Georgia Tech at Virginia Tech, Tues, Feb 23, 7pm, RSN/ACCNX

SnidelyWhiplash

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Devoe is the jet fuel. When he's on, this team is on a different level. It opens so much up for everyone else. Jose and Moses usually are "on" most every game.

What a fantastic adjustment by our staff in the 2nd half to give Devoe primary ball handling duties, and a great job by Devoe to step up his game. Little things like that may just spark Devoe towards more consistency.

We talked about it some during chat, but that's basically a glimpse of what we could see post-Alvarado. I don't believe Mike had any turnovers once he become the primary PG.

This staff continues to make some really good adjustments. Helps having a upperclassmen heavy team that understands what the coaches want, but the staff has certainly been masterful for the most part this season.

We are something like 7-3 (just looked it up and already forgot, LOL) when Devoe scores 15+ points or shoots 45%+ from the field.
 

YJMD

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Our defense *should* get all the credit, because our defense fuels our offense. Without the fast breaks we create with steals etc, our set offense isn't *that* good. It's good, but certainly not Top 20 good.

Not entirely sure I agree. Our lack of turnovers on offense is really important to efficiency, not simply the likelihood that we put the ball through the hoop. All these things working together is necessary because winning a rebounding battle will never happen.
 

lv20gt

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Devoe is the jet fuel. When he's on, this team is on a different level. It opens so much up for everyone else. Jose and Moses usually are "on" most every game.
I was interested to see how often each of those 3 were "on" the past two years.

Moses Wright has scored in double digits 17/20 games this year (and had 8 points in each of the other three games). Last year he did it 23/31 times. So the last two years he's scored in double digits an impressive 78% of the time the last two years.

Jose is at 15/20 this year after 15/24 last year for 68% of the time the last two years.

Mike is at 15/20 this year after 23/28 last year for 73% of the time the last two years.

Obviously that's a very shallow look, but I do think for whatever reason people tend to react way more to Devoe having an off game than they should.

When all three of them are on though we are a very dangerous team because teams can often do a decent job of limiting one big and one guard. Having a third option going off is huge.
 

SecretAgentBuzz

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I was interested to see how often each of those 3 were "on" the past two years.

Moses Wright has scored in double digits 17/20 games this year (and had 8 points in each of the other three games). Last year he did it 23/31 times. So the last two years he's scored in double digits an impressive 78% of the time the last two years.

Jose is at 15/20 this year after 15/24 last year for 68% of the time the last two years.

Mike is at 15/20 this year after 23/28 last year for 73% of the time the last two years.

Obviously that's a very shallow look, but I do think for whatever reason people tend to react way more to Devoe having an off game than they should.

When all three of them are on though we are a very dangerous team because teams can often do a decent job of limiting one big and one guard. Having a third option going off is huge.
Thanks for looking up the percentages. Without looking up the numbers, I *feel* like that when Wright or Alvarado are having bad games, they still score 7 to 9 points and fill the stat sheet in other ways. It seems that when Devoe has bad games, he ends up shooting under 20% and has less than 5 points, plus he doesn't typically offer the defense the other two give. That is why, in my opinion, Devoe gets singled out more often. I still appreciate him, though--he's a Yellow Jacket, after all. All of these guys are playing hard and working together well right now, and it is a beautiful thing to watch.
 

Techster

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I was interested to see how often each of those 3 were "on" the past two years.

Moses Wright has scored in double digits 17/20 games this year (and had 8 points in each of the other three games). Last year he did it 23/31 times. So the last two years he's scored in double digits an impressive 78% of the time the last two years.

Jose is at 15/20 this year after 15/24 last year for 68% of the time the last two years.

Mike is at 15/20 this year after 23/28 last year for 73% of the time the last two years.

Obviously that's a very shallow look, but I do think for whatever reason people tend to react way more to Devoe having an off game than they should.

When all three of them are on though we are a very dangerous team because teams can often do a decent job of limiting one big and one guard. Having a third option going off is huge.

I'd love to know our record when Moses + Jose + Devoe all score in double figures in the same game. I would be shocked if the win % isn't around 60-70+%

We also need to give Usher a shout out. He's just become a REALLY good player for us. There have been games where he's carried us offensively for a stretch, or has made some key shots. He's also one of our better defenders. He doesn't have the steals stats that Jose has, or blocks, or high rebound average, but his ability to get in front of players and cause them to give up the ball or alter their shots is pretty impressive. Those things don't get reflected in the box score, but they're things that have helped to make us one of the better defensive teams in the country.
 

orientalnc

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I was interested to see how often each of those 3 were "on" the past two years.

Moses Wright has scored in double digits 17/20 games this year (and had 8 points in each of the other three games). Last year he did it 23/31 times. So the last two years he's scored in double digits an impressive 78% of the time the last two years.

Jose is at 15/20 this year after 15/24 last year for 68% of the time the last two years.

Mike is at 15/20 this year after 23/28 last year for 73% of the time the last two years.

Obviously that's a very shallow look, but I do think for whatever reason people tend to react way more to Devoe having an off game than they should.

When all three of them are on though we are a very dangerous team because teams can often do a decent job of limiting one big and one guard. Having a third option going off is huge.
This is good stuff. I feel the 0-6 nights Mike has from from 3-pt range are the "off nights" that hurt us. Not faulting him because that is as much a part of his game as the 6-6 nights. On those Michael off nights the middle is not as open because teams, knowing Mike is streaky, let him have those shots as long as they aren't falling. Everything opens up when teams have to take that away from him.
 

lv20gt

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Thanks for looking up the percentages. Without looking up the numbers, I *feel* like that when Wright or Alvarado are having bad games, they still score 7 to 9 points and fill the stat sheet in other ways. It seems that when Devoe has bad games, he ends up shooting under 20% and has less than 5 points, plus he doesn't typically offer the defense the other two give. That is why, in my opinion, Devoe gets singled out more often. I still appreciate him, though--he's a Yellow Jacket, after all. All of these guys are playing hard and working together well right now, and it is a beautiful thing to watch.

Moses is mr consistency. In those 3 games he had exactly 8 and 6 in each, and in one he had 5 steals and another 5 assists with 3 steals. He's really only had one disappearing act this year which was against UVA at home.

However, IMO both mike and jose have had bad games at bad times. IMO the difference is that when Jose has such an impact on our team that when he has an off game (@FSU, @UL, @Clemson) the team as a whole seems to struggle and so he's less likely to bear the brunt of the blame. However, when Mike has had a bad game (UVA x 2, Duke) we can still have a decent performance overall and if we lose close he's more likely to be singled out.


I'd love to know our record when Moses + Jose + Devoe all score in double figures in the same game. I would be shocked if the win % isn't around 60-70+%

I believe the only loss we've had this year where all 3 scored above 10 was georgia state where they all scored 24 or more in 4Ots.
Jose scored less than 10 Mercer, @FSU, @UL, @ Clemson
, Mike @UVA, Duke, UVA,
Moses UVA

They've all scored 10 or more the last 5 wins as well as FAMU and Nebraska. So we are 7-1 this year when all 3 score 10 or more. So 88%
 

MidtownJacket

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This is an interesting look, but I think it misses a key with Alvarado. He often leaves 8-15 points on the floor in a typical game where he could take more for himself but instead is finding an open man or trying to get someone going. Looking at points for him as an indicator of him being “on” misses the value of his steals, assists and even more the benefit we gain from him getting guys going.
 

lv20gt

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This is an interesting look, but I think it misses a key with Alvarado. He often leaves 8-15 points on the floor in a typical game where he could take more for himself but instead is finding an open man or trying to get someone going. Looking at points for him as an indicator of him being “on” misses the value of his steals, assists and even more the benefit we gain from him getting guys going.

I agree that is typically what happens and overall he's clearly our best player even though you could argue Moses has almost as good stats. However, if you look at the @FSU, @UL, or @ Clemson games I don't think he was making that impact like he usually does. I guess to oversimplify my point is that Mike is mostly seen as a shooter. He gets credit when he hits the shots and blame when he doesn't. I think on the other hand Jose gets credit when he is doing the things you mention (in addition to the counting stats), but doesn't seem to take the same blame when he isn't doing those things as Mike does when he isn't hitting his shots.
 

gt24

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Messages
260
Not entirely sure I agree. Our lack of turnovers on offense is really important to efficiency, not simply the likelihood that we put the ball through the hoop. All these things working together is necessary because winning a rebounding battle will never happen.
100% agree. i'm not looking at stats, but i am confident we had many more live-ball turnovers in December. devoe and usher in particular. jose and moses to some extent too. the whole team has cut down on turnovers. to your point, turnovers and allowing offensive rebounds are essentially the same thing - they both lead to extra possessions/shots for the opponent and frequently those are high percentage shots. we will rarely win the reb battle, but winning the turnover battle offsets that - we have forced plenty of TOs all year, but our own offensive TOs have decreased significantly as the season has progressed.
 

gt24

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Messages
260
but I do think for whatever reason people tend to react way more to Devoe having an off game than they should.

When all three of them are on though we are a very dangerous team because teams can often do a decent job of limiting one big and one guard. Having a third option going off is huge.
this. i mentioned this a week or two ago. fans are too sensitive to devoe's scoring. obviously when all 3 are scoring we are very very hard to beat. but we are still very solid when 1 of the 3 has a poor shooting night. we can afford for 1 of the big 3 to have an off night and still be solid so long as anyone else has a decent game (usher, khalid, bubba, kyle).

my theory is fans are overly sensitive to devoe's low scoring nights for 2 reasons:
1. he is not as fiery as jose and moses. he is stoic. fans read too much into his facial expressions and body language. if he were normally fiery but then went stoic on bad shooting nights, then sure. but as far as i have seen, mike is always pretty damn stoic, whether he is scoring or not.
2. his top-60 high school ranking and solid scoring performances/averages frosh and soph years. some fans think that ranking means he must be a future NBA player who always scores in double figures.
 

gt24

Jolly Good Fellow
Messages
260
Devoe is the jet fuel. When he's on, this team is on a different level. It opens so much up for everyone else. Jose and Moses usually are "on" most every game.

What a fantastic adjustment by our staff in the 2nd half to give Devoe primary ball handling duties, and a great job by Devoe to step up his game. Little things like that may just spark Devoe towards more consistency.

We talked about it some during chat, but that's basically a glimpse of what we could see post-Alvarado. I don't believe Mike had any turnovers once he become the primary PG.

This staff continues to make some really good adjustments. Helps having a upperclassmen heavy team that understands what the coaches want, but the staff has certainly been masterful for the most part this season.
agree mostly and partially disagree. the second half offensive adjustment looked to me to be two-fold. first, VT was locked-in and well-prepared for our princeton point series. we were grinding for half court shots first half. by my count we ran princeton every possession first half except a small handful (3,4, or 5 maybe) of DDM possessions in Q2. i thought pastner switched offenses the second half because of how well VT was defending princeton. i also thought he wanted to get mike going with more "direct" touches second half and that was a secondary part of the plan/adjustment. we went roll/replace for almost the entire Q3 and many times in Q4. i have not seen us do that all season. most i have seen us run that set is maybe 3, 4, or 5 times in a row. and every time we have run it this year mike played the replace spot. against VT pastner moved him to the corner and then point with usher at the replace spot each time, where i have never seen him before. my guess is that was a two-fold decision: get mike more directly involved with more touches, and because of specific matchups with VT defenders. i'd be surprised if pastner planned to go most of the second half with that set. when it was working well, he stuck with it. and it kept working. if it aint broke, dont fix it.

all that said, i dont think any of it was based on the idea of mike running PG in our base offenses consistently. kyle is our post-alvarado future floor general PG, in my opinion. mike is not a PG, nor is he a CG. he is a SG. i thought early in the season one of our main offensive issues was that mike was playing/sharing too much PG and trying to initiate and create too much offense rather than playing off the ball as a true spot-up SG. he had a ton of turnovers when trying to share that PG role with jose and bubba, plus it reduced his # of quality looks on off-ball spot-ups. almost all of those turnover issues i observed from mike early season were when we were running princeton and DDM continuity offenses - so maybe mike is particularly effective running PG in set plays like the roll/replace vs VT?

a related thought: several posters have commented throughout the season that they wished we would run some sets/quick-hitters specifically to get mike going. i love our continuity stuff, but i agree that we should have a few quick hitters specifically designed for mike. the normal roll/replace with jose at PG, moses rolling, mike lifting/replacing seemed like exactly that and has been effective in small doses all year. but it always seems like jose or moses got the most shots on it, mike did not seem to get many TOK kickouts on it. the wrinkle/adjustment vs VT with mike at PG running that set might be a more direct way to help him? would love to see 1 or 2 other quick hitters designed for mike to get shots ATO. also would love to see a "spain" variation on our existing roll/replace set.
 

awbuzz

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Sorry, technical difficulties, i.e. me not knowing how to post, apparently....

There has been a lot of talk about not having conference tournaments this year. The talk gets louder as the post-season gets closer. That leaves the opportunity to potentially re-schedule conference games. Teams that are definitely in the NCAA would probably prefer no conference tournaments to prevent COVID issues. Teams that have work to do would like to see conference tournaments to improve their resume. We'll see what happens.
ACC Tourney = $$$$$

Lots and lots of TV $$$$$

It'll be played unless CoVid21 pops up even if a teams has to forfeit so a team that is healthy can advance.
 

MidtownJacket

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agree mostly and partially disagree. the second half offensive adjustment looked to me to be two-fold. first, VT was locked-in and well-prepared for our princeton point series. we were grinding for half court shots first half. by my count we ran princeton every possession first half except a small handful (3,4, or 5 maybe) of DDM possessions in Q2. i thought pastner switched offenses the second half because of how well VT was defending princeton. i also thought he wanted to get mike going with more "direct" touches second half and that was a secondary part of the plan/adjustment. we went roll/replace for almost the entire Q3 and many times in Q4. i have not seen us do that all season. most i have seen us run that set is maybe 3, 4, or 5 times in a row. and every time we have run it this year mike played the replace spot. against VT pastner moved him to the corner and then point with usher at the replace spot each time, where i have never seen him before. my guess is that was a two-fold decision: get mike more directly involved with more touches, and because of specific matchups with VT defenders. i'd be surprised if pastner planned to go most of the second half with that set. when it was working well, he stuck with it. and it kept working. if it aint broke, dont fix it.

all that said, i dont think any of it was based on the idea of mike running PG in our base offenses consistently. kyle is our post-alvarado future floor general PG, in my opinion. mike is not a PG, nor is he a CG. he is a SG. i thought early in the season one of our main offensive issues was that mike was playing/sharing too much PG and trying to initiate and create too much offense rather than playing off the ball as a true spot-up SG. he had a ton of turnovers when trying to share that PG role with jose and bubba, plus it reduced his # of quality looks on off-ball spot-ups. almost all of those turnover issues i observed from mike early season were when we were running princeton and DDM continuity offenses - so maybe mike is particularly effective running PG in set plays like the roll/replace vs VT?

a related thought: several posters have commented throughout the season that they wished we would run some sets/quick-hitters specifically to get mike going. i love our continuity stuff, but i agree that we should have a few quick hitters specifically designed for mike. the normal roll/replace with jose at PG, moses rolling, mike lifting/replacing seemed like exactly that and has been effective in small doses all year. but it always seems like jose or moses got the most shots on it, mike did not seem to get many TOK kickouts on it. the wrinkle/adjustment vs VT with mike at PG running that set might be a more direct way to help him? would love to see 1 or 2 other quick hitters designed for mike to get shots ATO. also would love to see a "spain" variation on our existing roll/replace set.
I followed all of this, and generally agree; but the Spain variation part has me confused. Not sure what that is?
 

Steverc

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North Carolina laid an egg against Marquette last night. Getting blown out by a bad OOC team at home doesn't help us.
 

Connell62

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agree mostly and partially disagree. the second half offensive adjustment looked to me to be two-fold. first, VT was locked-in and well-prepared for our princeton point series. we were grinding for half court shots first half. by my count we ran princeton every possession first half except a small handful (3,4, or 5 maybe) of DDM possessions in Q2. i thought pastner switched offenses the second half because of how well VT was defending princeton. i also thought he wanted to get mike going with more "direct" touches second half and that was a secondary part of the plan/adjustment. we went roll/replace for almost the entire Q3 and many times in Q4. i have not seen us do that all season. most i have seen us run that set is maybe 3, 4, or 5 times in a row. and every time we have run it this year mike played the replace spot. against VT pastner moved him to the corner and then point with usher at the replace spot each time, where i have never seen him before. my guess is that was a two-fold decision: get mike more directly involved with more touches, and because of specific matchups with VT defenders. i'd be surprised if pastner planned to go most of the second half with that set. when it was working well, he stuck with it. and it kept working. if it aint broke, dont fix it.

all that said, i dont think any of it was based on the idea of mike running PG in our base offenses consistently. kyle is our post-alvarado future floor general PG, in my opinion. mike is not a PG, nor is he a CG. he is a SG. i thought early in the season one of our main offensive issues was that mike was playing/sharing too much PG and trying to initiate and create too much offense rather than playing off the ball as a true spot-up SG. he had a ton of turnovers when trying to share that PG role with jose and bubba, plus it reduced his # of quality looks on off-ball spot-ups. almost all of those turnover issues i observed from mike early season were when we were running princeton and DDM continuity offenses - so maybe mike is particularly effective running PG in set plays like the roll/replace vs VT?

a related thought: several posters have commented throughout the season that they wished we would run some sets/quick-hitters specifically to get mike going. i love our continuity stuff, but i agree that we should have a few quick hitters specifically designed for mike. the normal roll/replace with jose at PG, moses rolling, mike lifting/replacing seemed like exactly that and has been effective in small doses all year. but it always seems like jose or moses got the most shots on it, mike did not seem to get many TOK kickouts on it. the wrinkle/adjustment vs VT with mike at PG running that set might be a more direct way to help him? would love to see 1 or 2 other quick hitters designed for mike to get shots ATO. also would love to see a "spain" variation on our existing roll/replace set.
That is some high-quality analysis 24! Good stuff!
 

orientalnc

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agree mostly and partially disagree. the second half offensive adjustment looked to me to be two-fold. first, VT was locked-in and well-prepared for our princeton point series. we were grinding for half court shots first half. by my count we ran princeton every possession first half except a small handful (3,4, or 5 maybe) of DDM possessions in Q2. i thought pastner switched offenses the second half because of how well VT was defending princeton. i also thought he wanted to get mike going with more "direct" touches second half and that was a secondary part of the plan/adjustment. we went roll/replace for almost the entire Q3 and many times in Q4. i have not seen us do that all season. most i have seen us run that set is maybe 3, 4, or 5 times in a row. and every time we have run it this year mike played the replace spot. against VT pastner moved him to the corner and then point with usher at the replace spot each time, where i have never seen him before. my guess is that was a two-fold decision: get mike more directly involved with more touches, and because of specific matchups with VT defenders. i'd be surprised if pastner planned to go most of the second half with that set. when it was working well, he stuck with it. and it kept working. if it aint broke, dont fix it.

all that said, i dont think any of it was based on the idea of mike running PG in our base offenses consistently. kyle is our post-alvarado future floor general PG, in my opinion. mike is not a PG, nor is he a CG. he is a SG. i thought early in the season one of our main offensive issues was that mike was playing/sharing too much PG and trying to initiate and create too much offense rather than playing off the ball as a true spot-up SG. he had a ton of turnovers when trying to share that PG role with jose and bubba, plus it reduced his # of quality looks on off-ball spot-ups. almost all of those turnover issues i observed from mike early season were when we were running princeton and DDM continuity offenses - so maybe mike is particularly effective running PG in set plays like the roll/replace vs VT?

a related thought: several posters have commented throughout the season that they wished we would run some sets/quick-hitters specifically to get mike going. i love our continuity stuff, but i agree that we should have a few quick hitters specifically designed for mike. the normal roll/replace with jose at PG, moses rolling, mike lifting/replacing seemed like exactly that and has been effective in small doses all year. but it always seems like jose or moses got the most shots on it, mike did not seem to get many TOK kickouts on it. the wrinkle/adjustment vs VT with mike at PG running that set might be a more direct way to help him? would love to see 1 or 2 other quick hitters designed for mike to get shots ATO. also would love to see a "spain" variation on our existing roll/replace set.
I really like this. Good work.

My only quibble, and it's minor, is that I thought the 2nd half changes were designed to get the individual matchups that favored our guys, but especially Devoe. Another thing you mentioned that I like is that Devoe plays extremely well without the ball. When we have plays setup up for him he always seems to be in the right spot. Even when the shot doesn't fall he has done his part.

But, my favorite line is the chess analogy. Great post!
 
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Techster

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agree mostly and partially disagree. the second half offensive adjustment looked to me to be two-fold. first, VT was locked-in and well-prepared for our princeton point series. we were grinding for half court shots first half. by my count we ran princeton every possession first half except a small handful (3,4, or 5 maybe) of DDM possessions in Q2. i thought pastner switched offenses the second half because of how well VT was defending princeton. i also thought he wanted to get mike going with more "direct" touches second half and that was a secondary part of the plan/adjustment. we went roll/replace for almost the entire Q3 and many times in Q4. i have not seen us do that all season. most i have seen us run that set is maybe 3, 4, or 5 times in a row. and every time we have run it this year mike played the replace spot. against VT pastner moved him to the corner and then point with usher at the replace spot each time, where i have never seen him before. my guess is that was a two-fold decision: get mike more directly involved with more touches, and because of specific matchups with VT defenders. i'd be surprised if pastner planned to go most of the second half with that set. when it was working well, he stuck with it. and it kept working. if it aint broke, dont fix it.

all that said, i dont think any of it was based on the idea of mike running PG in our base offenses consistently. kyle is our post-alvarado future floor general PG, in my opinion. mike is not a PG, nor is he a CG. he is a SG. i thought early in the season one of our main offensive issues was that mike was playing/sharing too much PG and trying to initiate and create too much offense rather than playing off the ball as a true spot-up SG. he had a ton of turnovers when trying to share that PG role with jose and bubba, plus it reduced his # of quality looks on off-ball spot-ups. almost all of those turnover issues i observed from mike early season were when we were running princeton and DDM continuity offenses - so maybe mike is particularly effective running PG in set plays like the roll/replace vs VT?

a related thought: several posters have commented throughout the season that they wished we would run some sets/quick-hitters specifically to get mike going. i love our continuity stuff, but i agree that we should have a few quick hitters specifically designed for mike. the normal roll/replace with jose at PG, moses rolling, mike lifting/replacing seemed like exactly that and has been effective in small doses all year. but it always seems like jose or moses got the most shots on it, mike did not seem to get many TOK kickouts on it. the wrinkle/adjustment vs VT with mike at PG running that set might be a more direct way to help him? would love to see 1 or 2 other quick hitters designed for mike to get shots ATO. also would love to see a "spain" variation on our existing roll/replace set.

Good stuff. I'll admit, the nuances of basketball X's and O's is above my paygrade as I grew up playing football. I'm always receptive of a good deep dive into basketball schemes and strategy.

My comment in regards to Devoe running PG wasn't that it was a certainty for next year, but more a comment that it could be something GT fans might see. I think we all assume that Sturdivant is the natural choice to run PG next season, but I wouldn't bet the house on it...strictly my opinion there. I think you alluded to the fact that matchups will play a big role in where the chess pieces will be moved around, and I think you're right. I disagree that Devoe isn't, or can't be, a PG, because he's always shared the court with Alvarado. I think Devoe can play there, but I also think it takes away from what Pastner wants Devoe to do...use his energy to be a scorer.

A lot of this is splitting hairs because we play multiple guys at the same time who have the ability to run and reset our offense when it's called for.
 
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