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If this isn't enough to scare recruits from uga
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<blockquote data-quote="Northeast Stinger" data-source="post: 592073" data-attributes="member: 1640"><p>My experience in the past working with poor people is that the vast majority of them don't want to be poor. Many felt shame about accepting help from the government and would have done anything to get off of that support. </p><p></p><p>There is often an underlying premise on the part of some in these discussions is that government safety nets are the problem. I think that is a faulty premise. I am on an old phone (I'm cheap) so I don't have the capacity to link articles. However, I am not sure that matters anymore because most of us tend to pick the research that fits our preconceived bias. </p><p></p><p>Having said that, my memory is that the poverty rate was running between 17-19% when Johnson proposed his war on poverty. After about five years the poverty rates were reduced to their lowest level since records have been kept. Two things mitigated that progress in subsequent years, the Vietnam War, which drained resources and attention, and a growing perception on the part of many whites that they were footing the bill for lazy black people. That latter sentiment has been fed and fueled by politicians. Even now, where I live, I see bumper stickers that complain about people on welfare. </p><p></p><p>I don't disagree at all with your value system, your desire to see people work who are able, or the kind of society you eventually want to see. I just want to always remember that things have been worse in the past without many of the social programs we have implemented. If I recall, social security reduced the poverty rate among the elderly by over 20% and other programs have improved the fortunes of not insignificant numbers of people. </p><p></p><p>I remember that when Ronald Reagan was shot the doctor that saved his life went to Head Start and grew up on welfare. Of course that is anecdotal but it speaks to the fact that untold good has been accomplished through government programs. I haven't had a chance to study it yet but there is a Columbia University study that says our current poverty rate would be around 24% without our social safety nets. </p><p></p><p>I'm not sure how far I feel like wading into the weeds on government policy but in general I would assert we need to do much better and most government programs need constant tweaking as we get more data. But we have a political system which means demagoguery and inefficiency are always going to be the rule of the day. </p><p></p><p>Several times I have started to say to various people that we have wandered far from the subject of this thread. That's okay as long as we keep in mind that, per the uga story, racism in any form is an impediment to education. I personally think it is important to call it out whenever we see it because it diminishes us all and makes our society weaker.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Northeast Stinger, post: 592073, member: 1640"] My experience in the past working with poor people is that the vast majority of them don't want to be poor. Many felt shame about accepting help from the government and would have done anything to get off of that support. There is often an underlying premise on the part of some in these discussions is that government safety nets are the problem. I think that is a faulty premise. I am on an old phone (I'm cheap) so I don't have the capacity to link articles. However, I am not sure that matters anymore because most of us tend to pick the research that fits our preconceived bias. Having said that, my memory is that the poverty rate was running between 17-19% when Johnson proposed his war on poverty. After about five years the poverty rates were reduced to their lowest level since records have been kept. Two things mitigated that progress in subsequent years, the Vietnam War, which drained resources and attention, and a growing perception on the part of many whites that they were footing the bill for lazy black people. That latter sentiment has been fed and fueled by politicians. Even now, where I live, I see bumper stickers that complain about people on welfare. I don't disagree at all with your value system, your desire to see people work who are able, or the kind of society you eventually want to see. I just want to always remember that things have been worse in the past without many of the social programs we have implemented. If I recall, social security reduced the poverty rate among the elderly by over 20% and other programs have improved the fortunes of not insignificant numbers of people. I remember that when Ronald Reagan was shot the doctor that saved his life went to Head Start and grew up on welfare. Of course that is anecdotal but it speaks to the fact that untold good has been accomplished through government programs. I haven't had a chance to study it yet but there is a Columbia University study that says our current poverty rate would be around 24% without our social safety nets. I'm not sure how far I feel like wading into the weeds on government policy but in general I would assert we need to do much better and most government programs need constant tweaking as we get more data. But we have a political system which means demagoguery and inefficiency are always going to be the rule of the day. Several times I have started to say to various people that we have wandered far from the subject of this thread. That's okay as long as we keep in mind that, per the uga story, racism in any form is an impediment to education. I personally think it is important to call it out whenever we see it because it diminishes us all and makes our society weaker. [/QUOTE]
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