GT number 15 in lowest talent on roster

alagold

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They is little doubt that we had overall average talent in the last several yrs.On top of that we lost a large number of guys off roster for myriad of reasons.So what is possibly amazing really is how we did as well as we did.
 

White_Gold

GT Athlete
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314
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Dahlonega
They is little doubt that we had overall average talent in the last several yrs.On top of that we lost a large number of guys off roster for myriad of reasons.So what is possibly amazing really is how we did as well as we did.

Calling our roster overall average talent is being nice and not really painting the correct picture on just how bad of a job the last guy did in recruiting.
 

iceeater1969

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9,660
I agree the coaches have to Coach Em Up!!!! At some point it is what it is!!!
And the players have to make the plays.

I think we will start a lot of different guys in 20. The 19 guys were average at best and did not have great room for improvement.
NEXT year after an average year I think we will have 70 % returning
 

swampsting

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1,868
Did recruiting matter to PJ? Yes. You can find evidence, even on this board, about it. Dig back into the archives here. As CGC is the one who was solely responsible for recruiting Brown, so is PJ the one who recruited Tobias, whom CGC himself called SEC level athlete.
Did recruiting rankings matter to PJ?
Not one (xxxx) bit.
He did, however, manage to get a 4 star QB in Graham (away from VT, no less, and with an Alabama offer as well), another QB later judged to be a 4 star (Yates), and some very undervalued 3 star kids (Mason, a beast, and Juanyeh, surprisingly rated as a middling 3 star), just to top it off.
we lost out on some big time recruits - tomlinson, malkom parrish (probably a good thing ... he didn't play very well us against anyway) and corn elder, whom PJ had sit next to him at a Tech hoops game courtside on his OV, before he choose da eww.
1. recruiting is still a crap shoot. I looked it a year or two ago and went back over the national 5 stars for about a decade. More often than not, half of those guys never amounted to much of anything. There was one year were about 28 of the 32 5 stars turned out to be bad dudes on the field, i.e., they lived up to the billing. Still, a lot in other years didn't.
2. Coaching still matters. Look at FSU's recruiting ratings. Look great in February. On the field in November, look like what Chief Osceola's horse left behind. And Oklahoma has made the CFP without having many (if any) top 10 classes, until the last year or so, IIRC.
3. all that really matters is winning.
and i do not want to sit through another year where I watch us lose to a mediocre FCS team and get beat by 45 - twice - at home. In the same season. And I am uninterested in hearing "we're going to win big" yadda yadda yadda or any sunshine up the skirt about the future.
Like the man said, don't tell me. Show me.
It is my hope that the well regarded recruits CGC and his staff have brought will live up to their pre-college acclaim. But there are no guarantees to that effect.
Just win, baby.
 

Skeptic

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Messages
6,372
Did recruiting matter to PJ? Yes. You can find evidence, even on this board, about it. Dig back into the archives here. As CGC is the one who was solely responsible for recruiting Brown, so is PJ the one who recruited Tobias, whom CGC himself called SEC level athlete.
Did recruiting rankings matter to PJ?
Not one (xxxx) bit.
He did, however, manage to get a 4 star QB in Graham (away from VT, no less, and with an Alabama offer as well), another QB later judged to be a 4 star (Yates), and some very undervalued 3 star kids (Mason, a beast, and Juanyeh, surprisingly rated as a middling 3 star), just to top it off.
we lost out on some big time recruits - tomlinson, malkom parrish (probably a good thing ... he didn't play very well us against anyway) and corn elder, whom PJ had sit next to him at a Tech hoops game courtside on his OV, before he choose da eww.
1. recruiting is still a crap shoot. I looked it a year or two ago and went back over the national 5 stars for about a decade. More often than not, half of those guys never amounted to much of anything. There was one year were about 28 of the 32 5 stars turned out to be bad dudes on the field, i.e., they lived up to the billing. Still, a lot in other years didn't.
2. Coaching still matters. Look at FSU's recruiting ratings. Look great in February. On the field in November, look like what Chief Osceola's horse left behind. And Oklahoma has made the CFP without having many (if any) top 10 classes, until the last year or so, IIRC.
3. all that really matters is winning.
and i do not want to sit through another year where I watch us lose to a mediocre FCS team and get beat by 45 - twice - at home. In the same season. And I am uninterested in hearing "we're going to win big" yadda yadda yadda or any sunshine up the skirt about the future.
Like the man said, don't tell me. Show me.
It is my hope that the well regarded recruits CGC and his staff have brought will live up to their pre-college acclaim. But there are no guarantees to that effect.
Just win, baby.
As unreliable as individual and class ratings may be -- are -- it is still better to have highly rated recruits than lower level. The law of averages, if nothing else, applies. Yes, a lot of those 5-stars will play like 3s and a lot of the 3s might play like 5s. Age, development, coaching, facilities all contribute. (As an aside, if Tobias was "SEC level" -- an insult to the ACC in my view -- why didn't he make better use of him? As for the ratings, well. In the 2020 class one recruit went from a 4 to a 5 star and an Alabama recruit ... and leaped 49 places in one of the services.

But a good post. As for "look what Chief Osceola's horse left behind" regarding FSU, you can't make that stuff up, can you?
 

yeti92

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(As an aside, if Tobias was "SEC level" -- an insult to the ACC in my view -- why didn't he make better use of him?
He did try to use him, but he tried to use him in ways Tobias had never practiced before like kickoff returns and at wide receiver, so naturally he wasn't going to perform to the same level as he would have running the option that he had practiced for two years and was perfect for. Doesn't mean he's not an extremely talented athlete.
 

YJMD

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Messages
1,622
1. recruiting is still a crap shoot. I looked it a year or two ago and went back over the national 5 stars for about a decade. More often than not, half of those guys never amounted to much of anything. There was one year were about 28 of the 32 5 stars turned out to be bad dudes on the field, i.e., they lived up to the billing. Still, a lot in other years didn't.

Not a crap-shoot. There is definite correlation between recruiting rating and success on the field. If you look at the playoff teams since inception it should be obvious that recruiting rankings matter a lot to compete for titles. As you point out in #2, it is also not sufficient.

2. Coaching still matters. Look at FSU's recruiting ratings. Look great in February. On the field in November, look like what Chief Osceola's horse left behind. And Oklahoma has made the CFP without having many (if any) top 10 classes, until the last year or so, IIRC.

Definitely. Coaching and experience and continuity matter a ton.

3. all that really matters is winning.
and i do not want to sit through another year where I watch us lose to a mediocre FCS team and get beat by 45 - twice - at home. In the same season. And I am uninterested in hearing "we're going to win big" yadda yadda yadda or any sunshine up the skirt about the future.
Like the man said, don't tell me. Show me.
It is my hope that the well regarded recruits CGC and his staff have brought will live up to their pre-college acclaim. But there are no guarantees to that effect.
Just win, baby.

Partial agreement. If we are exciting yet inconsistent there can still be a lot of fun to be had, particularly while still expecting to be building toward something. Plus, there is absolutely some energy and value in anticipation for guys like Gibbs even if he never pans out. There are still folks who followed Vad and Dedrick after their departures. Winning is a lot, but not everything.

I'd also add that recruiting rankings don't always indicate the state of a roster going into a season. There is often attrition, high rated classes but not enough bodies, guys who don't end up qualifying or get into legal trouble, transfer pickups not being represented, etc. Even with enough replacement at a high talent level, the turnover of personnel can significantly impact results. This is an area where CGC seems to be excelling. He is doing a ton of roster management and engagement and practice reps of guys who aren't in the 2 deep currently. He's picked up talented and strategic transfers. And we've lost very little outside of graduation or injury, so much so that we are expecting to have to say goodbye to players who won't be contributors but still want to compete for that opportunity. Look at a place like VT which still has a nucleus of good players but is about to fall off a cliff. Miami is a great example of guys with all sorts of issues disrupting continuity and having trouble establishing a roster without some holes despite a high talent level.

In the end, CGC I think is going to get us in a much better spot than our recruiting rankings will indicate, and we won't be championship contenders unless the recruiting still improves heavily.
 

White_Gold

GT Athlete
Messages
314
Location
Dahlonega
Did recruiting matter to PJ? Yes. You can find evidence, even on this board, about it. Dig back into the archives here. As CGC is the one who was solely responsible for recruiting Brown, so is PJ the one who recruited Tobias, whom CGC himself called SEC level athlete.
Did recruiting rankings matter to PJ?
Not one (xxxx) bit.
He did, however, manage to get a 4 star QB in Graham (away from VT, no less, and with an Alabama offer as well), another QB later judged to be a 4 star (Yates), and some very undervalued 3 star kids (Mason, a beast, and Juanyeh, surprisingly rated as a middling 3 star), just to top it off.
we lost out on some big time recruits - tomlinson, malkom parrish (probably a good thing ... he didn't play very well us against anyway) and corn elder, whom PJ had sit next to him at a Tech hoops game courtside on his OV, before he choose da eww.
1. recruiting is still a crap shoot. I looked it a year or two ago and went back over the national 5 stars for about a decade. More often than not, half of those guys never amounted to much of anything. There was one year were about 28 of the 32 5 stars turned out to be bad dudes on the field, i.e., they lived up to the billing. Still, a lot in other years didn't.
2. Coaching still matters. Look at FSU's recruiting ratings. Look great in February. On the field in November, look like what Chief Osceola's horse left behind. And Oklahoma has made the CFP without having many (if any) top 10 classes, until the last year or so, IIRC.
3. all that really matters is winning.
and i do not want to sit through another year where I watch us lose to a mediocre FCS team and get beat by 45 - twice - at home. In the same season. And I am uninterested in hearing "we're going to win big" yadda yadda yadda or any sunshine up the skirt about the future.
Like the man said, don't tell me. Show me.
It is my hope that the well regarded recruits CGC and his staff have brought will live up to their pre-college acclaim. But there are no guarantees to that effect.
Just win, baby.

Weird how you've flamed me before for bringing up the last guy, and here you are making the same tired arguments that don't really add up.
 

JacketOff

Helluva Engineer
Messages
2,953
Partial agreement. If we are exciting yet inconsistent there can still be a lot of fun to be had, particularly while still expecting to be building toward something.
This statement pretty much sums up the last 11 years of Georgia Tech football. Inconsistent, but very exciting when everything clicked. Found ways to lose to worse teams (Duke & UNC), found ways to beat better teams (FSU, UGA, and Clemson). A lot of fun and exciting moments wrapped up in an overall experience that could’ve been a lot better, but also could’ve been a lot worse.
 

Skeptic

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Messages
6,372
He did try to use him, but he tried to use him in ways Tobias had never practiced before like kickoff returns and at wide receiver, so naturally he wasn't going to perform to the same level as he would have running the option that he had practiced for two years and was perfect for. Doesn't mean he's not an extremely talented athlete.
My poorly made point was supposed to be that there are a bunch of "SEC level" players in the ACC, and for a GT coach to belittle the talent level by pointing out one player who was "SEC level" shows an astonishing lack of appreciation for the job he has been handed. Moreover the post was comparing his evaluation with how he actually used this player ... a startling admission that he failed to use his talent; in short, he didn't coach him very well. There seemed to be a lot of that in 2019.
 
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