Let's compare coaches, just for fun !

[Techster]

if Tech hires another triple option coach, as much as it will hurt me, I’ll never watch GT again.

I like the 3O. Do I want it as the core of the base offense? No, but I think the 3O can be a devastating compliment to a passing scheme. In this day and age, especially at a school like GT, a core of option schemes is a must for offenses. It doesn't necessarily need to be 3O, but you have to give the defense the threat of the QB running to tilt the field to the offense.

Early in CPJ's career I really thought he was going to implement more RnS into our offense. In fact, the thought of getting dual threat QBs who could pass and take our offense to the next level sold me defending CPJ's offense to anyone that called it a HS offense. That's how CPJ sold Vad. How many times did we hear "CPJ wants to open up the offense..."? Unfortunately, instead of working through growing pains with Vad developing passing concepts, CPJ shelved what they spent all offseason in 2013 working on, and doubled down on the flex option. I think that was a turning point not only for offensive recruiting, but the tone of our program.

The offense is NOT a problem in terms of production. Let's get that out there. This is one of the most effective offenses there is. Just look at OFEI rankings and you'll see Army, Navy, and GT up there in the rankings every year. Unfortunately, a program on this level isn't just about production, but perception and ability to sell it to fans and recruits. It's crazy to me that CPJ was a bit of a mad genius early in his career (see highlights of Georgia Southern/Hawaii/and Navy when he was the OC) and it's almost crazy to see how "open" the play calling was. Stack formations, I formation, TE utilization, quick passes, etc.

I watch a school like Hawaii now and how they utilize the RnS, but also implemented option schemes and I think: THAT is along the lines of what I thought CPJ would do:

https://www.sbnation.com/college-fo...ball-offense-nick-rolovich-cole-mcdonald-2018

 

[Skeptic]

Charlie Strong absolutely outcoached GT at USF...

Specifically, please.

 

[TheSilasSonRising]

You tech fans that want Venables are hilarious. WTH would he come to GT? He almost makes the same salary as PJ now. Do you think they won't pay a little more to keep him? Charlie Strong, meh. OK at Lville. Sucked at Texas. To be seen at USF.

Hiring / not hiring someone based entirely how they did at their last job will almost certainly guarantee your own failure.

 

[A Love Supreme]

I like the 3O. Do I want it as the core of the base offense? No, but I think the 3O can be a devastating compliment to a passing scheme. In this day and age, especially at a school like GT, a core of option schemes is a must for offenses. It doesn't necessarily need to be 3O, but you have to give the defense the threat of the QB running to tilt the field to the offense.

Early in CPJ's career I really thought he was going to implement more RnS into our offense. In fact, the thought of getting dual threat QBs who could pass and take our offense to the next level sold me defending CPJ's offense to anyone that called it a HS offense. That's how CPJ sold Vad. How many times did we hear "CPJ wants to open up the offense..."? Unfortunately, instead of working through growing pains with Vad developing passing concepts, CPJ shelved what they spent all offseason in 2013 working on, and doubled down on the flex option. I think that was a turning point not only for offensive recruiting, but the tone of our program.

The offense is NOT a problem in terms of production. Let's get that out there. This is one of the most effective offenses there is. Just look at OFEI rankings and you'll see Army, Navy, and GT up there in the rankings every year. Unfortunately, a program on this level isn't just about production, but perception and ability to sell it to fans and recruits. It's crazy to me that CPJ was a bit of a mad genius early in his career (see highlights of Georgia Southern/Hawaii/and Navy when he was the OC) and it's almost crazy to see how "open" the play calling was. Stack formations, I formation, TE utilization, quick passes, etc.

I watch a school like Hawaii now and how they utilize the RnS, but also implemented option schemes and I think: THAT is along the lines of what I thought CPJ would do:

https://www.sbnation.com/college-fo...ball-offense-nick-rolovich-cole-mcdonald-2018

If I remember correctly, we run some pistol formation stuff with Vad. Do you think CPJ should have stayed with that style considering what happened in the 2014 season?

 

[RiseUpATL]

Specifically, please.

I can give you the decision to kick to a guy that returned two kicks back to back on us as a pretty big coaching failure. He should have broken the first one, but let’s kick it again...oops TD. Well let’s try again...let’s kick to him again...oops another TD....ok now we can squib it.

Seriously? Charlie’s team was well coached which is what it was going to take to beat us and they did it. They saw we couldn’t stop their QB from running and they kept running him because we didn’t adjust.

There were many points where they outcoached us.

Sorry if you can’t see or admit that.

 

[RiseUpATL]

Charlie barely scraped by us, at home, after we had our starting RB knocked out of the game and our starting QB get injured and two defensive starters were kicked out on iffy flags. You have to be living in an alternate universe to think that game came down to him out coaching us.

11 points is a pretty big win when they were an underdog at home. Scraped by is a last second field goal to win by 3 points. We lost by double digits. I don’t want to be combative, but be honest with yourself about where we are.

 

[MWBATL]

The mistake was not firing pellini, but hiring Riley.

My neighbor used to be a Nebraska fan....now he roots for the Dawgs. That's what happens when your program does not win....

 

[okiemon]

Of course, they get Dedrick next year so their problems are about to be over. Too bad he's not with us still; then our problems would be over.

Assuming he could pass the ball, protect the passer, catch the ball, place kick, and rush the passer, yes, our problems would indeed be over.



Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

 

[pbrown520]

Hiring / not hiring someone based entirely how they did at their last job will almost certainly guarantee your own failure.

What? Who said anything about judging based only on that? I just don't personally think he would be that great of a hire. Nothing I have seen from him would guarantee success at Tech. There are worse candidates to be sure.

 

[RiseUpATL]

My neighbor used to be a Nebraska fan....now he roots for the Dawgs. That's what happens when your program does not win....

Thats actually pretty surprising. Nebraska I would think is just one good hire (and I think they have a good one) away from being really good. No need to sell out to become a dawg fan. He best be careful. He will catch fleas.

 

[Vespidae]

Thats actually pretty surprising. Nebraska I would think is just one good hire (and I think they have a good one) away from being really good. No need to sell out to become a dawg fan. He best be careful. He will catch fleas.

Nebraska is dying. Tough to recruit kids to Lincoln. They were once feared. Now ... not so much.

 

[Skeptic]

I can give you the decision to kick to a guy that returned two kicks back to back on us as a pretty big coaching failure. He should have broken the first one, but let’s kick it again...oops TD. Well let’s try again...let’s kick to him again...oops another TD....ok now we can squib it.

Seriously? Charlie’s team was well coached which is what it was going to take to beat us and they did it. They saw we couldn’t stop their QB from running and they kept running him because we didn’t adjust.

There were many points where they outcoached us.

Sorry if you can’t see or admit that.

Well, this about that: I cannot recount how many times over the past years I have read the throwaway line "outcoached" when we lose. Generally it is written in all caps or with a series of exclamation points, and sometimes both, so you are an improvement there. Now, I am not on a first name basis either with Johnson or Strong, but Charlie Strong does not have the reputation for "outcoaching" anyone at any level. He does, or did, before he bit the suicide capsule at Texas, have a reputation for organization and recruiting. 9It is not my evaluation since I do not pretend to have the inside knowledge of football though I played a few years and have enjoyed it from the couch for many more. Well, "enjoy", I grant, is relative. First, I dunno what the coach told the kicker and assume you don't. I can imagine what he told the special teams guy after the first runback, in between the bleeped portions of the dialogue. I am pretty sure he did not coach them up to have the guy run back two and rightfully considered he had 11 guys on the cover team to stop such. He didn't. Outcoached? Nah. You give Charlie Strong the credit rightly due that sprinter pretending to be a returner. Did we adjust on defense? I thought we did. And got outplayed. But if we were "outcoached" was it their OC vs. our DC or our HC vs all of the above?

Simply, the "outcoached" holler comes every time we lose, to anybody. I am willing to concede it happens. There are some very bright coaches out there. But not every time, and not this time. We got outplayed, and our inability to pass was exposed, again. If Johnson has been "outcoached" point to his inability to recruit QBs to his offense who can throw even reasonably down the field, and in this offense, reasonable will get it done.

 

[motynes]

Why do some of y’all hate the TO so much? Seriously, I Gailey’s offense was just terrible. That is something I would loathe to come back to GT. The TO has been very successful and actually has, for the most part, put up better numbers than Ralph Fridgen’s offense. While Ralph’s offense had advantages over CPJ’s offense, this offense has been much better than most of the current offenses in the NCAA. While it is frustrating to see how many mistakes are made that would have sprung runs or wide open receivers that were missed, you cannon deny that the offense has not been what has held us back.

 

[RiseUpATL]

Well, this about that: I cannot recount how many times over the past years I have read the throwaway line "outcoached" when we lose. Generally it is written in all caps or with a series of exclamation points, and sometimes both, so you are an improvement there. Now, I am not on a first name basis either with Johnson or Strong, but Charlie Strong does not have the reputation for "outcoaching" anyone at any level. He does, or did, before he bit the suicide capsule at Texas, have a reputation for organization and recruiting. 9It is not my evaluation since I do not pretend to have the inside knowledge of football though I played a few years and have enjoyed it from the couch for many more. Well, "enjoy", I grant, is relative. First, I dunno what the coach told the kicker and assume you don't. I can imagine what he told the special teams guy after the first runback, in between the bleeped portions of the dialogue. I am pretty sure he did not coach them up to have the guy run back two and rightfully considered he had 11 guys on the cover team to stop such. He didn't. Outcoached? Nah. You give Charlie Strong the credit rightly due that sprinter pretending to be a returner. Did we adjust on defense? I thought we did. And got outplayed. But if we were "outcoached" was it their OC vs. our DC or our HC vs all of the above?

Simply, the "outcoached" holler comes every time we lose, to anybody. I am willing to concede it happens. There are some very bright coaches out there. But not every time, and not this time. We got outplayed, and our inability to pass was exposed, again. If Johnson has been "outcoached" point to his inability to recruit QBs to his offense who can throw even reasonably down the field, and in this offense, reasonable will get it done.

I agree that the outcoached part gets over done but in this case it’s my opinion PJ was outcoached. Our players did enough to win and blaming them isn’t fair. Had PJ kicked short after the first run back knowing how bad coverage was and how fast that USF kid was we probably would have won. That’s a coaching decision.

Charlie’s team was penalized less and Strong coached a good game. His time at Texas or any game prior to the GT game is irrelevant. Just like PJ’s decision to attempt a fake punt at a completely unnecessary point in the game at PITT was another gaffe.

PJ is not a perfect Gameday coach and he has had several mistakes over the years. Let’s not pretend he is some coaching mastermind. Because he isn’t.

 

[RiseUpATL]

Why do some of y’all hate the TO so much? Seriously, I Gailey’s offense was just terrible. That is something I would loathe to come back to GT. The TO has been very successful and actually has, for the most part, put up better numbers than Ralph Fridgen’s offense. While Ralph’s offense had advantages over CPJ’s offense, this offense has been much better than most of the current offenses in the NCAA. While it is frustrating to see how many mistakes are made that would have sprung runs or wide open receivers that were missed, you cannon deny that the offense has not been what has held us back.

The offense is fine. I like the offense. But during PJs 11 years he has been able to recruit exactly 1 QB capable of maximizing its ability and even then it was only one year. Recruiting OL is difficult as evidenced over the last 4 years and it’s apparently too complicated for them to block effectively because there are constant miscommunications. Also our WRs are absolutely a liability. We do not have a dynamic threat and it’s been 4 recruiting classes since 2014. I think the stigma of our offense has impacted WR recruiting now whereas early on in PJs time we were able to snag a couple good ones. That had completely dried up now though.

The offense also impacts recruiting on defense. Top defensive talent does not want to practice against the offense and doing so does not adequately prepare the defense for more traditional offenses.

So in short, the offense is great if we were able to simply get the players needed to run it competitively at this level but I don’t think good/elite (knowing we shouldn’t expect to get elite talent). I think the offense substantially reduces our chances which are already hard for us to get better talent.

 

[LongforDodd]

Lots of good views in here. I will say that regardless of all the points to keep or change, there is an ingrained issue right now and I don’t think it can be overcome. This is an organization. Every organization has a culture and an identity that reflects the leadership. I am thinking beyond everything that the message from leadership is simply stale. Do not underestimate that. Especially with younger men. They are more susceptible to major swings in organizational behavior. I just feel like we are going through the motions and have been since 2015. There is no fight, no identity except for blowing leads and losing on the road.

It’s tough these days for a coach to last more than 10 years. PJ has had a great run at GT. Gave us some great years. Perhaps it’s simply time to let someone else have their hand at it

Is it posible to Like this more than once?

 

[RiseUpATL]

Lots of good views in here. I will say that regardless of all the points to keep or change, there is an ingrained issue right now and I don’t think it can be overcome. This is an organization. Every organization has a culture and an identity that reflects the leadership. I am thinking beyond everything that the message from leadership is simply stale. Do not underestimate that. Especially with younger men. They are more susceptible to major swings in organizational behavior. I just feel like we are going through the motions and have been since 2015. There is no fight, no identity except for blowing leads and losing on the road.

It’s tough these days for a coach to last more than 10 years. PJ has had a great run at GT. Gave us some great years. Perhaps it’s simply time to let someone else have their hand at it

Is it posible to Like this more than once?

Hey this looks familiar! Glad you liked the post! It truly is how I feel right now. Everyone feels different and that’s okay. That’s what makes this a healthy debate. I just want GT to put their best foot forward. We have a lot of challenges academically, so if the message from the top inside the locker room isn’t effective anymore just mix it up. Invigorate from within. Don’t blame and make excuses for outside influences. You can’t control that. So bring in something kids want to play in. Update the message. Make them believe in the program again. That’ll go a really long way without involving the hill.

 

[Boss Ross]

Who would we drop off the staff? Serious question.

If cpj stays 2to 3 more years with this system it will take a long time for GT to recover

 

[SteamWhistle]

You tech fans that want Venables are hilarious. WTH would he come to GT? He almost makes the same salary as PJ now. Do you think they won't pay a little more to keep him? Charlie Strong, meh. OK at Lville. Sucked at Texas. To be seen at USF.

There’s a reason we WANT him, not like we all think he’s coming here.

 

[SteamWhistle]

Why do some of y’all hate the TO so much? Seriously, I Gailey’s offense was just terrible. That is something I would loathe to come back to GT. The TO has been very successful and actually has, for the most part, put up better numbers than Ralph Fridgen’s offense. While Ralph’s offense had advantages over CPJ’s offense, this offense has been much better than most of the current offenses in the NCAA. While it is frustrating to see how many mistakes are made that would have sprung runs or wide open receivers that were missed, you cannon deny that the offense has not been what has held us back.

Players hate it, any potential Sidewalk fans hate it. Just a big fat sore thumb on the program, makes us a joke. People don’t realize some of the SAs GT recruits have never even heard of GT. It’s the reason so many of them say “Georgia Tech Unicersity” etc. Tech’s name alone doesn’t recruit itself like so many other P5 programs do. Imagine being a RB that’s never heard of Tech, then coming down for a visit and watching the game and seeing GT line up in wishbone. That’s why we hate it cause recruits do. Also a personal beef I have with the TO is Tech plays dirty and cut block on the Oline (No problem with the ABs doing it) I would seriously rather play Alabama’s offense than GTs as a defensive coordinator. Lot of people will say “WELL AINT THAT A GOOD THING?” No, it’s not. I will always support Tech’s student atheletes and would even support CPJ if he was just a head coach and allowed someone else to call plays but for now I’m done with the triple option. Even if Tech wins Saturday I’ll still want it out of there!