Coach Brent Key Scenario

[bobongo]

Walter Alston only signed one-year contracts when he managed the Dodgers. Retired after 23 one-year contracts, seven pennants and four World Series championships. He said he only wanted one-year contracts because if they didn't want him, he didn't want to be around.

That's impossible in college football. A four-year contract is minimum for recruiting purposes. But a novel approach would be a four- or five-year contract spelling out the terms each year, incentives or whatever, but no buyout. If the coach wanted to walk away and go somewhere else, he would be free to do so without financial encumbrance. Likewise if the AD wanted to let him go. Sort of a throwback to Mr. Alston, one of the best managers baseball ever saw.

 

[g0lftime]

T

You can't go less than four years for recruiting. Maybe he'd take a four year deal. Maybe. Doesn't really matter. Unless he basically wins out, he won't get it. But, put up a good performance and go get another job maybe in G5 and then be ready when we have to hire a new coach in 10 years or whatever.

Transfer portal has changed the recruiting cycles but that may change some when that extra covid year flushes out.

 

[GTLorenzo]

take a second look. I just revised my plan with a three-year reset for a bowl game.

Now what do you think?

You can't hire a head football coach at a Power 5 school on a 3 year contract. You can't do it. You turn in to less than Vanderbilt if you do that. You are effectively de-emphasizing the sport at that point.

 

[GTLorenzo]

Walter Alston only signed one-year contracts when he managed the Dodgers. Retired after 23 one-year contracts, seven pennants and four World Series championships. He said he only wanted one-year contracts because if they didn't want him, he didn't want to be around.

That's impossible in college football. A four-year contract is minimum for recruiting purposes. But a novel approach would be a four- or five-year contract spelling out the terms each year, incentives or whatever, but no buyout. If the coach wanted to walk away and go somewhere else, he would be free to do so without financial encumbrance. Likewise if the AD wanted to let him go. Sort of a throwback to Mr. Alston, one of the best managers baseball ever saw.

Well, our glory years were in the 1950s, so maybe we should give it a shot. Key coaches for a year, Tashard coaches for a year, Weinke coaches for a year.....

"you get to coach for a year and you get to coach for a year and you get to coach for a year......"

 

[bobongo]

Well, our glory years were in the 1950s, so maybe we should give it a shot. Key coaches for a year, Tashard coaches for a year, Weinke coaches for a year.....

"you get to coach for a year and you get to coach for a year and you get to coach for a year......"

Well, I would prefer a long-term coach, but it would be novel to have one not tethered to a buyout. Buyouts are no guarantee a coach is going to be around four years from now, anyway.

 

[GTLorenzo]

Well, I would prefer a long-term coach, but it would be novel to have one not tethered to a buyout. Buyouts are no guarantee a coach is going to be around four years from now, anyway.

Agreed. Contract length plus buyout equals No Stansbury any more.

 

[Randy Carson]

Hard to believe that Tech couldn't win six games in a coach's third year to earn a three-year reset.

We've just seen that happen, of course, but we're talking about making a better hire or fire scenario.

But make it four if you must. Same rules apply.

 

[stinger 1957]

That right there summarizes the coaching criteria perfectly too... that’s about 99% of the battle. If he does it, interviews ought to be over. We can surround the guy who gets the team ready each week with all kinds of people to do the rest.

I'm repeating but I think it that important, we fundamentally need to change some things financially above all else in order to do what you say and I think you are right on about what to do if we have the right leadership, that is todays CFB IMO. Not long ago it wasn't the formula, you could not afford it, but we better give FB everything it needs or the other sports will be out of business when FB crashes, surely those that are making the decisions see that, I sure hope so.

 

[85Escape]

If we went with someone like Key who is extremely unproven then we should definitely look to get a favorable contract. If we want to give someone a sweet contract then we go with someone who has a proven track record as a head coach. We don't have to screw Key to also protect GT. He's a risk and should be part of any bet we take on him. I always negotiate contracts with that in mind...if you are so convinced you are the best option for us then bet on yourself. There's upside if you deliver and risk mitigation for me if you are full of crap. Just make it heavily performance driven. If they don't think they can deliver that performance then we don't want them, right?

 

[RonJohn]

If we went with someone like Key who is extremely unproven then we should definitely look to get a favorable contract. If we want to give someone a sweet contract then we go with someone who has a proven track record as a head coach. We don't have to screw Key to also protect GT. He's a risk and should be part of any bet we take on him. I always negotiate contracts with that in mind...if you are so convinced you are the best option for us then bet on yourself. There's upside if you deliver and risk mitigation for me if you are full of crap. Just make it heavily performance driven. If they don't think they can deliver that performance then we don't want them, right?

I don't think there are many that would argue that you should get a favorable contract. The problem is that your idea of favorable vs non-favorable is not in the ballpark of the current market. For all of the belief that Collin's was making too much money for his experience, his salary for 2022 was number 61 in FBS football for a head coach. There are a few AAC schools with higher salaries. Liberty is paying their HC more. I may have counted wrong, but his salary was the 9th worst in P5. You might be able to negotiate for more of the contract to be on incentives, but if you do the incentive are going to have to be high. You won't get a guaranteed $1.5 million with an opportunity to reach $3. It will have to be a base close to $3 million will an opportunity to get to $5 or $6 million. That isn't only with regard to Key. It will be that way for anybody that we try to hire.

 

[bobongo]

I don't think there are many that would argue that you should get a favorable contract. The problem is that your idea of favorable vs non-favorable is not in the ballpark of the current market. For all of the belief that Collin's was making too much money for his experience, his salary for 2022 was number 61 in FBS football for a head coach. There are a few AAC schools with higher salaries. Liberty is paying their HC more. I may have counted wrong, but his salary was the 9th worst in P5. You might be able to negotiate for more of the contract to be on incentives, but if you do the incentive are going to have to be high. You won't get a guaranteed $1.5 million with an opportunity to reach $3. It will have to be a base close to $3 million will an opportunity to get to $5 or $6 million. That isn't only with regard to Key. It will be that way for anybody that we try to hire.

Could we do something like that with no buyout either way? Is that possible?

 

[RonJohn]

Could we do something like that with no buyout either way? Is that possible?

I am no expert, but I doubt it. The buyouts are there to protect the terms of the contract. If either party decides to bail out of the contract, the other party has some compensation for the pain and expenses. Compare it to a lease on an apartment. The lease gives a landlord assurance that they have the space occupied and give the tenant assurance that they have a place to live. If the lease has zero consequences of breaking the lease, then there are no assurances.

 

[85Escape]

I am no expert, but I doubt it. The buyouts are there to protect the terms of the contract. If either party decides to bail out of the contract, the other party has some compensation for the pain and expenses. Compare it to a lease on an apartment. The lease gives a landlord assurance that they have the space occupied and give the tenant assurance that they have a place to live. If the lease has zero consequences of breaking the lease, then there are no assurances.

I get that. Contracts are just pre-nups to agree on the terms of the divorce ahead of time. But I'm really surprised that Key can command anything other than the very lowest level of P5 HC guarantees. If he doesn't get the GT HC job, he is not getting any other P5 HC job for a least another three to five years.

If we are taking a gamble on him, then it aught to be a mutual gamble instead of the stupidly one-sided gamble we took with the Tight-Panted One.

 

[RonJohn]

I get that. Contracts are just pre-nups to agree on the terms of the divorce ahead of time. But I'm really surprised that Key can command anything other than the very lowest level of P5 HC guarantees. If he doesn't get the GT HC job, he is not getting any other P5 HC job for a least another three to five years.

If we are taking a gamble on him, then it aught to be a mutual gamble instead of the stupidly one-sided gamble we took with the Tight-Panted One.

Totally hypothetical and not predicting any real numbers: It might be possible to have a relatively small buyout, say $1.5 million per year for four or five years, a $2.5 million base salary, and hefty incentives. Say $100k per FBS win, $100k additional per top 25 win, $250k for making the ACCCG, $250K for winning the ACCCG, $500k for making the CFP, $750k for winning the semi-final, and $1 million for winning the champship. (The CFP numbers would have to be adjusted for a 12 team playoff) That would give a GT coach the opportunity to make as much as $5 million in bonuses. Would be extremely difficult to reach that level, but if he did I don't think GTAA would have much of a problem raising money to pay those bonuses.

My experience with contracts has been that if you expect someone to accept a less attractive guarantee, the available incentives have to be very attractive.

 

[85Escape]

Totally hypothetical and not predicting any real numbers: It might be possible to have a relatively small buyout, say $1.5 million per year for four or five years, a $2.5 million base salary, and hefty incentives. Say $100k per FBS win, $100k additional per top 25 win, $250k for making the ACCCG, $250K for winning the ACCCG, $500k for making the CFP, $750k for winning the semi-final, and $1 million for winning the champship. (The CFP numbers would have to be adjusted for a 12 team playoff) That would give a GT coach the opportunity to make as much as $5 million in bonuses. Would be extremely difficult to reach that level, but if he did I don't think GTAA would have much of a problem raising money to pay those bonuses.

My experience with contracts has been that if you expect someone to accept a less attractive guarantee, the available incentives have to be very attractive.

I'd sign up for that as an alum. It looks like a pretty balanced deal that should net him $3MM+ if he is good, and up to $7-8MM if he is great.

 

[CheCha54]

I'd give him a contract to the end of next year. Possibly double his current salary. If he does well negotiate a longer term contract.

 

[lv20gt]

I swear, contract discussions are where it's super obvious some people have no idea what they're talking about.

"I'd offer Key an unopened bag of doritos and a 73 for Pinto for a one year contract. Automatic 6 game extension if he wins a national championship"

 

[Squints]

You can tell that O’Leary has been a huge influence

Hopefully nobody dies in the practice field.

 

[AugustaSwarm]

I think we'll know a lot more about CBK after today's game. If the offense improves even more and the D continues with what we saw, we'll have even more reason to get excited about him as the HC. I do think it's a big hill to climb for him, but if (and only if) we continue to see improvements I'm all for it.

 

[slugboy]

I swear, contract discussions are where it's super obvious some people have no idea what they're talking about.

"I'd offer Key an unopened bag of doritos and a 73 for Pinto for a one year contract. Automatic 6 game extension if he wins a national championship"

I am waiting for the “if this coach REALLY wants a P5 job, they’ll pay US for the first year, and we’ll fine them if they don’t make a bowl” posts.

We’re there Ford Pintos in 73? I thought they were a Carter-era car.

EDIT: They were produced from 1970 through 1980.

Ford Pinto - Wikipedia

en.m.wikipedia.org