys to block when you run the football

-If you use the same players, you don’t need to change personnel groups and therefore can go faster

-The QB is usually 4 or 5 yards away from the line of scrimmage pre-snap, which is where the bad guys are that want to take his head off

-Typically an up-tempo, no-huddle is used which can keep the defense from making any substitutions

-If you don’t huddle, you can signal plays in to speed things up as well

-Spreading out and going up tempo will also usually keep a defense from getting too complex and allow for easier reads for the QB

-The fronts that the QB and OL see will also be simpler to prepare for

-If you use wide splits by the OL, typically the DE’s are no longer a threat to get to the QB

-Run and pass reads become easier for the QB as everything is spread out and not bunched together

-Points tend to come easier for a spread offense as 1 defender screwing up his assignment is more costly than that defender screwing up vs. a non-spread team

-If your OL can stay low, going out of a 2-point stance allows them to see things better before the snap

-Run- pass option plays work better out of a spread, shot-gun formation

-Uses the whole field, sideline to sideline

-Allows you to get more reps during practice by going no-huddle

-If you have smaller Offensive linemen than normal, this offense can help

-If you have the personnel, who doesn’t like the spread?

Drawbacks (-‘s):

-If your QB is having a bad day, your offense is having a bad day

-If the weather is bad and your QB doesn’t throw a wet ball well, you could be in trouble

-If you go 3 and out, you haven’t used much time up and your defense is right back out on the field

-Some Coaches say: “three things happen when you throw the ball, two are bad”

-If a defense is running a 3-5, you will have trouble outflanking them without a TE

-If your Center is having a tough time snapping the ball, you could be in trouble if you haven’t practiced taking snaps from under Center

-If you do go under Center at all you are usually running a QB sneak and the defense knows it

-Harder to sell play-action passes from shot-gun, pistol can be easier but not as good as under Center

-If you do need to take time off the clock, may be hard to do if you haven’t practiced it

-Run game is a little limited without a TE and/or a FB

-Must get creative to get a lead blocker on run plays (pulling a backside Guard or Tackle to substitute a Fullback)

-If their skill players are better than yours, it’s going to be a long day

-If they can play man coverage and bring all the rest of their defense on a blitz, you are in trouble!

-If you get into any short yardage/goal line situations, you may have a hard time unless you have bigger personnel available

-You don’t huddle and some coaches think that this helps to bring an offense together

-If you don’t have a QB that can learn to make proper checks and play under pressure you’re in trouble