So who started all that throwing anyway?

[Skeptic]

Does anybody know? I have been scrolling through various book reviews trying to figure out what is actually worth reading. And thus buying, since I am old school and think a printed page is what was intended for humans all along. So I see this one that raves about Hal Mumme and Mike Leach turning football upside down with the Air Raid offense. Revolutionized it apparently. Then another one in short order says nah, it was Mouse Davis and the Run and Shoot 20 years earlier. Except that was from an Ohio football coach earlier than that. Now from what little I know about them I do not much like the "air raid" concept though lots of balls are thrown and completed, but as Johnson once said, if he needed short yards, he would run for them. I like the run and shoot concept of four vertical routes and wish our QBs would sometimes look off that covered primary for that open secondary target. But to my question: are they all right and if so, who has in fact "revolutionized" anything?

We need a football game. Soon.

 

[ilovetheoption]

For Football Nerds like myself:

Run and Shoot

http://smartfootball.blogspot.com/2009/03/simple-approach-to-run-and-shoot-part-1.html
http://smartfootball.blogspot.com/2009/03/run-and-shoot-series-part-2-seam-read.html
http://smartfootball.blogspot.com/2009/03/run-and-shoot-series-part-3-choice.html
http://smartfootball.blogspot.com/2009/08/run-shoot-series-part-4-streak.html
http://smartfootball.blogspot.com/2007/07/what-killed-run-and-shoot.html

Air Raid

http://smartfootball.com/offense/th...-to-holgorsen-and-beyond#sthash.Kr5otdmF.dpbs

(warning, it's LONG)

And, just for S's and G's:

http://smartfootball.com/offense/th...st-wrinkle-the-toss-read#sthash.f6Hp3M1h.dpbs

 

[OldJacketFan]

IIRC Mouse Davis when he was at Portland St (75-80) and Don Coryell when he was San Diego St (61-72) were the first programs that really starting the "high powered" passing offenses.

 

[Coloradojacket]

CPJ says he designed part of his offense from the cowboy series of the run and shoot.

 

[Skeptic]

For Football Nerds like myself:

Run and Shoot

http://smartfootball.blogspot.com/2009/03/simple-approach-to-run-and-shoot-part-1.html
http://smartfootball.blogspot.com/2009/03/run-and-shoot-series-part-2-seam-read.html
http://smartfootball.blogspot.com/2009/03/run-and-shoot-series-part-3-choice.html
http://smartfootball.blogspot.com/2009/08/run-shoot-series-part-4-streak.html
http://smartfootball.blogspot.com/2007/07/what-killed-run-and-shoot.html

Air Raid

http://smartfootball.com/offense/th...-to-holgorsen-and-beyond#sthash.Kr5otdmF.dpbs

(warning, it's LONG)

And, just for S's and G's:

http://smartfootball.com/offense/th...st-wrinkle-the-toss-read#sthash.f6Hp3M1h.dpbs

Thanks. No longer need a book to ease me into summer ...

 

[GTpdm]

Being a podcast, this does not even come close to being the printed page, but you did ask, "who started all that throwing, anyway?"

http://www.radiolab.org/story/football/

 

[Sideways]

IIRC Mouse Davis when he was at Portland St (75-80) and Don Coryell when he was San Diego St (61-72) were the first programs that really starting the "high powered" passing offenses.

Yes, that was my impression although I only knew of Coryell when he was a pro coach in the 1970s. Mouse Davis got a lot of attention for going against the times which were largely devoted to the Veer and Wishbone in the early years of his time at Portland State. Well into the 1980s football was dominated by power running offenses made popular by Walker at Georgia, Bo Jackson at Auburn among others.

 

[OldJacketFan]

Yes, that was my impression although I only knew of Coryell when he was a pro coach in the 1970s. Mouse Davis got a lot of attention for going against the times which were largely devoted to the Veer and Wishbone in the early years of his time at Portland State. Well into the 1980s football was dominated by power running offenses made popular by Walker at Georgia, Bo Jackson at Auburn among others.

Yep most folks recall Coryell from his time with the Chargers and his "Air Coryell" teams behind Dan Fouts. But he developed his passing attack at San Diego State. He realized he couldn't recruit the linemen needed for a power running game but knew he could recruit QBs and WRs so he with the passing game route to the tune of 104-19-2 while at SDSU.

 

[1979jacket]

I'm not saying he invented the wild passing but the guy who made it popular and changed the game with it was one Steve Spurrier of Florida. Before he showed up defenses didn't think they needed four/five fast guys in the secondary. Safeties were mostly good tacklers but not particularly fast. Spurrier spread out the defense with four to five fast receivers and made the SEC as well as the Big 10 look foolish. Spurrier was the catalyst to the run and shoot offense Check the record.

 

[1939hotmagic]

In the early 1960s -- and the 1963 season in particular -- then-small college Northern Illinois, under innovative coach Howard Fletcher and QB George Bork -- lit up the college football world with their "Blitz T" offense by spreading the offense, often sending four receivers out, and throwing out of the shotgun. In their undefeated '63 season, Bork -- again, in 1963 -- completed 244 of 374 passes for 3,077 yards and 32 touchdowns, simply unheard of offensive numbers back then. Fletcher based his offense substantially on the TCU spread attack made famous by coach Dutch Meyer in the 1930s.

http://library.la84.org/SportsLibrary/CFHSN/CFHSNv12/CFHSNv12n4d.pdf

http://www.daily-chronicle.com/2008...ll-of-fame-consideration/asi1llf/sports06.txt

http://northernstar.info/sports/niu...cle_06f1c37a-1377-59ac-b42c-5fbe384b56a7.html

 

[DaddyBill]

Just some numbers to bore you with...Hal Mumme (with Mike Leach as OC) had two QBs during his five years of the "Air Raid" offense at Valdosta State. Chris Hatcher ('91`-94) completed 1,047 passes in 1,529 attempts for 11,363 yards and 121 TDs. Lance Funderburke was 731 of 1,127 fpr 8,192 yards and 67 TDs. Folks, that's a total of 19,555 yards. Mumme/Leach didn't begin the passing attack but they sure knew how to use it, going 40-17-1.

 

[zhavenor]

I saw some film of Sammy Baugh at SMU(?) in the 30's and they lined up with 5 "wrs" outside the tackle box. Of course this was a time when everything was single wing, before University of Chicago started using the t formation, so he was not under the center. The routes and blocking was different, rules and the like being different. But he certainly passed a lot. People are always impressed by the now not knowing anything about the past. It was like the craze in the NFL a couple years ago about over tackles. It had been done in football since the 1900s.

 

[Sideways]

Yep most folks recall Coryell from his time with the Chargers and his "Air Coryell" teams behind Dan Fouts. But he developed his passing attack at San Diego State. He realized he couldn't recruit the linemen needed for a power running game but knew he could recruit QBs and WRs so he with the passing game route to the tune of 104-19-2 while at SDSU.

To my way of thinking, that was pretty smart. Why follow the formula of the powerhouses like USC and UCLA who get the huge linemen and great running backs? Think outside the box and maximize your strengths which is what he did at San Diego State. Come to think of it, that is kind of what Paul Johnson is doing now at Tech. Great minds think alike I guess.

 

[OldJacketFan]

To my way of thinking, that was pretty smart. Why follow the formula of the powerhouses like USC and UCLA who get the huge linemen and great running backs? Think outside the box and maximize your strengths which is what he did at San Diego State. Come to think of it, that is kind of what Paul Johnson is doing now at Tech. Great minds think alike I guess.

That was exactly Coryell's rationale and, like CPJ, was very successful

 

[dmurdock]

The real answer to this question is John Heisman while coaching at Tech:

It was John Heisman who convinced the Football Rules Committee to legalize the forward pass. For thirty-six years, Heisman coached at a number of schools including Auburn, Clemson, Georgia Tech, Pennsylvania, Washington and Jefferson, and Rice. He, Alonzo Stagg, and Pop Warner, three of the greatest coaches from the turn of the century through the 1920s, constituted the “football Trinity”.

Heisman envisaged the forward pass as the salvation of a sport which had degenerated into dangerous formations and tactics such as the flying wedge and mass plays. After unsuccessfully attempting for 3 years to convince Rules Chairman Walter Camp to legalize the forward pass, Heisman enlisted the valuable support of committee members John Bell and Paul Dashiell instead. Finally, in 1906, the Rules Committee, college football’s governing body, legalized the forward pass.​

http://biletnikoffaward.com/fredbiletnikoff

 

[GTpdm]

The real answer to this question is John Heisman while coaching at Tech:

It was John Heisman who convinced the Football Rules Committee to legalize the forward pass. For thirty-six years, Heisman coached at a number of schools including Auburn, Clemson, Georgia Tech, Pennsylvania, Washington and Jefferson, and Rice. He, Alonzo Stagg, and Pop Warner, three of the greatest coaches from the turn of the century through the 1920s, constituted the “football Trinity”.

Heisman envisaged the forward pass as the salvation of a sport which had degenerated into dangerous formations and tactics such as the flying wedge and mass plays. After unsuccessfully attempting for 3 years to convince Rules Chairman Walter Camp to legalize the forward pass, Heisman enlisted the valuable support of committee members John Bell and Paul Dashiell instead. Finally, in 1906, the Rules Committee, college football’s governing body, legalized the forward pass.​

http://biletnikoffaward.com/fredbiletnikoff

The podcast I linked to up above actually talked about Pop Warner at the Carlisle School. Interestingly, a number of rules we take for granted nowadays had their origins in the Ivy League teams getting rules passed to nullify one or another of Warner's notorious trick plays.

 

[Skeptic]

I want to thank everybody for such diligent research and your replies. I guess it proves again that victory has a hundred fathers. Interesting reading, though.

 

[Yjacket82]

The podcast I linked to up above actually talked about Pop Warner at the Carlisle School. Interestingly, a number of rules we take for granted nowadays had their origins in the Ivy League teams getting rules passed to nullify one or another of Warner's notorious trick plays.

I think some of this is a bit misleading. It makes it look like the coaches were fools for not throwing the pass. Until the rule was changed where an incomplete pass resulted in a change of possession, it really was a pretty risky play.

 

[GTpdm]

I think some of this is a bit misleading. It makes it look like the coaches were fools for not throwing the pass. Until the rule was changed where an incomplete pass resulted in a change of possession, it really was a pretty risky play.

Indeed it was a risky play under the original rules...because that's the way the Ivy League schools wanted it. At that time, they were the powerhouse teams—not just in terms of their on-field dominance, but in terms of their influence over the rules of the game. Those teams had no need or desire to pass the ball, so when the forward pass was initially adopted, they saw to it that other teams could not use it to level the playing field against them.

 

[bravejason]

http://www.wndu.com/home/headlines/...ge-Notre-Dame-football-forever-230157501.html