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<blockquote data-quote="jojatk" data-source="post: 626651" data-attributes="member: 2627"><p>I took some time to digest what you said. Here's a few comments about my observations:</p><p></p><p>1) Yes of course the threads typically start with a statement of opinion and then, instead of there being what I termed "conversation" it instantly becomes an argument/debate. I wish sometimes it would take a bit longer to get to the argument/debate stage.</p><p></p><p>2) I actually didn't mean you specifically when I talked about pouncing, but I see when re-reading my post that it looks that way. I'm saying both sides pounce and the you was meant to be generic. The debate/arguing has nothing to do with which "side" a poster is taking. It is about the way in which people are speaking AT each other. And frequently I observe people ARE speaking AT one another and not WITH one another.</p><p></p><p>3) I don't believe I'm confusing a consensus of opinion as a debate at all. And that's mainly because there doesn't seem to be consensus of opinion. Perhaps you meant an attempt to build a consensus. But even if that's the case then many of you don't use a tone of consensus building but rather a tone of challenge. That may not be how it is intended but it sure as heck comes out that way pretty frequently. And similarly to point 1 above I am not meaning you specifically but I am referring to many of the posters. And at times I mean me, too.</p><p></p><p>4) Listening to understand means exactly what it says, and no more. It doesn't indicate you have to agree. In fact many times I listen very closely and think about what was said and it actually strengthens my belief in my position because I take the time to think about it, see if it matches my viewpoints and what I think of as facts (and sometimes makes me go back and do more research into those things I think/thought are/were facts), and that renewed research almost always opens my eyes even further and many times I see even more clearly what I thought I saw before.</p><p></p><p>Look, this is a message board. I have been around message boards since they started as a very active participant. I know people are going to argue. People are going to debate. And that's some of what's great about message boards. I just wish it didn't ALWAYS have to be an argument/debate where someone feels they have to win and belittle others in the process.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="jojatk, post: 626651, member: 2627"] I took some time to digest what you said. Here's a few comments about my observations: 1) Yes of course the threads typically start with a statement of opinion and then, instead of there being what I termed "conversation" it instantly becomes an argument/debate. I wish sometimes it would take a bit longer to get to the argument/debate stage. 2) I actually didn't mean you specifically when I talked about pouncing, but I see when re-reading my post that it looks that way. I'm saying both sides pounce and the you was meant to be generic. The debate/arguing has nothing to do with which "side" a poster is taking. It is about the way in which people are speaking AT each other. And frequently I observe people ARE speaking AT one another and not WITH one another. 3) I don't believe I'm confusing a consensus of opinion as a debate at all. And that's mainly because there doesn't seem to be consensus of opinion. Perhaps you meant an attempt to build a consensus. But even if that's the case then many of you don't use a tone of consensus building but rather a tone of challenge. That may not be how it is intended but it sure as heck comes out that way pretty frequently. And similarly to point 1 above I am not meaning you specifically but I am referring to many of the posters. And at times I mean me, too. 4) Listening to understand means exactly what it says, and no more. It doesn't indicate you have to agree. In fact many times I listen very closely and think about what was said and it actually strengthens my belief in my position because I take the time to think about it, see if it matches my viewpoints and what I think of as facts (and sometimes makes me go back and do more research into those things I think/thought are/were facts), and that renewed research almost always opens my eyes even further and many times I see even more clearly what I thought I saw before. Look, this is a message board. I have been around message boards since they started as a very active participant. I know people are going to argue. People are going to debate. And that's some of what's great about message boards. I just wish it didn't ALWAYS have to be an argument/debate where someone feels they have to win and belittle others in the process. [/QUOTE]
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