Justin Thomas update

Buzztheirazz

Helluva Engineer
Messages
1,410
The bottom line is we have seen many freshman and rs freshman do great things the past years in college as a starting qb including heisman winners. Our system seems to befuddle our qbs. Hell it took tevin being a rs senior to run it efficiently. Is it the system? Coaches? Its gotta be something because it seems like we have heard misses alot of reads for all the years in pjs tenure other than tevins last year. Even nesbitt in 2009 ran a much simpler version and missed reads which is to be expected. But this is thomas's 3rd year. It was vads too.

Guys i am on the boat with some of you who are curious as to why we seem to have this problem. Clearly our system requires more in game reps than other systems.

But if thats the case why do navy qbs seem ok and they are young?

Maybe we just are too hard on expectations?
I pin most of our qbs issues last year on a patched together o-line. I feel like one was way smaller than I expected when I saw him at YJA but I'm having a hard time figuring out who it was.
 
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thwgjacket

Guest
Messages
969
Right over my head...I kinda feel sad for the Cubs. I wouldn't mind seeing them win one.
Idk, ever since the Red Sox won the Series the Cubs have become the one team with that aura around them that still makes the game seem magical. Always fun to believe that a curse involving a goat is real.
 

GT Man

Ramblin' Wreck
Messages
898
That's the media's job or the SID's job, not the coaches'. The last thing they need is give a kid a big head that cuts into his work ethic or to put undo pressure on a kid with inflated expectations. Let ESPN be the hype machine when he actually does something on the field.
Slightly disagree, Cheese. GT football is the product of the GTAA, so it's the GTAA's responsibility to raise interest in the program. It's no different than an upcoming motion picture, where you hear about how the critics loved it and the actors gave a superior performance. This may not end up being the truth, but that doesn't mean it's a bad strategy. In the end, you want to sell tickets.

Let's just look at our retarded, yet successful, neighbors in Athens. Every year they're "competing for a national championship" and they haven't actually done it since 1980. That doesn't keep hopeful fans from pouring into their stadium every Saturday. Am I making sense?
 

AE 87

Helluva Engineer
Messages
12,967
I did a back of the envelope calculation to estimate the number of snaps JT had last year. My assumption was that the QB would account for about the same % of rushing plays regardless of the QB. It's an assumption. Anyway, VL, JT, and TB were responsible for 233 carries and 201 passes of the 916 plays we ran last year. By these numbers QB carried the ball for 32.6% (i.e. 233/(916-201))of non-QB passes.

If VL's 182 carries were 32.6% of his non-passing snaps, then he had 558 rushing plays which together with his 180 passes results in 738 snaps. JT's 33 carries and 17 throws works-out to 118 snaps, and TB's 18 carries and 4 throws would mean 59 snaps.
 

John

Peacekeeper
Staff member
Messages
2,174
You hype players when they've done something if you do so before that point then they could get a big head and not strive to get better or at least not work as hard. That's simple motivational tactics. They didn't hype Johnny manziel until after he made a few teams look silly.

Agreed with this. There's a difference between hyping up the program/team but hyping up a player that has yet to start a game seems counter-intuitive.
 

vamosjackets

GT Athlete
Featured Member
Messages
2,126
So many forget that there's actually a defense out there who is just as motivated to stop you as you are to score. And their coaches get paid out the wazoo too (usually more money than ours do) to figure out how to "befuddle" that QB. Plenty of EXCELLENT QB's have been befuddled, not just our guys. Mariotta last year was thought to be a Heismann lock. They were obliterating people, and then some defenses showed up and played better than them and he looked human again. Joe Hamilton looked like crap against Miami's defense in his last game and in others. Many forget how our own Jacket defenses under Tenuta made a lot of VERY good QB's become very "befuddled" (Stafford, Shockley, Rivers, etc). Auburn shut down Jameis Winston and FSU for a half last year and looked unstoppable themselves. Then the tables turned completely with Auburn being shut down and FSU making the plays. Look at Peyton Manning and Tom Brady - maybe the best QB's to ever play the game. Even they get completely shut down against a GREAT defense. Look at it like baseball. Great pitching stops great hitting. We have had games where our offense struggles every year and will continue to have those games. It's been said a million times, but obviously needs to be put on repeat. We've got to have both in order to win like we want. We've got to be able to win 45-48 or 10-7.

Our coaches will never be able to prepare our guys for EVERY situation and EVERY defense they're going to encounter. That's why the other guys make money too. And, don't forget our guys have to actually win the individual battles too for it to go like the coach draws it up. So, to expect Justin Thomas to be the savior or our program like so many seem to want is foolishness. You're going to be manic depressive like we're seeing in this thread. "Oh God, you mean Coach isn't saying Justin has it 100% down pat?! We're doomed!"

Again, stopwatches and dummies no hit back.
 

GT Man

Ramblin' Wreck
Messages
898
So many forget that there's actually a defense out there who is just as motivated to stop you as you are to score. And their coaches get paid out the wazoo too (usually more money than ours do) to figure out how to "befuddle" that QB. Plenty of EXCELLENT QB's have been befuddled, not just our guys. Mariotta last year was thought to be a Heismann lock. They were obliterating people, and then some defenses showed up and played better than them and he looked human again. Joe Hamilton looked like crap against Miami's defense in his last game and in others. Many forget how our own Jacket defenses under Tenuta made a lot of VERY good QB's become very "befuddled" (Stafford, Shockley, Rivers, etc). Auburn shut down Jameis Winston and FSU for a half last year and looked unstoppable themselves. Then the tables turned completely with Auburn being shut down and FSU making the plays. Look at Peyton Manning and Tom Brady - maybe the best QB's to ever play the game. Even they get completely shut down against a GREAT defense. Look at it like baseball. Great pitching stops great hitting. We have had games where our offense struggles every year and will continue to have those games. It's been said a million times, but obviously needs to be put on repeat. We've got to have both in order to win like we want. We've got to be able to win 45-48 or 10-7.

Our coaches will never be able to prepare our guys for EVERY situation and EVERY defense they're going to encounter. That's why the other guys make money too. And, don't forget our guys have to actually win the individual battles too for it to go like the coach draws it up. So, to expect Justin Thomas to be the savior or our program like so many seem to want is foolishness. You're going to be manic depressive like we're seeing in this thread. "Oh God, you mean Coach isn't saying Justin has it 100% down pat?! We're doomed!"

Again, stopwatches and dummies no hit back.
 

33jacket

Helluva Engineer
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4,526
Location
Georgia
So many forget that there's actually a defense out there who is just as motivated to stop you as you are to score. And their coaches get paid out the wazoo too (usually more money than ours do) to figure out how to "befuddle" that QB. Plenty of EXCELLENT QB's have been befuddled, not just our guys. Mariotta last year was thought to be a Heismann lock. They were obliterating people, and then some defenses showed up and played better than them and he looked human again. Joe Hamilton looked like crap against Miami's defense in his last game and in others. Many forget how our own Jacket defenses under Tenuta made a lot of VERY good QB's become very "befuddled" (Stafford, Shockley, Rivers, etc). Auburn shut down Jameis Winston and FSU for a half last year and looked unstoppable themselves. Then the tables turned completely with Auburn being shut down and FSU making the plays. Look at Peyton Manning and Tom Brady - maybe the best QB's to ever play the game. Even they get completely shut down against a GREAT defense. Look at it like baseball. Great pitching stops great hitting. We have had games where our offense struggles every year and will continue to have those games. It's been said a million times, but obviously needs to be put on repeat. We've got to have both in order to win like we want. We've got to be able to win 45-48 or 10-7.

Our coaches will never be able to prepare our guys for EVERY situation and EVERY defense they're going to encounter. That's why the other guys make money too. And, don't forget our guys have to actually win the individual battles too for it to go like the coach draws it up. So, to expect Justin Thomas to be the savior or our program like so many seem to want is foolishness. You're going to be manic depressive like we're seeing in this thread. "Oh God, you mean Coach isn't saying Justin has it 100% down pat?! We're doomed!"

Again, stopwatches and dummies no hit back.

The difference in your example and ours is one out of 13 games vs looking clueless in near half of the 13 games. I dont place all that on the qb though. The other 10 have stunk it up too making the qb job tougher. But again the deal here is recognizing the qb is ultimately getting the system. Hamilton did despite bad games. But we knew he got it. And we knew defenses were out that are superior. Same with manziel. Or mariotta. Or brady. Etc etc.

I think many point on this board including mine is we never felt vad or maybe thomas (not sure yet) and definitely tevin until his senior year have gotten it where u give them a pass when the other team is just too good.

In fact so that brings to question is the system too difficult for all 11 to be on the same page? I dont know. Its very productive but also can bogg down.

Bottom line is we all want a qb we can say hey he gets it. Yes he will still have bad games. But no way was this the point. We know qbs arent going to be great every game. Kinda obvious there. But its just seems like years of the qb always not being great with reads etc. it seems like sure all qbs miss reads. But what is the percentage of misses etc.
 

vamosjackets

GT Athlete
Featured Member
Messages
2,126
Also, you've got to like the part about Justin being able to do good things when the play breaks down. That's going to happen. That's usually what Tevin couldn't do. Sometimes, no matter how good of a play the coach calls, one of our guys gets whipped by a better player, and that's when you need a guy who can make plays with a special skillset. An opposing defensive coach can't account for this anymore than our offensive coaches can account for one of their defenders whipping our blocker. I rewatched the Auburn/Bama game. Auburn's offense is a great offense, lots of good concepts in there. I would say the same about ours. In fact, they're very similar. Auburn's offense gave Bama a lot of trouble just in the way it's fundamentally designed to outnumber the defense all the time, just like ours. But, MANY KEY PLAYS in that game were made by Marshall doing something when the play blew up and by their RB breaking tackles. I distinctly remember a 3rd and 18. Marshall was pressured in the pocket initially (looked a lot like how our QB has to run for his life often when passing). He eluded the first wave when he should've been sacked, got out of the pocket and then found a guy 20 yards downfield who had found an empty space (because even Bama's DB's can't cover for 10 seconds). That's not coaching. It's playmakers at the most crucial positions. Spring practice and drills didn't make that play happen.
 

Jerry the Jacket

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I think we are in for more of the same. Not a lot to get excited about 7 wins 6 losses with 2 of them being to UGA and a lower tier bowl game. That has become status quo. Somebody needs to stand up and say that's not good enough for Georgia Tech but I don't see anyone in a position of authority doing that. So we drone on.

Go Jackets!
 

alaguy

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I think we are in for more of the same. Not a lot to get excited about 7 wins 6 losses with 2 of them being to UGA and a lower tier bowl game. That has become status quo. Somebody needs to stand up and say that's not good enough for Georgia Tech but I don't see anyone in a position of authority doing that. So we drone on.

Go Jackets!
Jerry, it could be worse 6-7 -easily if some key players go down--Smelter,Shaq,White, Nealy,Gotsis lead the list
 

GTNavyNuke

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Poquoson Virginia
I think we are in for more of the same. Not a lot to get excited about 7 wins 6 losses with 2 of them being to UGA and a lower tier bowl game. That has become status quo. Somebody needs to stand up and say that's not good enough for Georgia Tech but I don't see anyone in a position of authority doing that. So we drone on.

Go Jackets!

Both CPJ and Bobinski have said that last season wasn't good enough. It what CPJ and DRad said every year since 2010. But talk is hollow and past performance is indicative of future performance in CFB. {Good discussion of our hollow world at http://d21uq3hx4esec9.cloudfront.net/uploads/pdf/OTB_Apr_02_2014.pdf }

I envy those of you who can continue to believe and get excited. It hurts nothing and makes life fuller. For me, I'll tune in to Beesball and hope that with the warm weather we can get hot again.
 

Squints

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1,035
It sure would be nice if I could get excited about somebody without somebody saying "Not so fast, my friend".

Ok, I get it - nobody on the roster to get excited about.

I'm exaggerating somewhat but that is close to the impression I get sometimes.

You're not exaggerating. Every thread on every GT message board turns into crap within like three posts. It's exhausting.
 

GTRanj

Jolly Good Fellow
Messages
333
Location
Atlanta, Georgia
So many forget that there's actually a defense out there who is just as motivated to stop you as you are to score. And their coaches get paid out the wazoo too (usually more money than ours do) to figure out how to "befuddle" that QB. Plenty of EXCELLENT QB's have been befuddled, not just our guys. Mariotta last year was thought to be a Heismann lock. They were obliterating people, and then some defenses showed up and played better than them and he looked human again. Joe Hamilton looked like crap against Miami's defense in his last game and in others. Many forget how our own Jacket defenses under Tenuta made a lot of VERY good QB's become very "befuddled" (Stafford, Shockley, Rivers, etc). Auburn shut down Jameis Winston and FSU for a half last year and looked unstoppable themselves. Then the tables turned completely with Auburn being shut down and FSU making the plays. Look at Peyton Manning and Tom Brady - maybe the best QB's to ever play the game. Even they get completely shut down against a GREAT defense. Look at it like baseball. Great pitching stops great hitting. We have had games where our offense struggles every year and will continue to have those games. It's been said a million times, but obviously needs to be put on repeat. We've got to have both in order to win like we want. We've got to be able to win 45-48 or 10-7.

Our coaches will never be able to prepare our guys for EVERY situation and EVERY defense they're going to encounter. That's why the other guys make money too. And, don't forget our guys have to actually win the individual battles too for it to go like the coach draws it up. So, to expect Justin Thomas to be the savior or our program like so many seem to want is foolishness. You're going to be manic depressive like we're seeing in this thread. "Oh God, you mean Coach isn't saying Justin has it 100% down pat?! We're doomed!"

Again, stopwatches and dummies no hit back.


Auburn did shut down FSU for the half that FSU's former coach was reading all the plays being sent to Winston so that Aubbie knew what coverage to be in.

http://thebiglead.com/2014/01/10/vi...sive-play-calls-according-to-kelvin-benjamin/
 

Rodney Kent

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McDonough, GA
Squints: This is normal for a team that has not produced for quite a few years. Look at the Alabamas, LSU, Ohio State (the past two years), plus all the other teams who win big consistently. They are excited every year and believe they are going to win the National Championship each year. I felt the same when Bobby Dodd was coach, we fans were excited about the team and new players each year, however, when the teams do not produce consistently, the excitement dwindles just as is normal.

If we ever begin to win consistently again (14-0), (13-1), 12-2), (11-1), etal, then we will be talking excitement at the beginning of each year and during recruiting. Until then, the talk of big things is meaningless, unless we can back up the talk. As the saying goes, "Talk is cheap".
 
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