augustabuzz
Helluva Engineer
- Messages
- 3,404
Bracketology - Let's Do This
- Thread starter CuseJacket
- Start date
Milwaukee
Banned
- Messages
- 7,277
- Location
- Milwaukee, WI
GTbball2016
Helluva Engineer
- Messages
- 1,104
And we looked lights out from 3 in the condensed version of last night’s game
forensicbuzz
Helluva Engineer
- Messages
- 8,110
- Location
- North Shore, Chicago
Let's be honest, Wisconsin's D is not the equal of GT's D.
lv20gt
Helluva Engineer
- Messages
- 5,568
9/26 that game for 35% which is right at their, and our, average for the year. In general they shoot slightly fewer 3 point attempts per game than us.
- Messages
- 9,453
- Location
- Oriental, NC
I am a big fan of mathematical rankings, but every system has to have a starting point. A place for every team for the first games of their season. Systems try to account for this as the season progresses, but this year has not given the algorithms enough data to show differences between the conferences. It is my opinion that our first two games hurt every ACC team in these ranking systems. Including the NET.
Deleted member 2897
Guest
Yep. 100%. All 9 of the Big Ten teams should make the Sweet 16 to validate these models. Which won’t happen, despite the fact they are given every opportunity in the seedlings to do so.
Thete are some great teams in that conference. My beef is when they start letting in teams like Michigan State who is ranked #70 and 2 games below 0.500 in conference play. It’s just silly.
Last edited by a moderator:
- Messages
- 10,808
So, about the lack of inter-conference numbers and “bias inherent in the system” this year, I looked a little for some of the numbers.
We did fairly well out of conference, but we were 6-10 against the Big10 and 0-1 against the Big12. The ACC was 18-16 against the Power 6, mainly from beating up on the SEC. The ACC was 42-7 against the rest of Division I.
I can’t see the underlying numbers from Sagarin, but he has the ACC as the third-best conference. Sagarin is usually one of the easier ones to see the underlying numbers on.
Some of the conference bias is possibly from the Big10 and the Big12 just having good years. Some might be that the Big10 beat our “top teams” and our bottom teams beat their bottom teams.
I do think Michigan State should probably be at home and Louisville in the tournament, and that probably comes down to arm-twisting.
We did fairly well out of conference, but we were 6-10 against the Big10 and 0-1 against the Big12. The ACC was 18-16 against the Power 6, mainly from beating up on the SEC. The ACC was 42-7 against the rest of Division I.
I can’t see the underlying numbers from Sagarin, but he has the ACC as the third-best conference. Sagarin is usually one of the easier ones to see the underlying numbers on.
Some of the conference bias is possibly from the Big10 and the Big12 just having good years. Some might be that the Big10 beat our “top teams” and our bottom teams beat their bottom teams.
I do think Michigan State should probably be at home and Louisville in the tournament, and that probably comes down to arm-twisting.
Code:
1 BIG TEN = 85.66 85.71 ( 1) 14 85.72 ( 1)
2 BIG 12 = 84.15 83.43 ( 2) 10 83.77 ( 2)
3 ATLANTIC COAST = 82.85 82.33 ( 3) 15 82.48 ( 3)
4 BIG EAST = 82.20 82.31 ( 4) 11 82.31 ( 4)
5 SOUTHEASTERN = 82.00 81.90 ( 5) 14 81.93 ( 5)
6 PAC-12 = 80.19 80.04 ( 6) 12 80.10 ( 6)
7 AMER. ATHLETIC = 77.35 77.92 ( 7) 11 77.67 ( 7)
8 ATLANTIC 10 = 76.28 75.79 ( 9) 14 76.00 ( 8)
9 WEST COAST = 75.73 76.16 ( 8) 10 75.76 ( 9)
10 MOUNTAIN WEST = 73.88 73.59 ( 11) 11 73.81 ( 10)
Last edited:
Deleted member 2897
Guest
I think they are a great conference, and I’m not even really here to argue that - as I think most aren’t. But it’s the extreme over the top bias. 9 of the top 13 nationally? LOL. Their seeds in the tournament are 1, 1, 2, 2, 4, 9, 10, 10, 11.
We have 5 teams with 7 or fewer losses, they have only 2. They got 2 seeds with teams with 8 and 9 losses. We had teams with records like that who barely made it into the tournament.
- Messages
- 9,453
- Location
- Oriental, NC
Initial thoughts:
East: I can see FSU getting to the Regional Finals. Michigan looks very vulnerable.
Midwest: If the B1G is as good as KenPom says, Clemson has a tough 1st game. So do we, but for a different reason.
South: I do not see anyone in this region to challenge Baylor. Ohio State with 9 losses is seeded #2.
West: My wife says App State will own Gonzaga. I am checking to see if her mixer is already spiked before adding vodka. Otherwise, I think UVA is dangerous in this region if they are 100% healthy.
East: I can see FSU getting to the Regional Finals. Michigan looks very vulnerable.
Midwest: If the B1G is as good as KenPom says, Clemson has a tough 1st game. So do we, but for a different reason.
South: I do not see anyone in this region to challenge Baylor. Ohio State with 9 losses is seeded #2.
West: My wife says App State will own Gonzaga. I am checking to see if her mixer is already spiked before adding vodka. Otherwise, I think UVA is dangerous in this region if they are 100% healthy.
- Messages
- 9,453
- Location
- Oriental, NC
One more thing. I believe the GSU and Mercer games, plus two Jose missed FTs cost us a 4 seed. If we were 20-5 instead of 17-8, there would be an entirely different story. That is why I think we did not get seeded better. Let's see if I am right.
Northeast Stinger
Helluva Engineer
- Messages
- 9,695
Is anyone else tired of hearing that the first two games of the season negated all of our quality wins and our near miraculous winning streak to end our regular season? This is when I worry that we really have let computer generated data override our ability to think rationally.
Yes, my view is biased but I honestly would give a lot of teams the benefit of the doubt for anomalies that occurred in their record during a Covid season.
GTbball2016
Helluva Engineer
- Messages
- 1,104
Yep especially due to the extenuating circumstances with GT actually trying to avoid COVID.
JacketRacket
Jolly Good Fellow
- Messages
- 435
Northeast Stinger
Helluva Engineer
- Messages
- 9,695
I was looking for Tech and realized that I was looking for old gold but navy blue is the key.
smathis30
Ramblin' Wreck
- Messages
- 732
9 losses is rough but Ohio State and Gonzaga both hold the honors of beating every team they played this year
- Messages
- 5,736
Tadams posted a good article on the tourney as far as what the committee got right and wrong. Here is another one on seeding winners and losers
sports.yahoo.com
Georgia Tech has won eight in a row, and topped off the streak with an ACC tournament crown.
Their rewards?
Each other, in the first round; and a potential second-round matchup with white-hot Illinois. Brutal.
These comments are from the article posted by Tadams
The inability to pair Illinois with another Big Ten team contributed to the Illini getting maybe the weakest No. 2 seed (Houston) and No. 3 seed (West Virginia), but the committee made up for it putting loading Oklahoma State, Tennessee, Loyola Chicago and Georgia Tech into that half of the region.
Equally strange was the committee’s decision to have Clemson seven spots ahead of Georgia Tech on its seed list. The seventh-seeded Tigers and ninth-seeded Yellowjackets have very similar profiles, except Clemson was last seen losing to Miami in its opening ACC tournament game and Georgia Tech was last seen celebrating a championship.
It was also disappointing to see Loyola Chicago settle for a No. 8 seed despite being top 10 in KenPom and in the NCAA’s own NET rankings. The Ramblers (22-4) couldn’t have been a top-four seed — they didn’t have enough quality wins on their resume for that — but seeding them this low only penalizes their opponents, Georgia Tech and potentially Illinois.
I'll add, Loyola-Chicago fans, if anything, are more upset than GT fans about where their team was seeded. They feel their team was greatly disrespected by the committee. Their fans believe they wre purposely seeded lower than they should have been because the committee wanted to bracket them with ILL.
Selection Sunday winners and losers: Contrasting fortunes for No. 1 seeds
The 2021 men's March Madness bracket reveal was cruel to some and kind to others.
Selection Sunday losers
Loyola/Georgia Tech | Seed: 8/9 | Region: Midwest
KenPom says Loyola is the ninth-best team in college basketball.Georgia Tech has won eight in a row, and topped off the streak with an ACC tournament crown.
Their rewards?
Each other, in the first round; and a potential second-round matchup with white-hot Illinois. Brutal.
These comments are from the article posted by Tadams
The inability to pair Illinois with another Big Ten team contributed to the Illini getting maybe the weakest No. 2 seed (Houston) and No. 3 seed (West Virginia), but the committee made up for it putting loading Oklahoma State, Tennessee, Loyola Chicago and Georgia Tech into that half of the region.
What the committee got wrong: Seeding blunders
The committee made a few curious seeding decisions, especially with teams in the Big 12 and ACC.Equally strange was the committee’s decision to have Clemson seven spots ahead of Georgia Tech on its seed list. The seventh-seeded Tigers and ninth-seeded Yellowjackets have very similar profiles, except Clemson was last seen losing to Miami in its opening ACC tournament game and Georgia Tech was last seen celebrating a championship.
It was also disappointing to see Loyola Chicago settle for a No. 8 seed despite being top 10 in KenPom and in the NCAA’s own NET rankings. The Ramblers (22-4) couldn’t have been a top-four seed — they didn’t have enough quality wins on their resume for that — but seeding them this low only penalizes their opponents, Georgia Tech and potentially Illinois.
I'll add, Loyola-Chicago fans, if anything, are more upset than GT fans about where their team was seeded. They feel their team was greatly disrespected by the committee. Their fans believe they wre purposely seeded lower than they should have been because the committee wanted to bracket them with ILL.
- Messages
- 4,807
haha saw this thread late and did the same thing, then thought, "Oh no, @Gold1 isn't going to stand for this
) which is more disrespectful I ask you?1) The Nine Seed?
--- Or ---
2) Using our secondary color for us?