Brent Key is not the answer

[Heisman's Ghost]

I don’t think 1(a) and apparently not even 1(b) anymore.

From the article;
Haarberg has thrown for 477 yards and 4 TD and 1 INT. Also 51 rushes for 270 yards and two touchdowns.

Jeff Sims has thrown for 220 yards and 1 TD with FOUR INT. He has run 30 times for 156 yards and one touchdown.

I think the stats in this article are from BEFORE the Illinois game….
Last week Haarberg did most of his damage running, but Sims does not even show up in the box score.

He will transfer again to someplace that appreciates his multifaceted game and physical talents. Maybe Rice or Hawaii. It would seem he is what he appeared to be when he played for Tech.

 

[Northeast Stinger]

He will transfer again to someplace that appreciates his multifaceted game and physical talents. Maybe Rice or Hawaii. It would seem he is what he appeared to be when he played for Tech.

It was almost as if the former coach found a record number of overrated four star recruits because our four star recruits never seemed to play as well as some other schools four star recruits. He either was lousy at evaluating talent or maybe there was a coaching issue.

 

[GTNavyNuke]

Believing that any coach is going to come to Tech and have them winning consistently is wishful thinking and nothing more, but we still do it. But it's MORE LIKELY that a coach at his P5 alma mater who has success isn't going to leave just for the money. .........

100% on the "more likely" part. Everyone has a price and Key's would be higher to leave than others probably.

And I don't think we get any better coach at this price point than Key and the rest of his staff.

 

[yeti92]

Believing that any coach is going to come to Tech and have them winning consistently is wishful thinking and nothing more, but we still do it. But it's MORE LIKELY that a coach at his P5 alma mater who has success isn't going to leave just for the money. Look at Mike Gundy, Pat Fitzgerald, and Frank Beamer, . As for Chadwell's offense, while it may be predicated on the TO, it incorporates enough elements of common college schemes that it's not going to hold Chadwell back. People were saying that the spread zone offense would prevent Urban Meyer and Rich Rod from getting bigger name jobs and yet they both got opportunities at the factories.

Fitzgerald has had about 5 seasons out of 17 that were good, interspersed among 8 losing seasons and a few average seasons. Beamer took 7 years before he had a good season, that is incredible patience from the VT fanbase which is not going to happen at any P5 these days. And none of that says their respective schools weren't willing to match the best offers they were getting elsewhere. Gundy is making $7.5m/yr currently, top 15 in the country and making him the highest paid coach in the BIG 12 - yes more than Oklahoma or Texas. Pat Fitzgerald was making $5.65m/yr last year despite posting a 3 win and 1 win season in 2021 and 2022. In 2011, the last season Beamer was good, he was the 3rd highest paid coach in the ACC, behind only CPJ and Fisher. Meanwhile Key is currently making ~$3m, which is dead last in the ACC and 3rd lowest in P5. I expect Key's salary to increase significantly if he can bring those 9, 10, 11 win type seasons, but keep in mind the GTAA is already massively in debt and we just struggled to come up with $15m to can the last guy who turned in 3 straight doo doo seasons.

For what it's worth, I agree that Chadwell's offense shouldn't hold him back, but you obviously weren't paying attention around these parts during the coaching searches last season. Plenty of people saw the word option associated with him and immediately wanted nothing to do with him.

 

[iceeater1969]

Fitzgerald has had about 5 seasons out of 17 that were good, interspersed among 8 losing seasons and a few average seasons. Beamer took 7 years before he had a good season, that is incredible patience from the VT fanbase which is not going to happen at any P5 these days. And none of that says their respective schools weren't willing to match the best offers they were getting elsewhere. Gundy is making $7.5m/yr currently, top 15 in the country and making him the highest paid coach in the BIG 12 - yes more than Oklahoma or Texas. Pat Fitzgerald was making $5.65m/yr last year despite posting a 3 win and 1 win season in 2021 and 2022. In 2011, the last season Beamer was good, he was the 3rd highest paid coach in the ACC, behind only CPJ and Fisher. Meanwhile Key is currently making ~$3m, which is dead last in the ACC and 3rd lowest in P5. I expect Key's salary to increase significantly if he can bring those 9, 10, 11 win type seasons, but keep in mind the GTAA is already massively in debt and we just struggled to come up with $15m to can the last guy who turned in 3 straight doo doo seasons.

For what it's worth, I agree that Chadwell's offense shouldn't hold him back, but you obviously weren't paying attention around these parts during the coaching searches last season. Plenty of people saw the word option associated with him and immediately wanted nothing to do with him.

Great post.
Appreciate Your thoughts on the Gt
1. NIL funding deficit for talented players also scaring off quality hc oc dc and thus dooming us to be sporadic winners.

2. Could Gtaa salary structure for AST FOOTBALL AND BB COACHES that attracts and retains the very best talent devlopers. I did this with my surveyors in my company = stable work force, clients got to liking them = repeatxwork, young hires trained up. Letting them be a part of the Bonus pool did the trick.

 

[Vespidae]

100% on the "more likely" part. Everyone has a price and Key's would be higher to leave than others probably.

And I don't think we get any better coach at this price point than Key and the rest of his staff.

Paul Johnson was offered the HC job at Auburn and turned it down. He liked the student athletes at Tech (smart, good kids, seldom in trouble). The problem for CPJ is the AA wanted him gone and starved him into submission.

There are coaches who just want to coach and not get wrapped up in the stress, and ladder climbing. Dave Cutcliffe is a good example.

To me, Tech needs to define what Tech football is and then find a coach in the last third of his career who wants to help do that. Fritz probably was a good choice but the money wasn‘t there.

 

[GTpdm]

It was almost as if the former coach found a record number of overrated four star recruits because our four star recruits never seemed to play as well as some other schools four star recruits. He either was lousy at evaluating talent or maybe there was a coaching issue.

Why does it have to be either/or?

 

[GoldZ]

Paul Johnson was offered the HC job at Auburn and turned it down. He liked the student athletes at Tech (smart, good kids, seldom in trouble). The problem for CPJ is the AA wanted him gone and starved him into submission.

There are coaches who just want to coach and not get wrapped up in the stress, and ladder climbing. Dave Cutcliffe is a good example.

To me, Tech needs to define what Tech football is and then find a coach in the last third of his career who wants to help do that. Fritz probably was a good choice but the money wasn‘t there.

This is so correct. Brace yourself though Ves, because what's next is a post that he wasn't new and shiny or modern. Old school is not respected much anymore....out of ignorance.

 

[jojatk]

Fitzgerald has had about 5 seasons out of 17 that were good, interspersed among 8 losing seasons and a few average seasons. Beamer took 7 years before he had a good season, that is incredible patience from the VT fanbase which is not going to happen at any P5 these days. And none of that says their respective schools weren't willing to match the best offers they were getting elsewhere. Gundy is making $7.5m/yr currently, top 15 in the country and making him the highest paid coach in the BIG 12 - yes more than Oklahoma or Texas. Pat Fitzgerald was making $5.65m/yr last year despite posting a 3 win and 1 win season in 2021 and 2022. In 2011, the last season Beamer was good, he was the 3rd highest paid coach in the ACC, behind only CPJ and Fisher. Meanwhile Key is currently making ~$3m, which is dead last in the ACC and 3rd lowest in P5. I expect Key's salary to increase significantly if he can bring those 9, 10, 11 win type seasons, but keep in mind the GTAA is already massively in debt and we just struggled to come up with $15m to can the last guy who turned in 3 straight doo doo seasons.

For what it's worth, I agree that Chadwell's offense shouldn't hold him back, but you obviously weren't paying attention around these parts during the coaching searches last season. Plenty of people saw the word option associated with him and immediately wanted nothing to do with him.

My objection to Chadwell was that, similar to our previous guy, he wanted to bring his staff (mostly or all) with him and IIRC they had very little P5 experience among them. That just felt too much like lather, rinse, repeat. Maybe I shouldn't have been concerned about that but I couldn't help it. I had no concerns about his offensive system.

 

[MidtownJacket]

Listening to the way CBK talks about the Institute and our SAs gives me confidence that he has a good sense for what this place can be.

Watching the way the team responded to him to win the game in South Florida shows me that the kids believe in his vision.

Watching that Miami summary video:


I just think it is something special. I hope tomorrow shows us that I am right and that we have indeed found the answer.

 

[Blue&Gold1034]

Fitzgerald has had about 5 seasons out of 17 that were good, interspersed among 8 losing seasons and a few average seasons. Beamer took 7 years before he had a good season, that is incredible patience from the VT fanbase which is not going to happen at any P5 these days. And none of that says their respective schools weren't willing to match the best offers they were getting elsewhere. Gundy is making $7.5m/yr currently, top 15 in the country and making him the highest paid coach in the BIG 12 - yes more than Oklahoma or Texas. Pat Fitzgerald was making $5.65m/yr last year despite posting a 3 win and 1 win season in 2021 and 2022. In 2011, the last season Beamer was good, he was the 3rd highest paid coach in the ACC, behind only CPJ and Fisher. Meanwhile Key is currently making ~$3m, which is dead last in the ACC and 3rd lowest in P5. I expect Key's salary to increase significantly if he can bring those 9, 10, 11 win type seasons, but keep in mind the GTAA is already massively in debt and we just struggled to come up with $15m to can the last guy who turned in 3 straight doo doo seasons.

For what it's worth, I agree that Chadwell's offense shouldn't hold him back, but you obviously weren't paying attention around these parts during the coaching searches last season. Plenty of people saw the word option associated with him and immediately wanted nothing to do with him.

In 2017 Gundy turned down a contract offer from Tennessee that would have paid him his 2023 salary at OSU. If he had success at Tennessee, he'd be making much more than 7 mil rn. Fitzgerald turned down offers from NFL teams which pay better than what he was making in college. When Stallings retired from Bama, Beamer was on the short list of candidates, but turned down the job to stay at VT. Im pretty sure Bama would've doubled Beamers contract at VT and made him not just the highest paid coach in his conference, but in the nation. If these coaches cared about making as much money as possible, they would've left those teams when they were given the opportunity.

As for the message boards, they have nothing to do with what goes on in college sports when it comes to hires. Just because some fans on the internet have a problem with the offense doesn't mean the ADs at universities will. I remember when Rich Rods name was being floated for the UM job, many people said his "finesse" spread offense couldn't work in the physical BIG 10. UM hired him anyway. Very few fans (including me) know whether or not a system can and will have success.

 

[Northeast Stinger]

My objection to Chadwell was that, similar to our previous guy, he wanted to bring his staff (mostly or all) with him and IIRC they had very little P5 experience among them. That just felt too much like lather, rinse, repeat. Maybe I shouldn't have been concerned about that but I couldn't help it. I had no concerns about his offensive system.

I think that is fair. He could have worked out at Tech but decision makers were cognizant that Tech nation had PTSD after the last guy.

 

[Northeast Stinger]

In 2017 Gundy turned down a contract offer from Tennessee that would have paid him his 2023 salary at OSU. If he had success at Tennessee, he'd be making much more than 7 mil rn. Fitzgerald turned down offers from NFL teams which pay better than what he was making in college. When Stallings retired from Bama, Beamer was on the short list of candidates, but turned down the job to stay at VT. Im pretty sure Bama would've doubled Beamers contract at VT and made him not just the highest paid coach in his conference, but in the nation. If these coaches cared about making as much money as possible, they would've left those teams when they were given the opportunity.

As for the message boards, they have nothing to do with what goes on in college sports when it comes to hires. Just because some fans on the internet have a problem with the offense doesn't mean the ADs at universities will. I remember when Rich Rods name was being floated for the UM job, many people said his "finesse" spread offense couldn't work in the physical BIG 10. UM hired him anyway. Very few fans (including me) know whether or not a system can and will have success.

And not to put too fine a point on it but Bama was not a place many successful coaches were interested in if it meant leaving a job where they were loved and supported to go to a shark pool of politics and back room hatchet jobs. Saban came to Bama not because of the money but because he was given entire control over the program. Don’t know if Tech would ever go for a deal like that, and perhaps shouldn’t, but we could get a lifetime commitment from a lot of coaches with a deal like that.

So, to repeat what I said earlier, we don’t know how long a Chadwell would stay at Tech and anyone who says they do know is speculating. And, as you said, it’s not always about money.

 

[Augusta_Jacket]

As for the message boards, they have nothing to do with what goes on in college sports when it comes to hires. Just because some fans on the internet have a problem with the offense doesn't mean the ADs at universities will.

Sources: Amid protests, Vols won't hire Schiano

After public outcry and campus protests -- including government officials protesting on Twitter -- Tennessee will no longer hire Greg Schiano as the Volunteers' next football coach, sources tell ESPN's Chris Low.

www.espn.com

Message boards played a big part in this one...

 

[GT33]

It was almost as if the former coach found a record number of overrated four star recruits because our four star recruits never seemed to play as well as some other schools four star recruits. He either was lousy at evaluating talent or maybe there was a coaching issue.

There was a reason we “stole” a bunch of 4 star recruits away from others. Injured, noncommittable offers elsewhere, overrated, etc. We used to excel at finding the overlooked players, Chan’s staff was the best at it. CS recruited dancers, sign boys and those often injured or had 1-2 game stat sheets. If he saw them ducking or avoiding contact on a highly clip or better yet spent 2 years recovering from an injury, if the “measurables” were decent then roll out the red carpet. He’d swoop in and “steal” them from Tusculum or Bowie.

 

[stinger78]

Paul Johnson was offered the HC job at Auburn and turned it down. He liked the student athletes at Tech (smart, good kids, seldom in trouble). The problem for CPJ is the AA wanted him gone and starved him into submission.

There are coaches who just want to coach and not get wrapped up in the stress, and ladder climbing. Dave Cutcliffe is a good example.

To me, Tech needs to define what Tech football is and then find a coach in the last third of his career who wants to help do that. Fritz probably was a good choice but the money wasn‘t there.

Really? I didn’t know this. He turned AU down?

 

[stinger78]

Listening to the way CBK talks about the Institute and our SAs gives me confidence that he has a good sense for what this place can be.

Watching the way the team responded to him to win the game in South Florida shows me that the kids believe in his vision.

Watching that Miami summary video:


I just think it is something special. I hope tomorrow shows us that I am right and that we have indeed found the answer.

His passion reminds me of DMo.

 

[tomknight]

My memory of the 1985 GT-Auburn Game is that it was a hard-fought Defensive game with Ted Roof and the Black Watch Defense. Score was 14-10 in favor of Tech until late in the game.

Then Bo Broke a touchdown run of about 60 years to seal the game for Auburn at 17-14.

It was a pretty cold cloudy day and the Auburn Fans made sure to rub it in with their War Eagle chant on the way out of the Stadium.

Yep. I was at that one. We were thinking Bo ain't all that. On that run, he was all that and more.

 

[stinger78]

Yep. I was at that one. We were thinking Bo ain't all that. On that run, he was all that and more.

I was in Columbia, SC after a friend’s wedding, listening and getting real excited, thinking we were going to win. Then Bo broke loose and went about 80 yards for the winning TD.

 

[gtie73]

why can’t we change the title os the topic ( ok, I’m a Key supporter)