Haynes King Update: How Do We Feel About Him?

[leatherneckjacket]

I rewatched the play and the officials reset the play clock to 25 after they noticed the mistake. The issue was we were arguing with them which ate up some of the clock. Then we made a late substitution when ate up more clock and allowed BC to make their substitutions which ate up the rest of the play clock.

 

[tmhunter52]

Kings problems are nothing that a consistent OL can’t fix.

King wishes he got the time that Castellanos got in the pocket yesterday

 

[bobongo]

King wishes he got the time that Castellanos got in the pocket yesterday

Our OL pass blocking is much better than last year. Castellanos getting much more time is a function of our poor DL more than a deficiency on OL.

https://www.si.com/college/georgiatech/football/georgia-tech-football-midseason-report-card-offensive-line

"Last season, PFF had Georgia Tech's pass blocking grading out at 42.8 (which is terrible) and the run blocking at 50.8.
This season, Georgia Tech's pass-blocking grade is 67.4 and the run-blocking grade is 63.8."

 

[stinger78]

Our OL pass blocking is much better than last year. Castellanos getting much more time is a function of our poor DL more than a deficiency on OL.

https://www.si.com/college/georgiatech/football/georgia-tech-football-midseason-report-card-offensive-line

"Last season, PFF had Georgia Tech's pass blocking grading out at 42.8 (which is terrible) and the run blocking at 50.8.
This season, Georgia Tech's pass-blocking grade is 67.4 and the run-blocking grade is 63.8."

Better, but still not good.

 

[JacketOff]

Our OL pass blocking is much better than last year. Castellanos getting much more time is a function of our poor DL more than a deficiency on OL.

https://www.si.com/college/georgiatech/football/georgia-tech-football-midseason-report-card-offensive-line

"Last season, PFF had Georgia Tech's pass blocking grading out at 42.8 (which is terrible) and the run blocking at 50.8.
This season, Georgia Tech's pass-blocking grade is 67.4 and the run-blocking grade is 63.8."

Yeah it’s better, and noticeably better. But also still noticeably not very good. At the same time I believe our DL play is noticeably worse. If this year’s offense had last year’s defense we could probably win 8-9 games. Hell, we could’ve won 8 games this year if we didn’t **** the bed every-time we got a chance.

Either way, Haynes King is the least of our worries. He’s playing fine, and has played well enough for us to win more games than we have. The people calling for him to be benched completely have no idea what they’re talking about. King is in the top half of FBS QBs in basically every stat while playing behind a mediocre OLine and with questionable skill players.

 

[Northeast Stinger]

The way to get around the substitutions running down your own play clock is to just snap the ball while they are substituting. It’s not a penalty and resets the play clock.

In this case one of the refs was standing between King and the running back and in the way of the motion man.

 

[Northeast Stinger]

Just upping my post count replying to myself….

So there is a bunch of weird clock stuff in the ESPN play by play on that series. We ran five plays with 10:24 on the clock apparently….
View attachment 14950

The time out was actually taken after Copley’s 3rd down run. On the play….
It was 3rd and 1, we ran Cooley to right side. He was tackled right at the line. He actually looked short.
The clock never stopped and the play clock started at 40. No signal was given by the official. We made a substitution with about 27 seconds on the clock and a couple seconds later the chains started to move.
The chains were set with 19 seconds on the play clock and then the play clock jumped to 25 (as it should on first down).
BC then took a wholesale substitution around 15 seconds. The TV was on Key, who was arguing with the official so I could not see if we also subbed between the 25 second reset and BC’s massive platoon change around 15 seconds.
At any rate, BC took their time and the officials held the snap.

Since the play clock actually reset at 25 when the chains moved, it was not as egregious as I first thought, but the game clock never stopped running at all.
The right thing would’ve been for the official to reset the game clock and start 25 seconds on ready for play.
The scenario played out such that they stole a time out from us but it was the 2nd quarter and ultimately was not critical. Unfortunate it happened to us though…

Crap. Now I’m going to have to look at it.

My memory is that game clock never moved. The play clock seemed to just be automatically running whether plays were run or not, or first downs were made or not.

I’m exaggerating but not by much. What first caught my eye was the play looked a yard short of the first down. Then I noticed the game clock was stopped (it remained stopped the whole time, before, during and after) while the play clock just kept running. Then I noticed the chain guys looking confused and the refs acting like it was a first down, then the chains moving, Tech lining up and the play clock getting dangerously low. Then the refs, who had yet to give any clear signal, stood in the middle of Tech’s backfield while starring at the sideline. They finally started the play with 3 seconds or less on the play clock and I remember thinking, “There goes that drive.”

 

[tmhunter52]

Do we have any freshmen RBs that are promising?

 

[bucknellbison31]

Yeah it’s better, and noticeably better. But also still noticeably not very good. At the same time I believe our DL play is noticeably worse. If this year’s offense had last year’s defense we could probably win 8-9 games. Hell, we could’ve won 8 games this year if we didn’t **** the bed every-time we got a chance.

Either way, Haynes King is the least of our worries. He’s playing fine, and has played well enough for us to win more games than we have. The people calling for him to be benched completely have no idea what they’re talking about. King is in the top half of FBS QBs in basically every stat while playing behind a mediocre OLine and with questionable skill players.

It continually astounds me how some on this thread want to bury Haynes when he's undoubtedly our most promising player. Why do we expect him to overcome all of the mediocrity around him? He doesn't have any star skill players to throw to.

Also, I love Pyron, but people act like he's a world-beater — he helped us sneak by a horrible Virginia Tech team and then played below average in two other losses. HK is CLEARLY the better QB right now.

 

[iceeater1969]

We need to open up the pass first offense like we had at start of season. Tough break for the defense. King was leader in ACC till someone decided we needed more UTM by a wr and a rb fhat jukes try to get big yards.

 

[bobongo]

It continually astounds me how some on this thread want to bury Haynes when he's undoubtedly our most promising player. Why do we expect him to overcome all of the mediocrity around him? He doesn't have any star skill players to throw to.

Also, I love Pyron, but people act like he's a world-beater — he helped us sneak by a horrible Virginia Tech team and then played below average in two other losses. HK is CLEARLY the better QB right now.

I really don't see anyone trying to bury Haynes. I see a few who think it might be a good idea to get Jeff Pyron some action, and it might at that.
Sometimes a QB can benefit from watching a series or two from the sideline. King generally throws a good ball, but he throws into tight coverage a lot. He has to be more careful with the football.
Seems he throws a lot to the primary receiver without going through the progressions. I could be wrong, but that's the impression I get.
Could be the line isn't giving him enough time in some cases, or no one's getting open. I don't doubt both of those factors are contributors to the interceptions, but it seems to me it would not be imprudent at this point to get Pyron some action. Haynes needs to stop forcing the ball in there. I'm not saying he isn't the best we've got, but he has limitations and the guy on the bench should get some playing time. Pyron hasn't had enough work to be fully evaluated at this point. He needs some playing time.

 

[g0lftime]

Our OL pass blocking is much better than last year. Castellanos getting much more time is a function of our poor DL more than a deficiency on OL.

https://www.si.com/college/georgiatech/football/georgia-tech-football-midseason-report-card-offensive-line

"Last season, PFF had Georgia Tech's pass blocking grading out at 42.8 (which is terrible) and the run blocking at 50.8.
This season, Georgia Tech's pass-blocking grade is 67.4 and the run-blocking grade is 63.8."

We may have been trying not to over run him and give him running lanes but he burned us passing and running. I am concerned that King may be trying to carry the team on his back and forces passes into coverages that he shouldn't. There was one play that comes to mind where he scrambled left and had running run but chose to throw to a covered receiver that was broken up. The one he threw directly to the DB was a headscratcher.

 

[bobongo]

We may have been trying not to over run him and give him running lanes but he burned us passing and running. I am concerned that King may be trying to carry the team on his back and forces passes into coverages that he shouldn't. There was one play that comes to mind where he scrambled left and had running run but chose to throw to a covered receiver that was broken up. The one he threw directly to the DB was a headscratcher.

It could well be that Haynes is trying to carry the team on his shoulders. One thing I'm sure of, he's doing the best he can. And at times he's been spectacular. Just inconsistent and forcing things.

 

[Root4GT]

I really don't see anyone trying to bury Haynes. I see a few who think it might be a good idea to get Jeff Pyron some action, and it might at that.
Sometimes a QB can benefit from watching a series or two from the sideline. King generally throws a good ball, but he throws into tight coverage a lot. He has to be more careful with the football.
Seems he throws a lot to the primary receiver without going through the progressions. I could be wrong, but that's the impression I get.
Could be the line isn't giving him enough time in some cases, or no one's getting open. I don't doubt both of those factors are contributors to the interceptions, but it seems to me it would not be imprudent at this point to get Pyron some action. Haynes needs to stop forcing the ball in there. I'm not saying he isn't the best we've got, but he has limitations and the guy on the bench should get some playing time. Pyron hasn't had enough work to be fully evaluated at this point. He needs some playing time.

He gets time in practice. If he were the better option he would play. Currently King is the better option. P

 

[bobongo]

He gets time in practice. If he were the better option he would play. Currently King is the better option. P

Sometimes it helps to get the guy on the field. Not saying Haynes isn't the better option, but every other player gets spelled now and again, why not the QB? It could help both Haynes and Jeff, both.
I'm not saying Jeff should start, but I'd like to see him out there for one or two series.

 

[Augusta_Jacket]

For the record, it's Zach Pyron...

 

[GT33]

Never understood why everyone rotates damn near every player at every position except QB. You sub LBs, you sub WRs, you sub OL, you sub RBs, you sub DL, etc. I guess you don't sub FG kickers, they get canned. QBs, they stay in regardless of whether they're having a good day or not. I just never understood it.

Not calling for King to get canned, but maybe a series or two watching when he starts struggling might be a good thing. Also helps to have the back up prepared.

 

[Root4GT]

Never understood why everyone rotates damn near every player at every position except QB. You sub LBs, you sub WRs, you sub OL, you sub RBs, you sub DL, etc. I guess you don't sub FG kickers, they get canned. QBs, they stay in regardless of whether they're having a good day or not. I just never understood it.

Not calling for King to get canned, but maybe a series or two watching when he starts struggling might be a good thing. Also helps to have the back up prepared.

Simple. QB is the hardest position to play by far.

 

[ThatGuy]

Never understood why everyone rotates damn near every player at every position except QB. You sub LBs, you sub WRs, you sub OL, you sub RBs, you sub DL, etc. I guess you don't sub FG kickers, they get canned. QBs, they stay in regardless of whether they're having a good day or not. I just never understood it.

Not calling for King to get canned, but maybe a series or two watching when he starts struggling might be a good thing. Also helps to have the back up prepared.

Agreed.

I'm one of the ones not calling for King to be benched - but calling for a potential cool down opportunity when the offense can't get moving and he starts turning it over.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but turnover margin is one of the most reliable leading indicators of who will win a game (John Madden's quote on "Usually, the team that scores the most points wins the game" excepted). When King throws an interception or two, then we put the ball on the ground once or twice due to a bad mesh between QB & RB - that to me sound like it's time to give him an opportunity to settle down - and to send a message that really resonates. You put the ball into the other team's hands as a pattern, you get some time off.

Doesn't matter if he's the best player on the field in terms of mechanics, measurables, etc - so was Jeff Sims. He won us some games. But he also got into a mental state where he turned the ball over regularly, both here and at Nebraska. And now he's officially QB2 or QB3 for them, because his tendency to turn the ball over consistently directly cost them games.

While I'm in no way saying King should be relegated to the bench, I am saying that if he's cold one game, we should put in our other option and give King a breather, so he can settled down and stop making more mistakes because he's trying so hard to "do more" to dig himself out of the hole of his (and the team's) previous mistakes.

I hate cheering for Bama, but it certainly worked for Alabama in two of my favorite championship games from recent years. About the decision at halftime in that 2018 CFP national championship game to sit Hurts and put in Tua, Saban said, "This gives Jalen a chance to kind of settle down. Maybe it gives him a different kind of perspective seeing it from the sideline." And then they traded that up a year later in the SEC Championship game.

 

[Lil G]

Agreed.

I'm one of the ones not calling for King to be benched - but calling for a potential cool down opportunity when the offense can't get moving and he starts turning it over.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but turnover margin is one of the most reliable leading indicators of who will win a game (John Madden's quote on "Usually, the team that scores the most points wins the game" excepted). When King throws an interception or two, then we put the ball on the ground once or twice due to a bad mesh between QB & RB - that to me sound like it's time to give him an opportunity to settle down - and to send a message that really resonates. You put the ball into the other team's hands as a pattern, you get some time off.

Doesn't matter if he's the best player on the field in terms of mechanics, measurables, etc - so was Jeff Sims. He won us some games. But he also got into a mental state where he turned the ball over regularly, both here and at Nebraska. And now he's officially QB2 or QB3 for them, because his tendency to turn the ball over consistently directly cost them games.

While I'm in no way saying King should be relegated to the bench, I am saying that if he's cold one game, we should put in our other option and give King a breather, so he can settled down and stop making more mistakes because he's trying so hard to "do more" to dig himself out of the hole of his (and the team's) previous mistakes.

I hate cheering for Bama, but it certainly worked for Alabama in two of my favorite championship games from recent years. About the decision at halftime in that 2018 CFP national championship game to sit Hurts and put in Tua, Saban said, "This gives Jalen a chance to kind of settle down. Maybe it gives him a different kind of perspective seeing it from the sideline." And then they traded that up a year later in the SEC Championship game.

Couldn’t agree more. Personally I think this could have saved us bowling green. Something felt pretty off by halftime and I thought it was time. Nothing against King, it was just a rough day at work.