College football is a mess

[stinger78]

That’s the heart of the CFB mess. Polling is a subjective ranking with no criteria used. It simply the average of what 61 people think. And their opinion is often no better than a waitress at your local bar.

CFB really does need to do away with the polls (which are great for ginning up interest) and the bowls. Both are legacy. And they continue to spark controversy.

Four conferences, play 8 games, no FCS opponents. Just 8 conference opponents. Top 2 advance to a single elimination playoff. The only poll that matters then is the seeding.

!!!
This is what I’ve been advocating forever, but I get this incessant feedback of 1) this will not create enough financial interest, and money counts, and 2) the #3-4 teams in the SEC are very often better teams and deserve a shot at it.

 

[Augusta_Jacket]

Four conferences, play 8 games, no FCS opponents. Just 8 conference opponents. Top 2 advance to a single elimination playoff. The only poll that matters then is the seeding.

This would be a great idea if there were only 36-40 teams playing FBS football. Since there are approximately 65 schools at the "P5" level, and 130+ at the FBS level, having a playoff without some sort of poll is impossible.....

Unless, you had 8 conferences and the conference champions advanced to a single elimination playoff. But there's no way the money conferences want to lose spots to FBS schools, so....

Some sort of poll is inevitable when dealing with a sport like football where a limited amount of games and a large amount of teams makes it impossible to determine how good someone actually is. I mean, we are debating how "good" a 13-1 uga team was last year.

 

[Vespidae]

This would be a great idea if there were only 36-40 teams playing FBS football. Since there are approximately 65 schools at the "P5" level, and 130+ at the FBS level, having a playoff without some sort of poll is impossible.....

Unless, you had 8 conferences and the conference champions advanced to a single elimination playoff. But there's no way the money conferences want to lose spots to FBS schools, so....

Some sort of poll is inevitable when dealing with a sport like football where a limited amount of games and a large amount of teams makes it impossible to determine how good someone actually is. I mean, we are debating how "good" a 13-1 uga team was last year.

The NFL doesn't have a poll. There's a reason why Pottsville doesn't have a League team anymore.

It's a reality that of the 100+ teams in FBS, 70ish of them are not competitive. And never will be. An easy way to handle that is to use the Premier league system and let those teams earn their way into conference spots. Or simply create another division. But we are managing to the Exception and that's always time consuming and unproductive.

 

[TampaBuzz]

That’s the heart of the CFB mess. Polling is a subjective ranking with no criteria used. It simply the average of what 61 people think. And their opinion is often no better than a waitress at your local bar.

CFB really does need to do away with the polls (which are great for ginning up interest) and the bowls. Both are legacy. And they continue to spark controversy.

Four conferences, play 8 games, no FCS opponents. Just 8 conference opponents. Top 2 advance to a single elimination playoff. The only poll that matters then is the seeding.

I am with you. My only change would be to blow up all of the existing conferences and create eight (8) new conferences of about 16 teams each. Eight conference champs to the playoff. Everyone else goes home (or a bowl game). If you don't win the conference championship you are out. The idea is to eliminate outside influences in the selection process - you gotta win on the field to get into the tournament. No beauty pageants, no personal perceptions of which team is better, no ESPN lobbying/payoffs, no discussion. If your team wins their conference (regardless of record), they are in.

 

[Northeast Stinger]

I am with you. My only change would be to blow up all of the existing conferences and create eight (8) new conferences of about 16 teams each. Eight conference champs to the playoff. Everyone else goes home (or a bowl game). If you don't win the conference championship you are out. The idea is to eliminate outside influences in the selection process - you gotta win on the field to get into the tournament. No beauty pageants, no personal perceptions of which team is better, no ESPN lobbying/payoffs, no discussion. If your team wins their conference (regardless of record), they are in.

Sigh.

This is too logical.

There’s an analogy here somewhere involving money. Safe investing with a certified financial planner is steady and boring. Meanwhile your best friend’s former high school girlfriend has a great uncle who invested heavily in IPOs and bitcoin and made millions.

The format you mention is the boring investment with fairly reliable results. The powers that be, however, know there is a “financial interest” in a more flamboyant and flashy approach. The results are more suspect but the payoff is huge for them if enough people are suckered into investing in this system.

We, so far, have gotten a system that always promises more than it can deliver.

 

[TampaBuzz]

Sigh.

This is too logical.

There’s an analogy here somewhere involving money. Safe investing with a certified financial planner is steady and boring. Meanwhile your best friend’s former high school girlfriend has a great uncle who invested heavily in IPOs and bitcoin and made millions.

The format you mention is the boring investment with fairly reliable results. The powers that be, however, know there is a “financial interest” in a more flamboyant and flashy approach. The results are more suspect but the payoff is huge for them if enough people are suckered into investing in this system.

We, so far, have gotten a system that always promises more than it can deliver.

Oh....I know. My cynical self recognizes that the desire for riches and power overrides all else. My idealist self still clings to the concept of a truly "amateur" college athletic system where everyone gets an equal opportunity (and it seems to exist for every sport except football). Don't beat my up folks....I know...that train left the station ages ago!

 

[Augusta_Jacket]

The NFL doesn't have a poll. There's a reason why Pottsville doesn't have a League team anymore.

See the full text of my reply to your post and then tell me how many teams the NFL has.

Reclassifying the 70 G5 FBS schools is possible, but not at all likely. Getting the P5 down to a manageable 30-40 isn't ever going to happen.

Polls aren't going away.

 

[Vespidae]

See the full text of my reply to your post and then tell me how many teams the NFL has.

Reclassifying the 70 G5 FBS schools is possible, but not at all likely. Getting the P5 down to a manageable 30-40 isn't ever going to happen.

Polls aren't going away.

I didn't say polls were going away. They are a great marketing instrument to help maintain interest. But they should go away if one wants more objectivity in the rankings.

 

[Root4GT]

That’s the heart of the CFB mess. Polling is a subjective ranking with no criteria used. It simply the averaggive up 2 or 3 home games evee of what 61 people think. And their opinion is often no better than a waitress at your local bar.

CFB really does need to do away with the polls (which are great for ginning up interest) and the bowls. Both are legacy. And they continue to spark controversy.

Four conferences, play 8 games, no FCS opponents. Just 8 conference opponents. Top 2 advance to a single elimination playoff. The only poll that matters then is the seeding.

That idea has a snowball's chance in Hell of gaining any traction. Why would any school want to give up 2 or 3 home games every season. For the schools that draw 90K plus it would be stupidly insane.
Solutions to fix perception problems that cost millions for a lot of teams are senseless.

 

[Vespidae]

That idea has a snowball's chance in Hell of gaining any traction. Why would any school want to give up 2 or 3 home games every season. For the schools that draw 90K plus it would be stupidly insane.
Solutions to fix perception problems that cost millions for a lot of teams are senseless.

Which is why CFB remains in the mess it is.

 

[Root4GT]

Which is why CFB remains in the mess it is.

That depends on who views it as a mess any why? If expecting college football to have a level playing field is a goal. that is fantasy and has always been fantasy.

Individual schools have made moves between conferences because they think they will get far more revenue. That is on the individual schools. That is why GT joined the ACC in 1979/80. That is wht conferences were formed in the first place.

Money matters and has always been the driver in college football. College football funds basically the rest of most schools Athletic programs. FCS schools schedule games at P% tems to get paid knowing they will 99% lose to fund their programs.

What exactly is the intent of your proposal? If it is to decide a "true" National Champion, why is that more important then schools funding numerous athletic programs?

 

[YJMD]

3-5-7-??? This is an easy series. The only question is do we get 9 in the regular season and lose a bowl or get 8 in the regular season and 1 in the post season. I don't think 7 could possibly get us to conference championship or playoff so I won't consider those crazy scenarios.

 

[Vespidae]

That depends on who views it as a mess any why? If expecting college football to have a level playing field is a goal. that is fantasy and has always been fantasy.

Individual schools have made moves between conferences because they think they will get far more revenue. That is on the individual schools. That is why GT joined the ACC in 1979/80. That is wht conferences were formed in the first place.

Money matters and has always been the driver in college football. College football funds basically the rest of most schools Athletic programs. FCS schools schedule games at P% tems to get paid knowing they will 99% lose to fund their programs.

What exactly is the intent of your proposal? If it is to decide a "true" National Champion, why is that more important then schools funding numerous athletic programs?

Hmmm.

Not entirely true. Tech did not leave the SEC over money. Tech left because of Rule 140. Once an independent, Tech saw its facilities become worn and outdated. I was there. Truly dreadful. And “dreadful“ is kind.

Tech, once described as the Notre Dame of Southern football, was desperate for relevance, tried to get back into the SEC but couldn’t. The ACC, formed because the old Southern Conference banned postseason play, extended a lifesaving invite. There were no ESPN media deals in 1980. Attendance and gate drove the financials.

My post is in response to those who aspire to an objective National Champion. The NCAA has never tried to organize a true natty. Instead, we have polls (formed to sell newspaper), bowls (to reward postseason and generate charity for local organizations), etc.

If one wants a true Natty, change it. If not, don’t. But ..

As NIL becomes a larger issue, and it will, you can say goodbye to downstream sports. You can’t afford wome’s swimming when the starting QB makes $4 million a year. High schools solved this 100 years ago. Colleges can’t.

 

[Root4GT]

Hmmm.

Not entirely true. Tech did not leave the SEC over money. Tech left because of Rule 140. Once an independent, Tech saw its facilities become worn and outdated. I was there. Truly dreadful. And “dreadful“ is kind.

Tech, once described as the Notre Dame of Southern football, was desperate for relevance, tried to get back into the SEC but couldn’t. The ACC, formed because the old Southern Conference banned postseason play, extended a lifesaving invite. There were no ESPN media deals in 1980. Attendance and gate drove the financials.

My post is in response to those who aspire to an objective National Champion. The NCAA has never tried to organize a true natty. Instead, we have polls (formed to sell newspaper), bowls (to reward postseason and generate charity for local organizations), etc.

If one wants a true Natty, change it. If not, don’t. But ..

As NIL becomes a larger issue, and it will, you can say goodbye to downstream sports. You can’t afford wome’s swimming when the starting QB makes $4 million a year. High schools solved this 100 years ago. Colleges can’t.

Schools don't pay players in any sport. The NIL intent is for actual use of the name not collectives dolling out money. I gather you are saying Boosters will stop giving to School AAs? That is the only way any other program would be dropped. TV revenue has climbed much higher so there is a lot of revenue within the AAs. It's up to each AA to decide how to use the money.

PS - I said teams JOIN conferences for the money - that's why GT joined the ACC. Never mentioned GT going independent as anyone could predict that would be a huge losing proposition. Dodd was a very good coach. A very lousy Administrator.

 

[Vespidae]

Schools don't pay players in any sport. The NIL intent is for actual use of the name not collectives dolling out money. I gather you are saying Boosters will stop giving to School AAs? That is the only way any other program would be dropped. TV revenue has climbed much higher so there is a lot of revenue within the AAs. It's up to each AA to decide how to use the money.

PS - I said teams JOIN conferences for the money - that's why GT joined the ACC. Never mentioned GT going independent as anyone could predict that would be a huge losing proposition. Dodd was a very good coach. A very lousy Administrator.s

I’m curious. Exactly how much annually did GT receive joining the ACC?

The rest of your post is conjecture.

 

[Root4GT]

I’m curious. Exactly how much annually did GT receive joining the ACC?

The rest of your post is conjecture.

I don't have a number off hand but we were on the fast track to going broke as a Division 1 Program before we joined the ACC.

Ga. Tech Made 8th Member of Enriched ACC

 

[Vespidae]

When did you graduate?

 

[Northeast Stinger]

When did you graduate?

Now it’s getting personal

 

[Vespidae]

Now it’s getting personal

Not personal. Just the opposite. Many on this board only have the experience of “modern” Tech after, and in some cases long after, Tech joined the ACC. It’s because I don’t want to get personal that I’m interested to know. And he doesn’t have to respond.

 

[Northeast Stinger]

Not personal. Just the opposite. Many on this board only have the experience of “modern” Tech after, and in some cases long after, Tech joined the ACC. It’s because I don’t want to get personal that I’m interested to know. And he doesn’t have to respond.

It was a joke.