Veteran Roster Depth

[TechCubed]

Was listening to a CFB podcast this morning, and there was a discussion about the number of fourth and fifth year guys contributing on top teams. Made me go back and look at what's happened with our 2015 and 2016 classes.

It's staggering to look at what happened to the 45 signees over those two classes:
-- only 12 are on the depth chart/above the line
-- 3 are currently injured
-- 16 left the program for various reasons
-- 8 either took medical or are currently out
-- 7 played out eligibility
(please check my work below)

The dearth of numbers/contributors currently on the roster from these classes makes the transition that much harder. There are certainly going to be hits and misses from each class, but this seems to be unusually tilted.

Love the guys that stuck it out, but this can't be the trend going forward. I think CGC is going to turn this trend around, but this is another aspect of the tough hand he's been dealt.

2015 (27)

David Curry (LB) – ATL
Brentavious Glanton (DL) – ATL
Tyler Cooksey (TE) -- ATL
Nathan Cottrell (RB) – ATL
Christian Campbell (DB) – ATL
Ohmahri Jarrett (RB) – ATL

Scott Morgan (OL) – injured

Brad Morgan (OL) – medical*
Jaylend Ratliffe (QB) – medical
AJ Gray (DB) – medical

Brad Stewart (WR) – graduated
Victor Alexander (LB) – graduated
Anree Saint-Amour (DL) – graduated
Brant Mitchell (LB) – graduated
Kyle Henderson (DL) – graduated
Will Bryan (OL) – graduated

Marcus Marshall (RB) – transferred
Dorian Walker (DB) – transferred
KirVonte Benson (RB) – transferred*
Quaide Weimerskirch (RB) – transferred
Meiko Dotson (DB) – transferred
Dante Wigley (DB) – transferred
Mikell Lands-Davis (RB) – transferred
Harland Howell (WR) – transferred
Christian Philpott (WR) – transferred
Trent Sellers (DL) – transferred

2016 (18)

Ajani Kerr (DB) – ATL
Chris Martin (DL) – ATL
Jalen Camp (WR) – ATL
Jair Hawkins-Anderson (WR/DB) – ATL
Kenny Cooper (OL) – ATL
Lucas Johnson (QB) – ATL

Steve Dolphus (WR) – injured
Jahaziel Lee (OL/DL) – out for the year

Brandon Adams (DL) – tragic death

Jakob Brashear (LB) – medical*

Desmond Branch (DL) – graduated

Dedrick Mills (RB) – dismissed
Jarett Cole (DB) – no longer on team*
Xavier Gantt (RB) – no longer on the team*
Emanuel Bridges (LB) – transferred
Jay Jones (QB) – transferred
Jordan Woods (DE) – transferred

*post-CGC hiring

 

[alagold]

If you go back you see that PJ was losing a bunch of each class (around 30%) for various reasons starting 2012.With low rated recruiting it is a miracle we did as well as we did.

 

[UpperNorth]

I agree with the point you’re making overall, we didn’t start our with a ton of talent and then we lost some good players. I saw on another site that we lost 7 of our top 9 recruits in the class of 2016, a class of 18 total that was ranked 60th to start with. One thing to consider though is a lot of schools experience attrition, in fact I believe we’ve experienced less attrition than many programs, hence the smaller class sizes. With the coaching transition there’s more but my point is this happens everywhere. But sometimes transfers can be a good thing for everyone involved (not talking about Parker Braun or Marcus Marshall, that wasn’t good for us...) Overall we didn’t sign a lot of talent on offense during those years and we signed a little more talent on D. That’s showing by the way we’re performing and then when you have less talent and lack depth and lose a few key pieces, it really shows (cough... our offense). If we can sign a few top 25 classes, we might look back, see similar attrition but have better results. Ultimately our biggest problem is our recruiting just wasn’t very good during those years.

 

[smokey_wasp]

Yep. You nailed it with this quote: "Another aspect of the tough hand CGC has been dealt", but he keeps it positive, doesn't complain about it, doesn't put down the players. This is a clear reason people should be patient with him.

 

[TechCubed]

I believe there are five components of building and managing a roster:
1) Evaluating
2) Signing
3) Developing
4) Retaining
5) Attracting high-level transfers

We've seen some early positive trends in these areas already. At a place like GT, the staff needs to be in the 80th percentile or better in these areas to be successful. As @alagold pointed out, losing a significant chunk from each class got us to the place we are now. I think retaining is especially important given GT academics and current climate of college athletics transfers.

 

[iceeater1969]

I agree with the point you’re making overall, we didn’t start our with a ton of talent and then we lost some good players. I saw on another site that we lost 7 of our top 9 recruits in the class of 2016, a class of 18 total that was ranked 60th to start with. One thing to consider though is a lot of schools experience attrition, in fact I believe we’ve experienced less attrition than many programs, hence the smaller class sizes. With the coaching transition there’s more but my point is this happens everywhere. But sometimes transfers can be a good thing for everyone involved (not talking about Parker Braun or Marcus Marshall, that wasn’t good for us...) Overall we didn’t sign a lot of talent on offense during those years and we signed a little more talent on D. That’s showing by the way we’re performing and then when you have less talent and lack depth and lose a few key pieces, it really shows (cough... our offense). If we can sign a few top 25 classes, we might look back, see similar attrition but have better results. Ultimately our biggest problem is our recruiting just wasn’t very good during those years.

A while back when the board had a melt down about pricessing i looked up some stats on attrition at gt . Also I compared over 10 year periid the total number of recruuts for gt,duke, stanford vt.
Attrition - over a bad 4 period ending in 17 lost (left w eligibility) 47 players. 12 per year. Thats about 1/2 of each class. And we thouggtcgt ccx was tough academically . THEN the attrition was very low- because so many wereevery new. Football is a rough sport - FULL RECOVERY FROM INJURY IS NOT A SURE THING.

As to the number of players recruited over 10 years w gt as a baseline , duke and stanford took 20 less , vt 25 more, and miami took iirc 40 more.
Imo, when we get really going we need smaller but higher quality classes.

 

[gtstinger776]

Post 2014, the player development took a dive. I don’t think the raw abilities of someone like a Zack Laskey, Synjn Days, Freddie Burden, or PJ Davis were that much worse than the 2015-2017 recruiting classes. There was just a considerable lack of development. Guys I’m thinking about: Brant Mitchell, Will Bryan, Vic Alexander, Mikell Lands-Davis. All were capable. None really developed to the point of becoming an average to above average ACC starter.

 

[iceeater1969]

I believe there are five components of building and managing a roster:
1) Evaluating
2) Signing
3) Developing
4) Retaining
5) Attracting high-level transfers

We've seen some early positive trends in these areas already. At a place like GT, the staff needs to be in the 80th percentile or better in these areas to be successful. As @alagold pointed out, losing a significant chunk from each class got us to the place we are now. I think retaining is especially important given GT academics and current climate of college athletics transfers.

It ALL starts w doing 1 at a high rate thru the entire process.

Yea the top kids won't come if u arent doing 3 & 4 . Doing BAD in anyone will be a big downer for the program but evaluating will kill u.

GRADES
In recent past we with the excellent tutoring by gtaa and the better teaching gt we are at a very high grad rate.
For the regular students: The old gt "look left look right , one of u will be gone" has flipped to "if u get in then u get out".. (For the thread derailers Yea, its way harder and there are few crib classes so you half to work hard to stay up w the regular kids). The teachers are better and the shaft proofs are gone.
Approx 97 plus percent of students and 85 % of player grad. In recent past w the tutoring smart players also can get thru faster and leave football early ( less than 4 years) for good gt jobs (Matthew Jordan ) or great playing opportunities (braun to Texas who is in the hunt verses gt who is in transition). IN 3 years Parker graduated . So did Trey Klock. Academics and work is an issue that eliminates a percentages - but that no fit recruit is easily determined in the recruiting process.
Being able to evaluate AND COMMUNICATE THE FOLLOWING IN FIRM FAIR AND FRIENDLY MANNER IS GOOD ( SHORT AND LONG TERM) FOR PLAYER AND GT: Simpkified evaluate example- is a red shirt soph -1 definite pt next yea if hits gym y/n , 2 maybe pt in 2 year if hits gym. , slim pt no matter what.
If you evaluate wrong it a disaster w players getting benched late in career. AND THEY LEAVE W NOT GREAT MEMORIES OF GT FOOTBALL

I dont know if cgc team & thier fancy system will be good evaluators.

They are good communicators, but if system gives bad evaluations they are going to have to fix it because its not fair.

 

[4shotB]

. The teachers are better and the shaft proofs are gone.

This is proof of prayers being answered....albeit 40 years too late! We wandered in the wilderness so this new generation would come to a land of milk and honey.

 

[bobongo]

There was a time when attrition worked for us. Take Ugag, for example - they always out-recruit us, but in the past lost so many of their recruits to jail and whatnot that the attrition was an equalizer, of sorts. Lately we've lost more than they have for various reasons, and they've left us behind on the field as a result.

 

[iceeater1969]

There was a time when attrition worked for us. Take Ugag, for example - they always out-recruit us, but in the past lost so many of their recruits to jail and whatnot that the attrition was an equalizer, of sorts. Lately we've lost more than they have for various reasons, and they've left us behind on the field as a result.

Actually last i looked gt was at a player grad rate of 86 and uga was at 50.

 

[gtg391z]

Yeah, UGA loses a lot of recruits to the pros before they graduate. I wouldn't really call that attrition.

CPJ regime was snake bitten on the Oline. We just could not build depth there.

 

[Whiskey_Clear]

Yep. You nailed it with this quote: "Another aspect of the tough hand CGC has been dealt", but he keeps it positive, doesn't complain about it, doesn't put down the players. This is a clear reason people should be patient with him.

Yeah. He only says this transition is one of the most monumental transitions in the history of college football. Not complaining or excuse making at all.

 

[forensicbuzz]

Actually last i looked gt was at a player grad rate of 86 and uga was at 50.

Those numbers have nothing to do with attrition. Those are the 6-year graduation rates, and only partially reflect attrition. Those numbers also reflect students who exhaust their eligibility but don't graduate.

 

[iceeater1969]

Yeah, UGA loses a lot of recruits to the pros before they graduate. I wouldn't really call that attrition.

CPJ regime was snake bitten on the Oline. We just could not build depth there.

The tackles just waddled away.
Last year if marshal had not stayed for r sr , it would have been tough.

We kept changing what we wanted for ol. Goon heads, athletic and big, big (14), athletic and lean.

 

[bobongo]

Actually last i looked gt was at a player grad rate of 86 and uga was at 50.

But we're not keeping 86% of our recruits over the last few years. That was the whole point of the article about the attrition.

 

[ibeattetris]

But we're not keeping 86% of our recruits over the last few years. That was the whole point of the article about the attrition.

Graduation and attrition are different things. Losing someone to injury won't hurt your graduation rate, nor does losing a kid to the NFL. UGA can keep kids until they are seniors and have them fail out (much harder to do now with APR honestly). This would mean no attrition and bad graduation rate. You guys are just arguing different things.