College football is a mess

[stinger78]

"even if the ACC becomes relegated to second tier"

As Ricky Bobby said "if you aren't first, you're last". Reality is no one will give a **** and there is nothing that will look more ridiculous than a $75M athletic building overlooking a stadium that averages less than 20K per game in attendance. GT is literally fighting for its athletic relevance.

When’s the last time GA Tech was first in football? We’ve been there 4 times in over a hundred and thirty plus years.

 

[MWBATL]

When’s the last time GA Tech was first in football? We’ve been there 4 times in over a hundred and thirty plus years.

There’s a difference between “being first” and being competitive. We were generally competitive with top programs. As recently as 2016 we were top 20.

To look at what happens when a college gives up on its major sport, look (for example) at Tulane, which de-emphasized athletics 50 years ago. The school was competitive in the SEC and with the best programs in the 1930’3 and into the 1940’s. The Sugar Bowl used to be played in TULANE Stadium which had a capacity of over 80,000. The football program fell off the face of the earth when Administration decided to cut back on funding. Donations fell, attendance dropped. W/L records collapsed. When they recently decided to try a little bit harder, and they built a new on campus stadium, they built one with a max capacity of 30,000. And rarely fills it at that.

 

[UgaBlows]

you must consider that even if the ACC becomes relegated to second tier, we can still stay in the ACC if we do not join the big boy table. The ACC will not just cease to exist. Sure it would be a bummer and we wouldn't be as prestigious but we can stay in the ACC and still keep football in the equation.

I think the ACC and Big12 have already been relegated to 2nd tier

 

[MacDaddy2]

I think the ACC and Big12 have already been relegated to 2nd tier

Completely agree and our only chance to remain relevant is to get an invite to one of the big 2.

Think about how awful the new ACC would be: GT, Wake, BC, Pitt, Syracuse, SMU, Cal, Stanford, NCSU and Duke

Teams that would be gone: Miami, FSU, Clemson, UNC, UVA, VT, Louisvile

Our best shot is that the big 2 also decide to throw out certain schools that are not carrying their own weight such as Rutgers, Indiana, Vanderbilt, Minnesota, Arkansas, Miss. St.

 

[stinger78]

Completely agree and our only chance to remain relevant is to get an invite to one of the big 2.

Think about how awful the new ACC would be: GT, Wake, BC, Pitt, Syracuse, SMU, Cal, Stanford, NCSU and Duke

Teams that would be gone: Miami, FSU, Clemson, UNC, UVA, VT, Louisvile

Our best shot is that the big 2 also decide to throw out certain schools that are not carrying their own weight such as Rutgers, Indiana, Vanderbilt, Minnesota, Arkansas, Miss. St.

Where are all those ACC teams going to? There isn’t that much room left in the SEC/B1G cartel. They will not expel schools.

 

[MacDaddy2]

Where are all those ACC teams going to? There isn’t that much room left in the SEC/B1G cartel. They will not expel schools.

SEC currently at 16 while Big 10 is currently at 18. If both go to 20 there are 6 slots up for grabs. Four divisions of 5 teams, 9 conference games per year. Assuming ND gets one of them that leaves 5. My gut tells me Big X adds ND and FSU while SEC adds Miami, UNC, Clemson and VT.

 

[stinger78]

SEC currently at 16 while Big 10 is currently at 18. If both go to 20 there are 6 slots up for grabs. Four divisions of 5 teams, 9 conference games per year. Assuming ND gets one of them that leaves 5. My gut tells me Big X adds ND and FSU while SEC adds Miami, UNC, Clemson and VT.

Maybe… maybe not. It all depends in the benjies and where in the S-curve they see themselves. If any further expansion nets less per team, then probably not. The NFL has two divisions with 32 teams. The SEC/B1G cartel is now at 34 teams. Do they need any more?

 

[forensicbuzz]

When’s the last time GA Tech was first in football? We’ve been there 4 times in over a hundred and thirty plus years.

How many schools can claim more than that? How many can claim at least 1 in the last 35 years?

 

[stinger78]

How many schools can claim more than that? How many can claim at least 1 in the last 35 years?

Sure, but that’s a different argument altogether. The statement was that support will wane if Tech isn’t challenging for number 1. Do you realize that GT has *never* been voted #1 by the AP poll?

 

[stinger78]

GT’s MNC’s have been in 1917, 1928, 1952, and 1990. This is 2024. The gaps between them have been 11, 24, 38, and now 34 years running. It’s not getting more frequent.

 

[yeti92]

GT’s MNC’s have been in 1917, 1928, 1952, and 1990. This is 2024. The gaps between them have been 11, 24, 38, and now 34 years running. It’s not getting more frequent.

Sounds like we are due

 

[forensicbuzz]

GT’s MNC’s have been in 1917, 1928, 1952, and 1990. This is 2024. The gaps between them have been 11, 24, 38, and now 34 years running. It’s not getting more frequent.

Your argument lacks basis. How many teams can claim 4 in their history? How many can claim 1 since 1990? By the way, the NCAA does not recognize 1952.

 

[Northeast Stinger]

Your argument lacks basis. How many teams can claim 4 in their history? How many can claim 1 since 1990? By the way, the NCAA does not recognize 1952.

Princeton claims 28 but NCAA only recognizes 15. Alabama claims a couple that the NCAA doesn’t recognize.

So we are entitled

 

[stinger78]

Your argument lacks basis. How many teams can claim 4 in their history? How many can claim 1 since 1990? By the way, the NCAA does not recognize 1952.

Again, it doesn't lack basis for the argument being made.

If I said that we had no reason to hope for another MNC due to only having 4 in 100+ years, that would be lack of basis. We have more than most other teams, so why can't we hope, too? To say that our folks would stop giving due to not being in the top league and we couldn't pursue the championship when we've only had 4 in 100+ years is a substantially a different statement.

 

[stinger78]

2005
Your argument lacks basis. How many teams can claim 4 in their history? How many can claim 1 since 1990? By the way, the NCAA does not recognize 1952.

To answer your other question for current P5 programs plus service academies, Here's the top 21 that I could find (last year). Note that of these 20, there are 13 since 2000, and 15 more recent than GT. We can all draw our own conclusions as to what this says about our chances today.

1. Alabama 16 (2020)
2. Notre Dame 13 (1988)
3. Michigan 10 (2023)
4. USC 9 (2004)
5. Ohio State 8 (2014)
6. Oklahoma 7 (2000)
7. Minnesota 6 (1960)
8. LSU 5 (2019)
9. Miami 5 (2001)
10. Pittsburgh 5 (1976)
11. Texas 4 (2005)
12. Nebraska 4 (1995)
13. GA Tech 4 (1990) [NCAA recognizes 3]
14. UGA 3 (2022)
15. Clemson 3 (2018)
16. FSU 3 (2103)
17. Florida 3 (2008)
18, Penn State 3 (1986)
19. Michigan State 3 (1966)
20. Army 3 (1945)
21. Illinois 3 (1927)
22. Cal 3 (1921)
23. Auburn 2 (2010)
24. Tennessee 2 (1998)
25. TAMU 2 (1939)

 

[TooTall]

The NCAA doesn't have anything to do with D1 FBS football Championships so I personally don't care what they recognize. BUT all one has to do is look at the GT Giving Day leaderboard if you want a panic attack. https://gtgives.org/giving-day/81248/department/81258
Athletics is 4th behind College of Computing, Roll Call and College of Engineering. More than 1/3 less than the leader.

 

[forensicbuzz]

Again, it doesn't lack basis for the argument being made.

If I said that we had no reason to hope for another MNC due to only having 4 in 100+ years, that would be lack of basis. We have more than most other teams, so why can't we hope, too? To say that our folks would stop giving due to not being in the top league and we couldn't pursue the championship when we've only had 4 in 100+ years is a substantially a different statement.

I understand what you're saying now. I disagree with you. I think if we were in a different league, where we weren't competing at the highest level in football, there would be plenty of high $$ and low $$ contributors who would stop giving.

 

[stinger78]

The NCAA doesn't have anything to do with D1 FBS football Championships so I personally don't care what they recognize. BUT all one has to do is look at the GT Giving Day leaderboard if you want a panic attack. https://gtgives.org/giving-day/81248/department/81258
Athletics is 4th behind College of Computing, Roll Call and College of Engineering. More than 1/3 less than the leader.

I’d say that’s as it should be. GT folks largely keep athletics in perspective, at least better than most.

 

[stinger78]

I understand what you're saying now. I disagree with you. I think if we were in a different league, where we weren't competing at the highest level in football, there would be plenty of high $$ and low $$ contributors who would stop giving.

I’m not sure that would happen, but it would depend, I think, on what else happens around the departure of whoever goes.

I may be surprised, but I can’t see that many more slots opening in The Cartel. Maybe 3-4 at most. I cannot see UNC leaving the three other triangle schools and I can’t see UVA and VPI splitting now that they’re together. So that leaves FSU, Clemson, Miami, and maybe GT to leave the ACC. Basically those who exist in the land of football craziness: GA, FL, and SC.

However, if it’s just FSU, Miami, and Clemson, I see the ACC continuing on as a predominantly basketball conference once again. You would have the following:
UNC, NCSU, Dook, Wake, GT, UVA, VPI, Pitt, Cuse, BC, L’ville, SMU, Cal, and Stanford. That’s 14 schools that have all played some MBB over the years. I could see SMU ultimately going to the B12 and Cal/Stanford eventually rejoining a reorganized P12.

 

[forensicbuzz]

To answer your other question for current P5 programs plus service academies, Here's the top 21 that I could find (last year). Note that of these 20, there are 13 since 2000, and 15 more recent than GT. We can all draw our own conclusions as to what this says about our chances today.

1. Alabama 16 (2020)
2. Notre Dame 13 (1988)
3. Michigan 10 (2023)
4. USC 9 (2004)
5. Ohio State 8 (2014)
6. Oklahoma 7 (2000)
7. Minnesota 6 (1960)
8. LSU 5 (2019)
9. Miami 5 (2001)
10. Pittsburgh 5 (1976)
11. Texas 4 (2005)
12. Nebraska 4 (1995)
13. GA Tech 4 (1990) [NCAA recognizes 3]
14. UGA 3 (2022) <----- 4 unfortunately
15. Clemson 3 (2018)
16. FSU 3 (2103)
17. Florida 3 (2008)
18, Penn State 3 (1986)
19. Michigan State 3 (1966)
20. Army 3 (1945)
21. Illinois 3 (1927)
22. Cal 3 (1921)
23. Auburn 2 (2010)
24. Tennessee 2 (1998)
25. TAMU 2 (1939)