Game Thread - @ FSU, 12/31/2019

New Old Guy

Jolly Good Fellow
Messages
319
Well the good is

Devoe found his stroke from outside in a big way. That will be big going forward.

Despite some struggles Moses had a solid game with 13-10

I thought Banks looked more involved. He didn't play great, but he looked more into the game than he was there for a while. That's encouraging to see because this was a bad match up for him personally.

In general I thought we pretty much played right with them. Shooting, assists, rebounds were all about even. They made the plays at the end to extend the lead at the end.

The bad

Jose did not play well. SOme head scratching turnovers, and hasn't found his shot. He still does so much for us that he has a big positive impact, but we needed him to step up today and he wasn't able. The stretch where he took a quick mildly open 3 and missed it followed by them hitting a 3 on the other end pretty much sealed it. Could have been a 6 point game, and instead it was a 12. In general I thought he was trying to do what the team needed to but just couldn't connect. I will say that he had 0 FTAs was terrible.

Turnovers. Now some of that was related to my next point, but some of them were just unforced. The difference in this game was primarily them having 8 more shots which was due to our turnovers and their "blocks".

Officiating. On the surface the officiating was even. Both teams shot 8 FTs and 12-11 fouls, but the way the game was called, or not called, greatly benefited FSU. Their guards were not quick enough to stay in front and were bumping and grabbing all day and the refs were letting it go. Likewise down low, while they had shot blockers making clean blocks up top some of the time, FSU also used a ton of body contact and reaching in to prevent strong takes a lot of the time. FSU is an athletic team, and hard to beat, but when refs are letting them just bang, grab, and reach in it is really really hard. FSU got their first team foul of the second half with 8 minutes left. That is ridiculous considering the way they play and the fact that we weren't settling for jumpers. FSU outplayed us the last 10 or so minutes, and that's when they put the game out of reach. But imo we outplayed them the first 30 minuets and the score was pretty much even because FSU was allowed to hack at will.

I agree with this 100%. We are not a good offensive team, and we do not protect the ball. FSU is a strong, long, athletic team. But to believe they made all those blocks, some at point blank range, with no body contact is like believing in fairy tales. JB and Usher, among others, were constantly complaining about being fouled.
 

Buzzbomb

Mello Yellow-Jacket
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12,014
If CJP said we tried to recruit most of their team, he should get a pass. Because we know F$U joined the league like Miami to increase their success in Hoops. They have passed us, that’s for certain. Doesn’t hurt to have C.Y.(Young)on the bench and pounding the pavement.
 

GTFLETCH

Banned
Messages
2,639
How long must we put up with this clown as the coach! All he did was take CBG team to the NIT in year 1.... For the life of me why has the AD not fired him yet like he did to the old womens CMJ... I mean the with all the Ron Bell stuff he should be able to....

This is another crappy year
 

MiracleWhips

Ramblin' Wreck
Messages
583
This whole board is weird. It’s quiet in here after wins but loud after losses. Sort of assbackwards.

We didn’t take down the 18th ranked team in the country. Oh well. Let’s get to 500 on Saturday!
 

lv20gt

Helluva Engineer
Messages
5,581
This whole board is weird. It’s quiet in here after wins but loud after losses. Sort of assbackwards.

The board isn't weird. Most fanbases have a large contingent that moan and complain and add nothing of actual substance to the conversation when things aren't going good.
 

YlJacket

Helluva Engineer
Messages
3,260
This board and really all GT BB boards have become more and more quiet really regardless of wins or losses. In reality I would love a good 10 page ***** fest after a loss - or same length over the top with a win. We barely made the second page after this one.
 

Jacketman

Jolly Good Fellow
Messages
232
This board and really all GT BB boards have become more and more quiet really regardless of wins or losses. In reality I would love a good 10 page ***** fest after a loss - or same length over the top with a win. We barely made the second page after this one.
We haven't had many wins to get excited about in any sport recently, so I think you can understand why the game threads are not 10 pages long after the nth loss of the season.
 

OG-T

Jolly Good Fellow
Messages
328
FSU better team — we can hang, but they simply are better, beatable, but better. Our TOs and lack of full team of contributors was never going to win this game.
Refs — That opening minute chicken-sh*t foot shuffle travel call on Devoe was fine, but keep it consistent. I counted 6 non calls on FSU for same thing. Two led to meaningful buckets, one a 3-pointer. That could have been 6 more TOs for FSU. Hidden factor.
Banks — Most life since the NC State game. Hopeful.
Moses — Overall he does many good things now; open court dribbling not one of them.
Lazy/Poor Passing — Can we hire whoever coaches FSU players to pass? Every pass is a two-handed, strong SNAP pass. Our guys continue to want to throw lazy, soft passes with one hand. This is one of the "longest" teams in country. I noticed Pastner pull Price after a lazy pass, and he never returned. Never acceptable at this level. Moore, who I like, but has regressed this year, is the BIGGEST culprit of lazy-*** passes.
Pastner — Trying to be supportive, but while some may not agree with a bigger playing rotation, IMO, it's a must. Senseless to think we'll make it through the ACC with Devoe, Jose and Wright playing 37 mins a game. That's really short-sighted on Pastner's part, and I think I giant flaw in his strategy.
Williams — That kid has an awesome skill set, and pro-ready frame.
 

lauraee

Helluva Engineer
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2,464
Jose played sick. This game doesn’t count.

MJ Walker and Koprivica, F$U didn’t need them.
Too bad Walker didn't come to Tech, we sure could use him & he wouldn't be sitting on the bench.

Nm I see he was injured. I was at work today so couldn't watch.
 
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Buzzbomb

Mello Yellow-Jacket
Messages
12,014
Too bad Walker didn't come to Tech, we sure could use him & he wouldn't be sitting on the bench.

Nm I see he was injured. I was at work today so couldn't watch.
You were better off working. The only thing you missed in the 1st half at one point, the teams combined for more turnovers than baskets. By some point in the 2nd half we had 19 TO’s.
 
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alagold

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Huntsville,Al
Another "good "loss,A decent performance not nearly good enough to win.If this was at home we might have chance. JA and Usher have GOT to shoot better to win--again..
 

gte447f

Helluva Engineer
Messages
1,086
I disagree. I think our only chance was to go with our best 6/7 and hope they were better. We don't get better by going to Phillips, Price or Cole against a team like FSU. Maybe Moore should have been in the game more, but I also think he doesn't match up well with FSU (not hitting the outside shot and has shown shaky ball handling recently). It's not a lack of awareness or a lack of creativity, but rather a efficiency in team building. Part of that is certainly on Pastner. He left one scholarship open this year and spent one on Didenko. If he brought in guys the caliber that he is bringing in next year with those two scholarships it would probably make a difference. Part of it is making short term decisions to address immediate issues. The recruitment of Cole was to address the immediate issue of lacking players at the 4. Same with Wright. One worked out, and one hasn't. When we added Phillips we desperately needed ball handling. Right now though we don't need his ball handling and his limited scoring is just too big to help. And the Sjolund thing is just weird. My thoughts on that aside, that is 5 scholarships that we basically aren't likely to be utilizing much in ACC play. If we need to go to guys 8 or 9 it likely means we're going to lose. If we go 8 or 9 deep because we have built a bit of a lead and can steal some minutes then that's when we need to do so. But we didn't have that today.

We'll have to agree to disagree. Playing your 5 best players for 40 minutes each is not a common strategy for several reasons. Physically it is tough to do. Guys need a rest. A superior player at 80% because he is tired is not a superior player anymore. The more marginal the difference in player ability is, the more true this statement becomes. On a team like ours, without top level talent, there isn't necessarily a lot of separation, talent wise and skill wise, between starters and bench players, so I don't think you will see that much drop off by mixing in bench players strategically. In fact, I think you will see improved productivity by the starters, if they play a few less minutes because they will be fresher and more focused during their time on the court.

I am not talking about playing 10 guys even minutes. I am talking about using 3 or 4 bench players to spell 40 minutes or so total so that you top guys are playing 30-35 minutes instead of using 1 or 2 bench players to spell 20 minutes or less while your top guys are playing 40 minutes non-stop. To me, it seems reasonable on a team like ours without any next level talent that absolutely has to be on the court because they provide such an advantage over the opposition.
 

gte447f

Helluva Engineer
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1,086
On another note, regardless of the play of either team on the court, this appeared to be a very winnable road game based on the environment in the arena. The FSU crowd looked pretty underwhelming. Pretty pitiful for the #18 team in the country. I doubt they provided much of a boost for their team or much of a concern for our team. Next time out at UNC will probably be much more inhospitable.
 

Peacone36

Helluva Engineer
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Maine
I’d inform you guys of Jose’s metrics if I thought it would earn me anything other than more hatred......

What’s the excuse today? They were ranked? Red uniforms historically shoot better at home on Tuesday’s?
 

awbuzz

Helluva Manager
Staff member
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Marietta, GA
Thought we look pretty good for three quarters of the game. It stayed a lot closer than I thought it might.

The last six minutes we were just out of gas and couldn't stop them.

IMO it was a better game than the final score indicated.
 

Buzzbomb

Mello Yellow-Jacket
Messages
12,014
Thought we look pretty good for three quarters of the game. It stayed a lot closer than I thought it might.

The last six minutes we were just out of gas and couldn't stop them.

IMO it was a better game than the final score indicated.
I’m sorry, but the game I watched was sloppy when it was competitive. Watching our guys get called for palming, walking, and outlet passes thrown into the scorers table. Instead of drawing contact when the defender left their feet & drawing a foul, we try to go over them. They came close to setting an all-time block record. 40% of the F$U starting 5, didn’t even play.

It looked like we were straight out of exams.
 

lv20gt

Helluva Engineer
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5,581
We'll have to agree to disagree. Playing your 5 best players for 40 minutes each is not a common strategy for several reasons. Physically it is tough to do. Guys need a rest. A superior player at 80% because he is tired is not a superior player anymore. The more marginal the difference in player ability is, the more true this statement becomes. On a team like ours, without top level talent, there isn't necessarily a lot of separation, talent wise and skill wise, between starters and bench players, so I don't think you will see that much drop off by mixing in bench players strategically. In fact, I think you will see improved productivity by the starters, if they play a few less minutes because they will be fresher and more focused during their time on the court.

Then make the case for our actual team instead of using sterile terms. My guess is you didn't because even you know there is a huge gap between Mike/Jose and Shembari/Asanti and between Wright and Cole. Only with Moore is there a decent case that he should have gotten a lot more minutes, but even then he's been struggling and in particular looked like a bad match up against FSU especially with the way they were calling the game.

The truth is the opposite of what you said is where our team is at. We are hurting because there is a big drop off when we go to the bench. Cole hasn't developed like we hoped nor has Shembari shown the ability to be a positive influence. Price has shown some promise but he isn't ready as a freshman. Didenko is Didenko, Sjolund is redshirtting/transferring, and we have an empty scholarship. That's our bench beyond Bubba/Moore. Now if you want to argue that we shouldn't be a in a situation where ironmanning our starters is the best course then go for it, and I doubt you'll be met with much resistance, but if you're trying to argue that we lost because Cole/Price/Phillips didn't get in the game then I think you have a lot of work to do to make that point.

I’d inform you guys of Jose’s metrics if I thought it would earn me anything other than more hatred......

He didn't play well. Are you going to try and argue that he still isn't a huge overall plus for us over what we had when he was out?
 
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