Conference Realignment

[LT 1967]

Thanks!

 

[forensicbuzz]

Wouldn't that just be moving back to Division 1A and 1AA, with FCS being 1AAA?

 

[orientalnc]

Wouldn't that just be moving back to Division 1A and 1AA, with FCS being 1AAA?

Given the reality of D1, this at least gives the G5 schools a championship they can aim for. Today it's a "nobody cares" bowl game.

 

[jgtengineer]

Given the reality of D1, this at least gives the G5 schools a championship they can aim for. Today it's a "nobody cares" bowl game.

Actually this wouldn't be a bad idea.

CFP = Top 12 teams with the big boys getting their buy ins.
College Football Cup =8 teams G5 Champions not included in CFP and Invitational other teams including potentially FCS schools( potentially moving up that are barred form the fcs championship). Uses bowl sites for games from round 2 up

Individual Bowls

FCS Championship

 

[LT 1967]

Wouldn't that just be moving back to Division 1A and 1AA, with FCS being 1AAA?

Agree. From the article looks they are also pretty unhappy with the 1.8M per team they will receive from the new CFP formula. Like the ACC is probably unhappy with their share. I guess we are all looking for more cash in the new College Football world.

 

[Techster]

Interesting proposal concerning the Group of Five Teams breaking away and setting up their own Playoff. Apparently, Derreck Dooley is trying to organize this with Private equity involvement.

This may be a far-out proposal but this is an interesting read by Dennis Dodd of CBS. See Attached.

This is the group most likely in danger in the current media driven revenue system. I think this is where you'll see the most consolidation, and media companies outright dropping conferences to save on costs. With all the changes of NIL, Portal, and Realignment, I think it's this level that will feel it most...and I'm not optimistic for them.

 

[iceeater1969]

This is the group most likely in danger in the current media driven revenue system. I think this is where you'll see the most consolidation, and media companies outright dropping conferences to save on costs. With all the changes of NIL, Portal, and Realignment, I think it's this level that will feel it most...and I'm not optimistic for them.

Them?
They?
We owe $250,000,000?
If tv mony reduces, Gt is they = them.
Even if same tv money, we are not viable unless we get some legislation like Virginia that deams P5 sports a worth part of a college expierence.

 

[WreckinGT]

Another lawsuit to put on the stack. This time from the Florida AG.

Florida’s Attorney General files lawsuit against the ACC

Florida's state attorney general accuses the ACC of 'wrongfully withholding these important public records'

247sports.com

 

[CEB]

Another lawsuit to put on the stack. This time from the Florida AG.

Florida’s Attorney General files lawsuit against the ACC

Florida's state attorney general accuses the ACC of 'wrongfully withholding these important public records'

247sports.com

Not wading through the complaint but I find it very interesting that the Florida AG is doing this.
Not an attorney but the ACC is asking for an exit fee based on conference bylaws (as I understand) and any additional amount is based upon the value of FSUs media rights under the GOR… nothing to do with ESPN deal.
It seems like a lot of important high priced legal types are just having fun producing paper in the hopes that someone (the ACC) screws up.

 

[Techster]

Not wading through the complaint but I find it very interesting that the Florida AG is doing this.
Not an attorney but the ACC is asking for an exit fee based on conference bylaws (as I understand) and any additional amount is based upon the value of FSUs media rights under the GOR… nothing to do with ESPN deal.
It seems like a lot of important high priced legal types are just having fun producing paper in the hopes that someone (the ACC) screws up.

Florida AG is playing the political game here.

 

[forensicbuzz]

Posturing. FSU and the Florida AG will both lose, and lose big. The ACC is not demanding half a billion dollars. That's something FSU made up thinking that would be the value. If I were the ACC and pushed to it, I'd demand 5 Billion dollars to let them out. Hell, they hold all the cards. If FSU wants out that badly, they can pay through the nose for it. Otherwise, shut the hell up and wait until 2036.

 

[WreckinGT]

Not wading through the complaint but I find it very interesting that the Florida AG is doing this.
Not an attorney but the ACC is asking for an exit fee based on conference bylaws (as I understand) and any additional amount is based upon the value of FSUs media rights under the GOR… nothing to do with ESPN deal.
It seems like a lot of important high priced legal types are just having fun producing paper in the hopes that someone (the ACC) screws up.

I am actually kind of intrigued by this. Im not sure what FSU's play is here. They have seen the ESPN agreement. They know what is in it. They either want it to be public for whatever reason or they want to put pressure on ESPN to sort this out. Not really sure which.

I am also curious how it will play out. It seems weird that the ACC and ESPN can hide the details of a massive contract that public institutions are obviously a party to. If that is fine then what is stopping every public school from just setting up private shell companies to hide whatever they want from FOIA requests?

 

[RonJohn]

I am also curious how it will play out. It seems weird that the ACC and ESPN can hide the details of a massive contract that public institutions are obviously a party to. If that is fine then what is stopping every public school from just setting up private shell companies to hide whatever they want from FOIA requests?

It happens all the time in public schools. Public schools buy Chromebooks. They bid out the Chromebooks and probably purchase from the lowest priced vendor. (FSU assigned their rights to the ACC.) Are the Chromebook vendors required to disclose their purchase price, all costs incurred getting the Chromebooks to the school, and their profit? (ACC contracted with ESPN) Are the Chromebook manufacturers required to provide public detailed accounting of every component that they used, and the costs to assemble, ship, and store the Chromebooks before selling them? Are the component manufacturers required to have open books to the public?

How many levels past the public institution do you believe that FOIA requests should be allowed? If probably wouldn't take very many before your personal finances would become public record. FSU did not sign an agreement with ESPN directly.

 

[WreckinGT]

It happens all the time in public schools. Public schools buy Chromebooks. They bid out the Chromebooks and probably purchase from the lowest priced vendor. (FSU assigned their rights to the ACC.) Are the Chromebook vendors required to disclose their purchase price, all costs incurred getting the Chromebooks to the school, and their profit? (ACC contracted with ESPN) Are the Chromebook manufacturers required to provide public detailed accounting of every component that they used, and the costs to assemble, ship, and store the Chromebooks before selling them? Are the component manufacturers required to have open books to the public?

How many levels past the public institution do you believe that FOIA requests should be allowed? If probably wouldn't take very many before your personal finances would become public record. FSU did not sign an agreement with ESPN directly.

That analogy doesnt make any sense. Surely you can submit a FOIA request to obtain the contracts or purchase orders schools have with vendors. How the vendor they chose obtained chromebooks or manufactured them isn’t really relevant. The ACC isn’t a vendor selling a product to FSU. It is a third party negotiating contracts on FSUs behalf. Contracts that impact a public institution for hundreds of millions of dollars. Can you really avoid FOIA and sunshine laws for nearly anything just by creating a private company to act as a man in the middle? Seems questionable. I guess a judge will answer that soon.

 

[RonJohn]

That analogy doesnt make any sense. Surely you can submit a FOIA request to obtain the contracts or purchase orders schools have with vendors. How the vendor they chose obtained chromebooks or manufactured them isn’t really relevant. The ACC isn’t a vendor selling a product to FSU. It is a third party negotiating contracts on FSUs behalf. Contracts that impact a public institution for hundreds of millions of dollars. Can you really avoid FOIA and sunshine laws for nearly anything just by creating a private company to act as a man in the middle? Seems questionable. I guess a judge will answer that soon.

I guess that is one way to look at it. However, I think you are missing what the GOR document says, and what that means. FSU assigned their rights to the copyrights of their sports broadcasts to the ACC. In copyright speak, they gave those rights to the ACC. The ACC now owns those rights outright. FSU does not own the rights at all. The negotiations with ESPN were for the benefit of the owner of the copyrights (the ACC), not the benefit of the individual schools who gave away all rights to their game broadcasts. In other words, the ACC negotiated with ESPN for the benefit of the ACC, not the benefit of FSU. The ACC is not acting as a "middle-man". The ACC is the entity that owns the broadcast rights to those sports events.

You can make an argument that FSU is a member of the ACC, so any contract that it engages in should be public information. Consider what would happen if the Florida AG were to join an organization of domestic abuse protection lawyers. Would that mean that all of the documents of that organization would become public, just because a Florida official was a member?

You can make the argument that you are making in court, and that is what the Florida AG is doing. I'm not a lawyer, but I'm not convinced that she will win that argument. It will be an interesting legal case. I also think there is a decent chance that ESPN, or the ACC will try to have his lawsuit moved to federal court.

In an earlier post you said that you aren't sure what FSU's play here is. I have been saying that for a long time. FSU is putting pressure on ESPN, and I don't believe that the Florida AG is acting solely on her own. Is ESPN going to be eager to have FSU in the SEC? Is ESPN going to be concerned that as soon as FSU isn't happy about something that they will attempt to make the SEC-ESPN contract public? Are Fox, NBC, and CBS going to be eager to have FSU in the Big10, for the same reasons? FSU is burning so many bridges that they might end up as an island.

 

[CEB]

I am actually kind of intrigued by this. Im not sure what FSU's play is here. They have seen the ESPN agreement. They know what is in it. They either want it to be public for whatever reason or they want to put pressure on ESPN to sort this out. Not really sure which.

I am also curious how it will play out. It seems weird that the ACC and ESPN can hide the details of a massive contract that public institutions are obviously a party to. If that is fine then what is stopping every public school from just setting up private shell companies to hide whatever they want from FOIA requests?

I’m intrigued by it too… especially because I think they’re just playing a game to try to get the ACC to do something that will bring heat from ESPN. It’s funny to me that it’s escalated all the way to the Florida AG.
The whole thing feels like a ruse to make the ACC (and possibly ESPN also) uncomfortable.

I disagree that ACC members are “obviously a party” to the ESPN deal… they essentially “sold” their work product to the ACC in exchange for future profit sharing… but we’ve been over that.

 

[LT 1967]

Another lawsuit to put on the stack. This time from the Florida AG.

One thing that I found Interesting about the article was the statement that the Florida AG had alerted the Attorneys General in 6 other states. There are 9 other states that have ACC Schools including Indiana.

A previous article by Ross Dellenger mentioned that the "Magnificent 7" had discussed the possibility of an ACC reformation to a smaller but more valuable 8-to-10-member conference (See 2 Pages of the article attached).

Could the 6 states that were alerted by the Florida AG be Georgia, SC, NC, VA, KY, PA. You could create a pretty good conference with a more Football oriented 10 team conference with GT, Clemson, FSU, Miami, VT, NCS, UNC, UVA, Louisville, PITT. Six of these teams have traditionally been Football oriented including GT, Clemson, FSU, Miami, VT, and PITT. If you could hold on to ND for 4 to 5 games per year, you would have some pretty good matchups for TV. Plus, play 9 conference round robin games and have a true champion.

Could FSU and Clemson be trying to reform the ACC rather than join the SEC or B1G? Would this new group of teams be more valuable per Team than the current ACC?

This is just a dream I had, probably due to my traditionalist leanings. I just regret the way that all this has unfolded. We no longer have conferences. We have some type of monstrosities
with unbalanced and unfair schedules with no true conference Champion. All built around Greed or Fear.

 

[yeti92]

One thing that I found Interesting about the article was the statement that the Florida AG had alerted the Attorneys General in 6 other states. There are 9 other states that have ACC Schools including Indiana.

I count 12 states:

Florida
Georgia
South Carolina
North Carolina
Virginia
Kentucky
Pennyslvania
New York
Massachusetts
Indiana
California
Texas

 

[WreckinGT]

I guess that is one way to look at it. However, I think you are missing what the GOR document says, and what that means. FSU assigned their rights to the copyrights of their sports broadcasts to the ACC. In copyright speak, they gave those rights to the ACC. The ACC now owns those rights outright. FSU does not own the rights at all. The negotiations with ESPN were for the benefit of the owner of the copyrights (the ACC), not the benefit of the individual schools who gave away all rights to their game broadcasts. In other words, the ACC negotiated with ESPN for the benefit of the ACC, not the benefit of FSU. The ACC is not acting as a "middle-man". The ACC is the entity that owns the broadcast rights to those sports events.

You can make an argument that FSU is a member of the ACC, so any contract that it engages in should be public information. Consider what would happen if the Florida AG were to join an organization of domestic abuse protection lawyers. Would that mean that all of the documents of that organization would become public, just because a Florida official was a member?

You can make the argument that you are making in court, and that is what the Florida AG is doing. I'm not a lawyer, but I'm not convinced that she will win that argument. It will be an interesting legal case. I also think there is a decent chance that ESPN, or the ACC will try to have his lawsuit moved to federal court.

In an earlier post you said that you aren't sure what FSU's play here is. I have been saying that for a long time. FSU is putting pressure on ESPN, and I don't believe that the Florida AG is acting solely on her own. Is ESPN going to be eager to have FSU in the SEC? Is ESPN going to be concerned that as soon as FSU isn't happy about something that they will attempt to make the SEC-ESPN contract public? Are Fox, NBC, and CBS going to be eager to have FSU in the Big10, for the same reasons? FSU is burning so many bridges that they might end up as an island.

The ACC doesn't just have full authority to do whatever they want with the members rights. All material media rights agreements and updates have to be approved by the members themselves. The original contract was approved by the members and presumably updates were approved as well. Well except the ESPN option extension which Jim Philips has deemed non material for some reason. Saying now that the members are not a party to the contract which they had to approve, and which they get benefits from is a stretch.

 

[orientalnc]

The ACC doesn't just have full authority to do whatever they want with the members rights. All material media rights agreements and updates have to be approved by the members themselves. The original contract was approved by the members and presumably updates were approved as well. Well except the ESPN option extension which Jim Philips has deemed non material for some reason. Saying now that the members are not a party to the contract which they had to approve, and which they get benefits from is a stretch.

The ACC BOT is made up of ACC member school reps. Every member was a part of the extension decision.