Damon Stoudamire

slugboy

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I suspect he will want wing players that can create their own shot, put the ball on the floor, drive the paint. Spot shooters not so much if that's all they can do. He was a really good player on college. I don't remember how well he could shoot but he ran the offense very well.
He could shoot until he got to the Trailblazers. His minutes and points went down when he went to the Trailblazers, but he put up some great numbers for many seasons and played for 13 years.



Also
 
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alagold

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I really enjoyed his introductory press conference. Great to see him reference GT's rich history and so many of the guys who have gone on to successful pro careers. More than that, I think his relationships with some of those guys could prove to be HUGE. Tech has a lot of guys who have made a lot of money in the NBA. Even a guy like Derrick Favors has made over $120MM. If we can get those guys to start investing back into the program, I think that could be huge in terms of NIL. Could really be a game changer and seems Stoudamire has the connections and reputation to maybe make that happen. D3's comments reflect those conversations may already be happening. For reference, Mark Teixeira has done tremendous things for our baseball program all on his own. A few NBA guys buying in like Bosh, Favors, Young, Jack, etc. could be huge, not to mention the legends like Anderson, Scott, Price, Best, etc. etc.
Very good points.Certainly aside to consider.
 

Roswellgoldmember

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I'm cautiously optimistic about this hire.
It was definitely a little out of the box, but also was clearly what Batt wanted.



This is a much more experienced coach than I expected us to go after.
NBA experience, asst experience at 2 different high major type schools.
HC experience at a very hard to win at mid-major.

The last point may be the most important to me right now. Saw a comment recently where it was said you should pay alot of attention to the type of place a coach had to coach at rather than just looking at the record. Not every coach is going to be a good fit at every stop.
So for a coach coming to GT (which has a reputation in the industry as a relatively hard P5 job to coach at), getting someone who understands coaching at a tough place is likely a plus.

If a coach wins big at a place where multiple coaches have won big, you have to take into account how much of the winning is due to the coach and how much due to the place. Had never really thought like that before but it makes some sense.

I have no idea if this is going to be a single, double, HR or a whiff - but i'm happy that Batt seemed to know exactly what he wanted to do and went out and got it done quickly.
This is the first time since the Hewitt hire that we hired someone that the fans of his previous employer were sad to see him leave.

I would also expect that given his relationship with Pastner (which is pretty ironic), that if any of the current players ask Pastner about Stoudamire that they are likely to get positive feedback. Makes it more likely we keep players we want to keep.

I have no expectations until we see who leaves and who is brought in, as well as who is hired as assts. After that all settles down this summer than i'll start thinking about expectations.
His hire is almost certainly going to create a higher profile in the media for GT.

I don't really get why GT would be considered a hard P5 basketball job other than maybe NIL.
 

slugboy

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I don't really get why GT would be considered a hard P5 basketball job other than maybe NIL.
We’ve neglected the basketball program for a decade. We’d started to neglect it even when Hewitt was here. It can be rebuilt, but it’s not a “ready to move in” program—it needs some work.

The good news is it looks like we’re doing it.

The basketball rebuild should be an easier rebuild than the football rebuild.

While I’m in the neighborhood, …
I'm cautiously optimistic about this hire.
It was definitely a little out of the box, but also was clearly what Batt wanted.



This is a much more experienced coach than I expected us to go after.
NBA experience, asst experience at 2 different high major type schools.
HC experience at a very hard to win at mid-major.

The last point may be the most important to me right now. Saw a comment recently where it was said you should pay alot of attention to the type of place a coach had to coach at rather than just looking at the record. Not every coach is going to be a good fit at every stop.
So for a coach coming to GT (which has a reputation in the industry as a relatively hard P5 job to coach at), getting someone who understands coaching at a tough place is likely a plus.

If a coach wins big at a place where multiple coaches have won big, you have to take into account how much of the winning is due to the coach and how much due to the place. Had never really thought like that before but it makes some sense.

I have no idea if this is going to be a single, double, HR or a whiff - but i'm happy that Batt seemed to know exactly what he wanted to do and went out and got it done quickly.
This is the first time since the Hewitt hire that we hired someone that the fans of his previous employer were sad to see him leave.

I would also expect that given his relationship with Pastner (which is pretty ironic), that if any of the current players ask Pastner about Stoudamire that they are likely to get positive feedback. Makes it more likely we keep players we want to keep.

I have no expectations until we see who leaves and who is brought in, as well as who is hired as assts. After that all settles down this summer than i'll start thinking about expectations.
His hire is almost certainly going to create a higher profile in the media for GT.


I thought the hire was opportunistic, but if this report is accurate then Batt really did some up-front planning and got one of his top candidates—maybe his #1.
 
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RamblinRed

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I don't really get why GT would be considered a hard P5 basketball job other than maybe NIL.
Academics (both in terms of requirements and major/classes for students who are here).
Coaches are well aware that they cannot recruit all the same prospects they potentially can at many other P5 schools both out of HS and from the portal. I know there have been potential portal transfers who were interested in GT but were going to have to take extra summer classes in order to be eligible here so they ultimately chose other schools where they were not going to need to take extra courses to be eligible.

This comment from Matt Norlander after Pastner was fired sums it up nicely.
"Though the program does have some good seasons over the years to its name, and even despite its location in Atlanta, Georgia Tech is considered a tough power-conference job due to high admissions standards, tougher coursework than many high-major programs and, therefore, a narrower pathway to entry for recruits and transfers. "
 

RamblinRed

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The more I dig into Stoudamire's time at Pacific the more impressed I become with what he accomplished there.
He walked into an awful situation.
The previous HC (and one of his assts) were fired by the school for helping players cheat to be eligible. Both would ultimately get show cause penalties from the NCAA
Pacific was 8-20 the year before he arrived.
They had a reduction of 6 scholarships over 3 years (so he didn't have a full complement of scholarships until year 4), was on Probation through 2019 and also had recruiting visit reductions in place as well.
This is also a school that is not considered a historically "good" basketball school.

He improved the program by alot over his 5 years. The last 2 years his KenPom/RPI ratings were
117/97
120/98

Compare that to his first year
246/224

Or the last 2 years before he took over under the prior coach
227/265
240/253

You have to go back over a decade to find a year in the same range as his 19-20 team in terms of wins. You have to go back almost 15 years 2 find a two year period with ratings as high as his last 2 seasons.

I'll also note that since he left Pacific the program has dropped off considerably.
This year their ratings are 185/227 and the prior year 293/327

The metrics show a program that was improving slowly, but steadily its first 3 years and then took a big jump in yr 4 (likely at least partially due to all the restrictions expiring).
 

Roswellgoldmember

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Academics (both in terms of requirements and major/classes for students who are here).
Coaches are well aware that they cannot recruit all the same prospects they potentially can at many other P5 schools both out of HS and from the portal. I know there have been potential portal transfers who were interested in GT but were going to have to take extra summer classes in order to be eligible here so they ultimately chose other schools where they were not going to need to take extra courses to be eligible.

This comment from Matt Norlander after Pastner was fired sums it up nicely.
"Though the program does have some good seasons over the years to its name, and even despite its location in Atlanta, Georgia Tech is considered a tough power-conference job due to high admissions standards, tougher coursework than many high-major programs and, therefore, a narrower pathway to entry for recruits and transfers. "
I might buy this more if Cremins and Hewitt didn't have what 19 NBA first round draft picks combined?
 

kg01

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I might buy this more if Cremins and Hewitt didn't have what 19 NBA first round draft picks combined?

The landscape they operated in bares no resemblance to what those after them dealt with.

I say that as one who doesn't excuse the middling results, but who acknowledges the eras are apples-to-oranges comps.
 

dtm1997

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The landscape they operated in bares no resemblance to what those after them dealt with.

I say that as one who doesn't excuse the middling results, but who acknowledges the eras are apples-to-oranges comps.
Yep.
 

g0lftime

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Five * guys don't care. They only need to stay eligible 1 or 2 years anyway. Top players out of HS only want a quick year into the NBA. Transfers are more mature and have adjusted to college life plus are not one and done types. Only a few schools can survive on the one and done model. Even Kentucky is struggling with that model. Duke does best at it now but they are getting 3 or 4 top 20 recruits every year. Even the transfer model is risky year to year. Sure has bailed out Keatts and Capel this year though. It can turn us around real quick with the right guys out of the portal.
 

Augusta_Jacket

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Five * guys don't care. They only need to stay eligible 1 or 2 years anyway through the end of the first semester. Top players out of HS only want a quick year into the NBA. Transfers are more mature and have adjusted to college life plus are not one and done types. Only a few schools can survive on the one and done model. Even Kentucky is struggling with that model. Duke does best at it now but they are getting 3 or 4 top 20 recruits every year. Even the transfer model is risky year to year. Sure has bailed out Keatts and Capel this year though. It can turn us around real quick with the right guys out of the portal.

FIFY. A lot don't bother much with the second semester since failing out won't hurt them in the draft.
 

Techster

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I thought the hire was opportunistic, but if this report is accurate then Batt really did some up-front planning and got one of his top candidates—maybe his #1.

I'd heard a few months back about Batt gauging the temperature for either keeping or letting Pastner go. In the "When does Pastner feel the heat" thread, I cryptically wrote that the "Writing is on the wall for Pastner"...after I heard Batt was discussing Pastner in the background.

There was a consensus that the program needed a change...IF the money was available and if there was a consensus among key people to move on from Pastner. Pastner the person is very well liked by the people that matter. Batt wanted a change, but there were some things that needed to be worked out, and money was just one of the "things". I've heard that Batt does not make a move unless he already has a plan in place...it was the same for the HFBC search until some important people stepped in to go to bat for Brent Key. Ironically, I think if Batt had gotten any of the FB coaches GT was rumored to have interest in, Pastner would probably still be our coach. GT would have had to pay a buyout for either Chadwell or Fritz, and that meant it would have been a financial burden to fire Pastner. In a way, keeping Brent Key and avoiding any buyout helped GT "shift" some money towards moving on from Pastner.

I'll say this. Stoudamire is set up to have success in terms of access to more resources than what Pastner had.
 

Roswellgoldmember

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The landscape they operated in bares no resemblance to what those after them dealt with.

I say that as one who doesn't excuse the middling results, but who acknowledges the eras are apples-to-oranges comps.
Academics and the choice of majors have become more important since Cremins and Hewitt? If the landscape change means NIL and before that under the table NIl then I can buy that, but it's fixable.
 

kg01

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Academics and the choice of majors have become more important since Cremins and Hewitt? If the landscape change means NIL and before that under the table NIl then I can buy that, but it's fixable.

Easiest way to explain it is there are additional rules and regulations in place now, including some specifically related to the bolded.

As an example, someone posted a few days ago that 1-and-done players only have to go to class for one semester to be eligible their one season. That was true at first, during Hewitt's tenure, but rules were put in place to make that not quite as easy. Actually IIUC, we were penalized due to players leaving in bad academic standing. That rule change imho contributed to a decline in Hewitt's recruiting because kids had to keep going to class.

We've discussed a lot of this on the board ad nauseum over the years. I find it surprising there's still people who believe we can easily replicate what Cremins and Hewitt did recruiting-wise.

Can it be done? Yes, I think so, but it won't be near as easy.

On NIL, I'd say if we were still able to pay under the table we'd be better off. That crinoline sound is all the high-horse posters clutching their pearls. Hehe
 

dtm1997

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Academics and the choice of majors have become more important since Cremins and Hewitt? If the landscape change means NIL and before that under the table NIl then I can buy that, but it's fixable.
Except for the academics, which I'd call manageable for the appropriately motivated players, everything is fixable. The appropriately motivated players, willing to meet the academic standards, is a smaller overall pool and being able, doesn't mean wanting to.

The will & investment to fix that which is fixable has been lacking significantly, dating back to Hewitt's firing or a bit earlier.

The lack of will & investment has created a long-standing view that the GT job is not a good one. Investment has long been needed in staff salaries, staff positions, bag dropping (now NIL), recruiting budget (better travel, database & scouting access, etc.) facilities (locker room, trainings, etc.; Not McCamish where we watching games).

Net net - perception is reality. The GT job is difficult and viewed as lower tier among High Majors. That said, it has plenty of potential to be elevated with the right vision, will, and investment.

Seems we may be at that inflection point to head towards good job status (it will always be difficult to a degree), but let's see if it comes through.
 
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