GT ranks #33 in football program monetary value

dressedcheeseside

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Eh...sorry, just because you arbitrarily designate some percentage (which favors your POV) doesn't mean the rest of the world needs to follow it. I'm going with the more respected US News (who BTW GT uses for marketing purposes when they recruit) for their designation of STEM universities.

As for the rest of your post, I don't disagree with it, it just doesn't have anything to do with my OP. Yes it's harder at GT (which I've stated already), but you either find a way to overcome them (as Stanford and Duke have) or you fold your tent and play somewhere else. College sports isn't fair, like the real world...not everyone is on the same playing field. It sucks, but is sucks more to complain about it and not do anything to improve the situation.

Luckily, AD Bobinski isn't one to complain and he's giving CPJ tools to level the playing field. CPJ has hired some coaches that are better recruiters than the ones that left, he's increased the recruiting personnel, and we're more active on social media getting our message out and controlling the narrative...all of which were big issues when CPJ first got here. We're seeing the impact of all of that now with better commits this recruiting cycle. It's harder getting the kids GT needs, but IT CAN BE DONE...and we're seeing it first hand now.
LOL. whatever. I'd love to hear your definition. Did you even see where I said if you made the definition 50% of degrees granted there'd still be only one other D1 STEM school other than us?
 

Bruce Wayne

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Why not just get to the point and say that Tech only offers Baccalaureate of Science degrees? That is the real issue and what defines it as opposed to Stanford and every other good school that does offer many stem degrees or even grants a decent amount of them. Much of the difference in available manner of operating an athletic program can be tied into variety of Baccalaureate of Arts degrees available.
 

Techster

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LOL. whatever. I'd love to hear your definition. Did you even see where I said if you made the definition 50% of degrees granted there'd still be only one other D1 STEM school other than us?

The problem is YOU are trying to define something...when in reality, STEM only refers to a designation for a degree (see Cyp's wiki link). You can LOL all you want, but just because you narrowly define something (which BTW, favors your argument...LOL how that works, huh?) doesn't make it a defining mark for the rest of us to follow. YOU are trying to make GT out to be this Fort Knox of getting kids into GT and keeping them in, when in reality it's obviously more difficult than factory schools but not impossible.

Yet you are ignoring the obvious: GT is doing REALLY well right now in recruiting because of the reasons I spelled out in my earlier posts. LOL how you're still arguing against some idea in your head when the reality of what's going on with our 2015 class spells out the potential of what GT can be once the staff finally "gets it". Like I said earlier, GT may be STEM heavy, but that doesn't deter us from recruiting well (currently a top 30 class) and getting kids into GT that are capable of the work. The current class certainly blows holes into the antiquated recruiting excuses posters like you keep holding onto.
 

Northeast Stinger

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BTW...have you noticed how well we're doing this recruiting class? What changed about GT that all of a sudden a higher tier of recruits want to play for us? Helps when you put people on the staff that are actually strong recruiters.[/QUOTE]

It helps when you have people on the staff, period. Tech had cut back on recruiting staff prior to CPJ's arrival. He has been lobbying and working to increase that staff ever since arriving. Tech still does not have the massive numbers of recruiters that the factories have but Tech has more firepower over the last couple of years than it has had in awhile.

I take recruiting rankings with a grain of salt (sometimes with the whole darn shaker) but 247Sports latest rankings have Tech's 2015 class ranked ahead of Oklahoma, Virginia Tech, Florida, Michigan State, Texas, Michigan and Arkansas.
 

Techster

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BTW...have you noticed how well we're doing this recruiting class? What changed about GT that all of a sudden a higher tier of recruits want to play for us? Helps when you put people on the staff that are actually strong recruiters.

It helps when you have people on the staff, period. Tech had cut back on recruiting staff prior to CPJ's arrival. He has been lobbying and working to increase that staff ever since arriving. Tech still does not have the massive numbers of recruiters that the factories have but Tech has more firepower over the last couple of years than it has had in awhile.

I take recruiting rankings with a grain of salt (sometimes with the whole darn shaker) but 247Sports latest rankings have Tech's 2015 class ranked ahead of Oklahoma, Virginia Tech, Florida, Michigan State, Texas, Michigan and Arkansas.[/QUOTE]

Yup...more bodies and more people on staff that can actually carry their weight in recruiting (Roof, Pelton, Cook, Speed is coming into his own, McCollum has always been good). The funny thing about the "more people on staff" argument is, fans never raised that issue until the last few years...and now it's being raised as an excuse (and it's valid). I'm glad CPJ is getting as many tools to recruit as possible because GT is starting to recruit to its potential despite what some posters want to believe GT can't do.

Signing day is still a ways away...those schools you mentioned will surely rise once the elite national prospects make their decisions. Other schools on the list will drop. Then once kids get re-ranked after their senior year more things will change. What the rankings show, the same rankings that GT fans like to say favor the factory schools, is that GT definitely has the potential to be a top 20-30 level recruiting player.
 

ATL1

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I agree GT can and should recruit a lot better than they were in the past. Personally I feel GT should be able to pull together top 25 recruiting serviced ranked classes consistently. From what I understand we only have 3 staffed recruiters while schools like Bama have 15-18 staffed recruiters around 10 called football analyst http://www.rolltide.com/staffdir/alab-staffdir.html
Yet Tech is consistent and is starting to really pick things up. Imagine that type of resources directed towards football at GT.

To be honest I find what Bama is doing disgusting. Are they even remotely actually educating the kids or passing them through towards graduation.
 

dressedcheeseside

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LOL. whatever.
The problem is YOU are trying to define something...when in reality, STEM only refers to a designation for a degree (see Cyp's wiki link). You can LOL all you want, but just because you narrowly define something (which BTW, favors your argument...LOL how that works, huh?) doesn't make it a defining mark for the rest of us to follow. YOU are trying to make GT out to be this Fort Knox of getting kids into GT and keeping them in, when in reality it's obviously more difficult than factory schools but not impossible.

Yet you are ignoring the obvious: GT is doing REALLY well right now in recruiting because of the reasons I spelled out in my earlier posts. LOL how you're still arguing against some idea in your head when the reality of what's going on with our 2015 class spells out the potential of what GT can be once the staff finally "gets it". Like I said earlier, GT may be STEM heavy, but that doesn't deter us from recruiting well (currently a top 30 class) and getting kids into GT that are capable of the work. The current class certainly blows holes into the antiquated recruiting excuses posters like you keep holding onto.
OK, you win, you convinced me, we are on a level playing field with the factories. Sheesh.

Btw, forget about designation or definition, does the fact that we're the only FBS school with 75%+ STEM degree issuance mean anything to you? Have you even asked yourself why no other school with our narrow curriculum plays big boy football? If the answer is no, don't bother answering.
 
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Techster

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OK, you win, you convinced me, we are on a level playing field with the factories. Sheesh.

Btw, forget about designation or definition, does the fact that we're the only FBS school with 75%+ STEM degree issuance mean anything to you? Have you even asked yourself why no other school with our narrow curriculum plays big boy football? If the answer is no, don't bother answering.

Eesh...here you go again. Making an argument in the face of what's going on in reality.

Please tell me where I've said we were on a level playing field with factories? In fact, I said the opposite: "
YOU are trying to make GT out to be this Fort Knox of getting kids into GT and keeping them in, when in reality it's obviously more difficult than factory schools but not impossible."

Your STEM issue would mean something if the large majority of our SAs were in fact STEM majors...which they are NOT. It pretty much levels the foundation of your STEM argument. Furthermore, as CPJ has proved recently despite some unfortunate recent academic attrition, GT can keep players eligible as we've had record graduation levels and APR scores.

As for your last question...are you serious? GT has one of the richest football traditions, we last won the National Championship in 1990, and won a conference championship as recently as 2009. But according to your logic, GT shouldn't even be competing with other teams. Yet somehow GT has been able to compete through the years...longest streak of having a non-losing conference record, one of the longest bowl streaks, multiple conference championship appearances (2 within the last 6 years...one win). Somehow we managed to do all that with a bunch of athletes who were not STEM majors.

Again, if you're going to make an argument, base it on reality. The reality is, when GT finally "gets it", they can recruit well. And we're seeing that right now with this recruiting cycle. Are you ignoring that as well because it doesn't fit into your antiquated recruiting narrative for GT?
 

Northeast Stinger

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I agree GT can and should recruit a lot better than they were in the past. Personally I feel GT should be able to pull together top 25 recruiting serviced ranked classes consistently. From what I understand we only have 3 staffed recruiters while schools like Bama have 15-18 staffed recruiters around 10 called football analyst http://www.rolltide.com/staffdir/alab-staffdir.html
Yet Tech is consistent and is starting to really pick things up. Imagine that type of resources directed towards football at GT.

To be honest I find what Bama is doing disgusting. Are they even remotely actually educating the kids or passing them through towards graduation.
One of the things that I notice whenever I look at 247Sports is how often the top recruits get assigned one particular recruiter from a factory school. For years Tech was spread so thin they could never afford to assign one particular recruiter to just shadow a guy but occasionally now you will see where Tech is able to do that, though it still is mainly a coaching staff thing.
 

Eric

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One of the things that I notice whenever I look at 247Sports is how often the top recruits get assigned one particular recruiter from a factory school. For years Tech was spread so thin they could never afford to assign one particular recruiter to just shadow a guy but occasionally now you will see where Tech is able to do that, though it still is mainly a coaching staff thing.

It is like that at all schools.

Coaches are assigned areas they recruit. Every now and then you will see us use more than one.
 

Northeast Stinger

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Eesh...here you go again. Making an argument in the face of what's going on in reality.

Please tell me where I've said we were on a level playing field with factories? In fact, I said the opposite: "
YOU are trying to make GT out to be this Fort Knox of getting kids into GT and keeping them in, when in reality it's obviously more difficult than factory schools but not impossible."

Your STEM issue would mean something if the large majority of our SAs were in fact STEM majors...which they are NOT. It pretty much levels the foundation of your STEM argument. Furthermore, as CPJ has proved recently despite some unfortunate recent academic attrition, GT can keep players eligible as we've had record graduation levels and APR scores.

As for your last question...are you serious? GT has one of the richest football traditions, we last won the National Championship in 1990, and won a conference championship as recently as 2009. But according to your logic, GT shouldn't even be competing with other teams. Yet somehow GT has been able to compete through the years...longest streak of having a non-losing conference record, one of the longest bowl streaks, multiple conference championship appearances (2 within the last 6 years...one win). Somehow we managed to do all that with a bunch of athletes who were not STEM majors.

Again, if you're going to make an argument, base it on reality. The reality is, when GT finally "gets it", they can recruit well. And we're seeing that right now with this recruiting cycle. Are you ignoring that as well because it doesn't fit into your antiquated recruiting narrative for GT?

I am glad that you are thrilled with the direction Tech football is going. As someone else said, having a positive attitude will do wonders for this program, in spite of any handicaps our program has to play with.
 

Northeast Stinger

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It is like that at all schools.

Coaches are assigned areas they recruit. Every now and then you will see us use more than one.
I understand that. I see that Tech does that. I am just saying that there are certain schools who seem to always have an extra person assigned to top recruits even if it is in an area that a particular member of the coaching staff is responsible for. I am seeing this more from Tech now but still not to the extent of certain schools.
 

Techster

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I am glad that you are thrilled with the direction Tech football is going. As someone else said, having a positive attitude will do wonders for this program, in spite of any handicaps our program has to play with.

Good thing someone like Stephen Hawking didn't let a handicap stop him from becoming one of the greatest physicist in history.

Good thing Jim Abott never let a handicap prevent him from playing Major League baseball.

Good thing Stevie Wonder never let a handicap prevent him from being a great musician.

The point is, you can sit there cry about your weaknesses, or your can focus on your strengths. GT for all the perceived weakness in recruiting, also has some resources a lot of schools don't have...and that includes factory schools: top notch facilities, being ranked one of the best schools in the world (not just in the nation), being located in a business rich and diverse city like Atlanta (which a lot of our commits allude to).
 

dressedcheeseside

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Good thing someone like Stephen Hawking didn't let a handicap stop him from becoming one of the greatest physicist in history.

Good thing Jim Abott never let a handicap prevent him from playing Major League baseball.

Good thing Stevie Wonder never let a handicap prevent him from being a great musician.

The point is, you can sit there cry about your weaknesses, or your can focus on your strengths. GT for all the perceived weakness in recruiting, also has some resources a lot of schools don't have...and that includes factory schools: top notch facilities, being ranked one of the best schools in the world (not just in the nation), being located in a business rich and diverse city like Atlanta (which a lot of our commits allude to).
When did I ever say we couldn't overcome our obstacles?
 

Northeast Stinger

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Good thing someone like Stephen Hawking didn't let a handicap stop him from becoming one of the greatest physicist in history.

Good thing Jim Abott never let a handicap prevent him from playing Major League baseball.

Good thing Stevie Wonder never let a handicap prevent him from being a great musician.

The point is, you can sit there cry about your weaknesses, or your can focus on your strengths. GT for all the perceived weakness in recruiting, also has some resources a lot of schools don't have...and that includes factory schools: top notch facilities, being ranked one of the best schools in the world (not just in the nation), being located in a business rich and diverse city like Atlanta (which a lot of our commits allude to).
I applaud your attitude. You have named 3 "one in a million" superstars in their fields. I like to think Tech is also a one in a million kind of place. Congratulations!
 

dressedcheeseside

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Was my post replying to you?
No, but it still applies to your earlier reply. For the record (and one more time), I think our obstacles are not impossible to overcome. But first you have to recognize them and then formulate a plan with them in mind. If you pretend they don't exist or minimize them, you'll never get anywhere.

It's not an easy task by any means. I think that's why it's taken CPJ so long to figure it out. It took the last guy equally as long to figure it out, but he got canned before he could reap the rewards.

Oh, I am fully aware the vast majority of our players are not enrolled in STEM fields. I explained earlier in this thread exactly how that does not diminish the impact GT's unique identity has on recruiting. I'm not going to repeat it here.

The fact that no other high majority STEM degree issuing school plays "big boy" football is, indeed, significant and helps underscore the challenges we face. In no way is it an excuse or reason to justify failure. We are GT after all. I went there, graduated and am damn proud to be a Jacket.
 

Techster

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No, but it still applies to your earlier reply. For the record (and one more time), I think our obstacles are not impossible to overcome. But first you have to recognize them and then formulate a plan with them in mind. If you pretend they don't exist or minimize them, you'll never get anywhere.

It's not an easy task by any means. I think that's why it's taken CPJ so long to figure it out. It took the last guy equally as long to figure it out, but he got canned before he could reap the rewards.

Oh, I am fully aware the vast majority of our players are not enrolled in STEM fields. I explained earlier in this thread exactly how that does not diminish the impact GT's unique identity has on recruiting. I'm not going to repeat it here.

The fact that no other high majority STEM degree issuing school plays "big boy" football is, indeed, significant and helps underscore the challenges we face. In no way is it an excuse or reason to justify failure. We are GT after all. I went there, graduated and am damn proud to be a Jacket.

Let's just agree to disagree. My interest in this thread is officially dead.
 

dressedcheeseside

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Let's just agree to disagree. My interest in this thread is officially dead.
That's fine. This is an open forum for all to see. It's not just two guys arguing over a couple of beers. My comments are directed at you, but are meant to engage anyone reading along and I welcome all opinions, even yours. ;)
 

Northeast Stinger

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That's fine. This is an open forum for all to see. It's not just two guys arguing over a couple of beers. My comments are directed at you, but are meant to engage anyone reading along and I welcome all opinions, even yours. ;)
I am may be sorry but let me stick my nose in this. I have heard these same arguments on other sites. They always reduce me to wondering if there is just a limit to how far dialogue can go on the internet. Both sides make reasonable articulate points, and, if you just look at the meaning of the words themselves, there is only a marginal nuanced difference of opinion. The real argument seems to be going on with some unseen third party who someone has dealt with somewhere else. This third party may have shown up on a cable news opinion piece or perhaps at someone's local town hall meeting or maybe he is someone's shiftless cousin, but he is not either of the gentlemen in this conversation. Yet when the arguments stray is usually in response to this unseen third party. The actual gentlemen in this conversation do not whine, make alibis or excuses for failure. Neither do they fail to face reality, gloss over the special challenges of a school like Tech, act like all schools have the same curriculum or pretend that we are still recruiting in 1954. Both gentlemen want excellence, both want it sooner rather than later and both want the athletic department to pay the price to see that that happens. Beyond that there are some real but nevertheless subtle differences that probably have to do with temperament, level of optimism and patience levels more than anything else. The rest is just semantics, in my opinion.
 
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