The "Collins effect "........

[Madison Grant]

Not necessarily true

CFB players love to play "close to home" for the most part

In every Era where Miami has had great teams they have never had high paid Coaching Staffs, Elite Facilities, nor have they ever been a "big money CFB Program" budget-wise

What they have had is nearby talent, and lots of it

GT is very similar to Miami in all those phases listed above, except GT has only 3 Majors that allows us to throw a "wide net" recruiting wise (BS-Business, BS-LMC, BS-HST)

We don't have to change funding, backing, or spending to elevate GT FB to nipping at the CFP on occasion

We simply have to recruit earlier and better and get a little lucky here and there

For anecdotal purposes-----in this 2019 Recruiting Class there were 39 HS players in GA that were rated 4* & 5* according to 247 composite rankings, CPJ (yeah him) offered 26 of those Recruits to come to GT

If CPJ offered them he obviously thought they could get accepted and graduate from GT

That 26 of 39 represents a .666 ratio, if you extrapolate that to the Top100 recruits in GA that means that 2/3 or 66 out of the Top100 HS FB players in Ga are indeed academic qualifiers for GT

I have always theorized that the academics excuse was way overblown by the CPJ fanboyz, and now CPJ's own offer list supports my theories

If 60 to 70 of the Top100 Recruits in GA are indeed academic qualifiers for GT, then Coach G has a good chance to really elevate this program without any "structural changes" to GT as an Institution, this also proves that CPJ's detractors were correct all along, he really was a terrible Recruiter and didn't get GT's fair share of the elite Recruits from GA HSs that did qualify for GT

My theory is that the "system is hurting our recruiting" people were probably correct all along

I'm excited because Coach G isn't letting any excuse keep from recruiting at the highest level that we can here at GT

I agree with most of this, but I don't think CPJ was a 'poor recruiter' as much as his system limited him, and because of his system he was looking for different recruits. Remember the 4 star OT from Gainesville we had when CPJ was hired. He was perfect for a pass-blocking heavy scheme, but he struggled at the option style of blocking. Considering the arguments made by college and high school coaches to recruits that you'll never get into the NFL because of the totally different techniques and skills the option offense prizes, CPJ recruited over that better and better every year. Actually, Andy McCollum is a HELL of a recruiter, and I'm excited to see what he can do if CGC keeps him on. But our offense kept CPJ from really capitalizing on the onfield success he had by following those years up with top recruiting classes. The year we went 11-3 and won the Orange Bowl, we had one of his better rated classes but didn't sign a single 4 or 5 star difference maker type.

Also, I think we need to seek donors to increase our funding, but I don't think we need the money that Virginia Tech or Louisville throw at it because of our location. Our coach can drive up the street and see a whole bunch of D1 prospects. If you're in Blacksburg, you're going to be putting in some miles in the sky.

 

[slugboy]

What you posted shows exactly why the GT administration DOES separate athletics from the academics. The administration (i.e., the school) gets monies, as you said, magnitudes higher in dividends on the academic/research side than on the athletics side. The administration feels they don't need athletics, and actually, they don't. So they don't share any more than they have to, nor do they encourage donations be made to athletics. That's why all of us who truly love athletics at Tech absolutely need to GIVE !!!

(In agreement)
The research funding is dedicated funding. By contract, it can’t be used for anything else. There isn’t a massive secret stockpile that we could spend on athletics. It’s got strings attached.
The money we do have from that side is the student athletic fees. That’s about how you’d have to fund anything from that side.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[Animal02]

Not necessarily true

CFB players love to play "close to home" for the most part

In every Era where Miami has had great teams they have never had high paid Coaching Staffs, Elite Facilities, nor have they ever been a "big money CFB Program" budget-wise

What they have had is nearby talent, and lots of it

GT is very similar to Miami in all those phases listed above, except GT has only 3 Majors that allows us to throw a "wide net" recruiting wise (BS-Business, BS-LMC, BS-HST)

We don't have to change funding, backing, or spending to elevate GT FB to nipping at the CFP on occasion

We simply have to recruit earlier and better and get a little lucky here and there

For anecdotal purposes-----in this 2019 Recruiting Class there were 39 HS players in GA that were rated 4* & 5* according to 247 composite rankings, CPJ (yeah him) offered 26 of those Recruits to come to GT

If CPJ offered them he obviously thought they could get accepted and graduate from GT

That 26 of 39 represents a .666 ratio, if you extrapolate that to the Top100 recruits in GA that means that 2/3 or 66 out of the Top100 HS FB players in Ga are indeed academic qualifiers for GT

I have always theorized that the academics excuse was way overblown by the CPJ fanboyz, and now CPJ's own offer list supports my theories

If 60 to 70 of the Top100 Recruits in GA are indeed academic qualifiers for GT, then Coach G has a good chance to really elevate this program without any "structural changes" to GT as an Institution, this also proves that CPJ's detractors were correct all along, he really was a terrible Recruiter and didn't get GT's fair share of the elite Recruits from GA HSs that did qualify for GT

My theory is that the "system is hurting our recruiting" people were probably correct all along

I'm excited because Coach G isn't letting any excuse keep from recruiting at the highest level that we can here at GT

Trollboy has a school girl crush on the new coach......how quaint.

 

[NtTomNtPhilGCollins]

Trollboy has a school girl crush on the new coach......how quaint.

Well CPJ did offer 26 of the top 39 Recruits in GA for the 2019 Class, that is a .666 ratio, that does extrapolate to 66 of the Top100 players in Ga being academic qualifiers for GT

If GA HSs put out those numbers of academic qualifiers most yrs., please explain why CPJ didn't recruit better

I think my logic is pretty fair, start explainin'

 

[Jacket in Dairyland]

It has been " interesting " watching the thread I started evolve. From what I see there are several thoughts going on :
1) Some are STILL mad that CPJ retired. As far as I know, he was not forced to retire.
2) Those that are glad CPJ retired, and continue to want to point out his shortcomings as a coach.
3) There are those that are ecstatic about CGC being hired and feel it was overdue - not necessarily the same as #2 above.
3) There are " the TO gave us an advantage " group , who wanted Monken or someone similar.
4) There are the CGC hire supporters who ALREADY predict disaster , if funding doesn't improve.
5) There are those who are willing to give CGC a chance to improve the branding ,culture, excitement and funding.
6) There are those who feel the entire program is doomed unless we broaden the curriculum.
7) There may be more I have failed to mention.

My point in all this is to show that we are a SEVERELY fractured fan base and, IMO , that is not helping. The REALITIES right NOW are that CPJ is no longer our coach,
TStan has a plan in place to improve funding, at least for the foreseeable future majors will NOT be increased, CGC is our new coach and has just begun, recruiting is at a critical point and we as a fan base look less than supportive of the new changes.
To me , I compare trying to unify our fan base to herding cats. Very frustrating indeed

 

[sc jacket 22]

It has been " interesting " watching the thread I started evolve. From what I see there are several thoughts going on :
1) Some are STILL mad that CPJ retired. As far as I know, he was not forced to retire.
2) Those that are glad CPJ retired, and continue to want to point out his shortcomings as a coach.
3) There are those that are ecstatic about CGC being hired and feel it was overdue - not necessarily the same as #2 above.
3) There are " the TO gave us an advantage " group , who wanted Monken or someone similar.
4) There are the CGC hire supporters who ALREADY predict disaster , if funding doesn't improve.
5) There are those who are willing to give CGC a chance to improve the branding ,culture, excitement and funding.
6) There are those who feel the entire program is doomed unless we broaden the curriculum.
7) There may be more I have failed to mention.

My point in all this is to show that we are a SEVERELY fractured fan base and, IMO , that is not helping. The REALITIES right NOW are that CPJ is no longer our coach,
TStan has a plan in place to improve funding, at least for the foreseeable future majors will NOT be increased, CGC is our new coach and has just begun, recruiting is at a critical point and we as a fan base look less than supportive of the new changes.
To me , I compare trying to unify our fan base to herding cats. Very frustrating indeed

Totally agree! I really don't understand those that are questioning / concerned about the hype around CGC. The man has been coach for less than 2 weeks and hasn't even hired his staff yet. At this point there are 2 options for reaction: 1) Hype 2) No Hype. I'd much rather have the hype and excitement. I don't see the harm in it, and it's good for the program as the local sports media sees the excitement from both CGC and the fan base.

 

[Whiskey_Clear]

Not necessarily true

CFB players love to play "close to home" for the most part

In every Era where Miami has had great teams they have never had high paid Coaching Staffs, Elite Facilities, nor have they ever been a "big money CFB Program" budget-wise

What they have had is nearby talent, and lots of it

GT is very similar to Miami in all those phases listed above, except GT has only 3 Majors that allows us to throw a "wide net" recruiting wise (BS-Business, BS-LMC, BS-HST)

We don't have to change funding, backing, or spending to elevate GT FB to nipping at the CFP on occasion

We simply have to recruit earlier and better and get a little lucky here and there

For anecdotal purposes-----in this 2019 Recruiting Class there were 39 HS players in GA that were rated 4* & 5* according to 247 composite rankings, CPJ (yeah him) offered 26 of those Recruits to come to GT

If CPJ offered them he obviously thought they could get accepted and graduate from GT

That 26 of 39 represents a .666 ratio, if you extrapolate that to the Top100 recruits in GA that means that 2/3 or 66 out of the Top100 HS FB players in Ga are indeed academic qualifiers for GT

I have always theorized that the academics excuse was way overblown by the CPJ fanboyz, and now CPJ's own offer list supports my theories

If 60 to 70 of the Top100 Recruits in GA are indeed academic qualifiers for GT, then Coach G has a good chance to really elevate this program without any "structural changes" to GT as an Institution, this also proves that CPJ's detractors were correct all along, he really was a terrible Recruiter and didn't get GT's fair share of the elite Recruits from GA HSs that did qualify for GT

My theory is that the "system is hurting our recruiting" people were probably correct all along

I'm excited because Coach G isn't letting any excuse keep from recruiting at the highest level that we can here at GT

If you want to recruit better you will also need more than two, or even 4, recruiting staff members when our peers have 20-40.

 

[Animal02]

It has been " interesting " watching the thread I started evolve. From what I see there are several thoughts going on :
1) Some are STILL mad that CPJ retired. As far as I know, he was not forced to retire.
2) Those that are glad CPJ retired, and continue to want to point out his shortcomings as a coach.
3) There are those that are ecstatic about CGC being hired and feel it was overdue - not necessarily the same as #2 above.
3) There are " the TO gave us an advantage " group , who wanted Monken or someone similar.
4) There are the CGC hire supporters who ALREADY predict disaster , if funding doesn't improve.
5) There are those who are willing to give CGC a chance to improve the branding ,culture, excitement and funding.
6) There are those who feel the entire program is doomed unless we broaden the curriculum.
7) There may be more I have failed to mention.

My point in all this is to show that we are a SEVERELY fractured fan base and, IMO , that is not helping. The REALITIES right NOW are that CPJ is no longer our coach,
TStan has a plan in place to improve funding, at least for the foreseeable future majors will NOT be increased, CGC is our new coach and has just begun, recruiting is at a critical point and we as a fan base look less than supportive of the new changes.
To me , I compare trying to unify our fan base to herding cats. Very frustrating indeed

I am not mad CPJ retired....a little disappointed, but it is completely understandable he did.
The anti CPJ posters are reacting with a school girl crush on the new coach. They act like CPJ never recruited...which is delusional, and that all the other problems at Tech will disappear because of a rah rah coach.
The more grounded (and seasoned) posters here realize that unless structural issues change...,mostly funding, that things will not get significantly better.
It is not "accepting mediocrity" as others have charged, to realize handicaps Tech has and the difficulty in overcoming them and simply changing the HC will not alter the long term outcome.

 

[gthxxxx]

(In agreement)
The research funding is dedicated funding. By contract, it can’t be used for anything else. There isn’t a massive secret stockpile that we could spend on athletics. It’s got strings attached.
The money we do have from that side is the student athletic fees. That’s about how you’d have to fund anything from that side.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

The strings attached is my argument that the athletics side is not divorced from the rest of the institution. Also, correct me if I'm wrong, but I have the impression that the pot of money for rent and keeping the lights on is not the athletics'. Furthermore, I don't think the GT admin/staff wearing multiple hats budget their hours separately when dealing with athletic issues. Finally, there's a multitude of other factors, such as parking/transportation, academic scheduling, management, future site planning, public relations, etc that I think a lot of people underestimate or discount.

[Edit: When I say strings attached, I mean different strings in a different way. I noticed afterwards that my phrasing is probably confusing. Also adding in below quote for full context.]

What you posted shows exactly why the GT administration DOES separate athletics from the academics. The administration (i.e., the school) gets monies, as you said, magnitudes higher in dividends on the academic/research side than on the athletics side. The administration feels they don't need athletics, and actually, they don't. So they don't share any more than they have to, nor do they encourage donations be made to athletics. That's why all of us who truly love athletics at Tech absolutely need to GIVE !!!

 

[GTJake]

I hope sometime very soon, we get over the CPJ/TO debate every time someone brings up something positive about our new coach hire .... sheesh !!

 

[Supersizethatorder-mutt]

The strings attached is my argument that the athletics side is not divorced from the rest of the institution. Also, correct me if I'm wrong, but I have the impression that the pot of money for rent and keeping the lights on is not the athletics'. Furthermore, I don't think the GT admin/staff wearing multiple hats budget their hours separately when dealing with athletic issues. Finally, there's a multitude of other factors, such as parking/transportation, academic scheduling, management, future site planning, public relations, etc that I think a lot of people underestimate or discount.

The administration treats student-athletes the same way they treat other students at Tech --- AS STUDENTS. Any money spent on the students as a whole is of necessity spent on student athletes --- AS STUDENTS. The administration doesn't know or care if a student is an athlete or a non-athlete, so, because of that fact, to say that the administration is somehow "not divorced" from the athletics side is totally meaningless. The other factors that you listed are also only indirectly connected to any kind of link between the administration and athletics --- EVERYBODY at Tech is concerned about parking/transportation, public relations, etc. The only possible link between athletics and school administration would be in the area of building utilities and things like that, and I would bet that the athletics administration pays their own bills there.

 

[iceeater1969]

If you want to recruit better you will also need more than two, or even 4, recruiting staff members when our peers have 20-40.

How many times do we have to conflate "Gt and Alabama are peers"?

Who besides you and a few MEGA posters think that we can field a CFP team on a regular basis?

If u know how miami recruits, vt etc please tell us? I dont know

 

[Whiskey_Clear]

How many times do we have to conflate "Gt and Alabama are peers"?

Who besides you and a few MEGA posters think that we can field a CFP team on a regular basis?

If u know how miami recruits, vt etc please tell us? I dont know

When have I ever said Bama is a peer? Quote one example and I’ll buy you a steak dinner. Uga never has been in my lifetime. Clemson is no longer a peer but kinda used to be. Every team in the coastal is. (As for how does VT or duhU recruit...apparently with a much bigger staff than Tech)

I’ve never expressed anything close to saying we can make the playoffs annually. Once every four years might be our ceiling even if we increase funding.

What is so hard to understand in what I have said? I’m starting to think I may have posted en espanol.

Some seem to think any here who aren’t absolutely convinced the new guy will herald in our next golden era are hating on him or something. That’s not the case at all. I think it’s very possible CGC can get Tech to the ceiling. But I do not at all believe he can do it alone. He will need a great staff. Better than our prior one. He will need adequate funding for staff and recruiting.

Anyone who thinks otherwise is promoting conditions which will limit his potential for success.

Y’all really want to remain at 61 out of 65? Near dead last in recruiting staff in the ACC? We’ve spent too much time wallowing at the bottom of the barrel. If Tech doesn’t commit to supporting the new staff in a competitive manner (to our peers / our rivals in the coastal for those of you still struggling to understand my definition of peer) in the next two years....I won’t be motivated to continue to buy season tickets. Because if that is the path Tech chooses, competing for the coastal and going to good bowls consistently isn’t likely.

As for some of the angst expressed to others over their perceived lack of enthusiasm. I haven’t seen anyone say they hate CGC or think he’s an inferior coach. Several have taken a pragmatic approach of “let’s wait and see before proclaiming him our savior. Why does that stance trigger y’all so much?

 

[GTJake]

Whiskey ... I for one would gladly take making the playoffs once every four years, but only if we win the Coastal and play for the ACC Championship in the other three (sic) !

 

[Whiskey_Clear]

Whiskey ... I for one would gladly take making the playoffs once every four years, but only if we win the Coastal and play for the ACC Championship in the other three (sic) !

I want some of what you are drinking. That would put Tech at a level not seen since 1950-1955.

 

[iceeater1969]

When have I ever said Bama is a peer? Quote one example and I’ll buy you a steak dinner. Uga never has been. Clemson is no longer a peer but kinda used to be. Every team in the coastal is. (As for how does VT or duhU recruit...apparently with a much bigger staff than Tech)

I’ve never expressed anything close to saying we can make the playoffs annually. Once every four years might be our ceiling even if we increase funding.

What is so hard to understand in what I have said? I’m starting to think I may have posted en espanol.

Some seem to think any here who aren’t absolutely convinced the new guy will herald in our next golden era are hating on him or something. That’s not the case at all. I think it’s very possible CGC can get Tech to the ceiling. But I do not at all believe he can do it alone. He will need a great staff. Better than our prior one. He will need adequate funding for staff and recruiting.

Anyone who thinks otherwise is promoting conditions which will limit his potential for success.

Y’all really want to remain at 61 outvof 65? Near dead last in recruiting staff? We’ve spent too much wallowing at the bottom of the barrel. If Tech doesn’t commit to supporting the new staff in a competitive manner (to our peers / our rivals in the coastal for those of you still struggling to understand my definition of peer) in the next two years....I won’t be motivated to continue to buy season tickets. Because if that is the path Tech chooses, competing for the coastal and going to good bowls consistently isn’t likely.

As for some of the angst expressed to others over their perceived lack of enthusiasm. I haven’t seen anyone say they hate CGC or think he’s an inferior coach. Several have taken a pragmatic approach of “let’s wait and see before proclaiming him our savior. Why does that stance trigger y’all so much?

Please read your own words .

" OUR PEERS THAT HAVE 20-40 " recruiting staff members. That sounds like Alabama

Please name our peers that have 20-40

 

[Whiskey_Clear]

Please read your own words .

" OUR PEERS THAT HAVE 20-40 " recruiting staff members.

Please name our peers?

What don’t you understand about “coastal rivals?” How about just Duke? The team many feel Tech should never lose to under any circumstance.

 

[iceeater1969]

What don’t you understand about “coastal rivals?” How about just Duke? The team many feel Tech should never lose to under any circumstance.

RIB EYE

 

[GTJake]

I want some of what you are drinking. That would put Tech at a level not seen since 1950-1955.

CC and Coke, tall glass, lots of ice ...
Incidentally, on a side note to share with you guys. I had a scare lately where my blood sugar count got in the pre-diabetic range.
Upon consultation with my MD on my eating/drinking habits I found out diet soda is the worst thing on the market for you.
Years ago I switched to diet coke thinking I was doing something good, but apparently whatever they use for sweetner to get zero calories is like drinking a glass of pure sugar ... switching back to regular coke.

 

[iceeater1969]

CC and Coke, tall glass, lots of ice ...
Incidentally, on a side note to share with you guys. I had a scare lately where my blood sugar count got in the pre-diabetic range.
Upon consultation with my MD on my eating/drinking habits I found out diet soda is the worst thing on the market for you.
Years ago I switched to diet coke thinking I was doing something good, but apparently whatever they use for sweetner to get zero calories is like drinking a glass of pure sugar ... switching back to regular coke.

CLEAR