Dodd on the quick kick

Skeptic

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Whiskey_Clear said:
With good reason skeptic ;)
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I got it. Quick kick on 4th down. That should surprise 'em.

Until I watched that video of Dodd and the quick kick I had no idea what went into it, or that every effort was made to kick the back third of the ball to get a forward roll. That had to be a kick in the slates to any D back trying to catch up to it.

(And before anybody leaps to reply, the 4th down kick is a joke. Maybe.
 
presjacket

presjacket

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Skeptic said:
I got it. Quick kick on 4th down. That should surprise 'em.

Until I watched that video of Dodd and the quick kick I had no idea what went into it, or that every effort was made to kick the back third of the ball to get a forward roll. That had to be a kick in the slates to any D back trying to catch up to it.

(And before anybody leaps to reply, the 4th down kick is a joke. Maybe.
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hmmm, the draw them offsides play with a snap between the QBs legs to the B-back who quick kicks if the D doesn't jump after the A back movement

btw, I noticed that the OP video said that no penetration by the Dline was crucial to the success of the quick kick. Heck, if we could do that we would never get to 4th down.
 

alagold

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1939hotmagic said:
Sufficiently inspired, I looked through some of my old ('40s to '70s) football books; a lesser-known but successful coach at (then-) Arkansas State named "Frosty" England, from the mid-40s to 1953, was one of the early adopters of the T formation, going 48-22-9 in eight seasons, the last three highly successful, among the small-college leaders nationally in rushing and scoring. England wrote a couple of books on the "T" and quite a few articles as well. (England was hired by Toledo, but retired from football due to heart/health concerns after only a couple of years there.)

Sure enough, one of the "series" England used was the "direct snap to the fullback" series, in the T formation, from which he had 10+ plays. The snap went between the QB's legs to the fullback, as you saw in Tech quick-kick video clip above. But, the deception didn't end there; for some plays, England fused the direct snap to the FB with an old single-wing ploy, the buck lateral series; for example, the snap would go to the FB, who might then "buck" -- i.e., dive -- into the line, but immediately before hitting the line, the FB would then hand off the ball to the QB, who then might run, pass, or lateral to someone else. Deception layered upon deception.

[The buck-lateral series was made most famous, and was most effective, by the powerful Minnesota single-wing teams of Bernie Bierman in the 1930s. In the '40s, Michigan used the "buck lateral" series very effectively under another coaching giant, Fritz Crisler; in the 1948 Rose Bowl, Michigan embarrassed Southern Cal 49-0 with the Wolverines' offensive "magicians," and the following season Michigan was a national champion.]

As deceptive as Johnson's scheme can be -- and when it's humming along, it doesn't need any more bells and whistles -- it's fun to think of what could be done if these forgotten measures were added to the offensive mix.
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Wow, you are amazing. So that leaves only the "falling action"--having PJ implement the idea. lol Seeing he's had a putrid pass game and he had an ex-QB in his backfield at A/B back every yr since he started and tried a pass with them very rarely,I don't see much hope.
 

1939hotmagic

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alagold said:
Wow, you are amazing. So that leaves only the "falling action"--having PJ implement the idea. lol Seeing he's had a putrid pass game and he had an ex-QB in his backfield at A/B back every yr since he started and tried a pass with them very rarely,I don't see much hope.
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Just having a bit of fan forum fun with football history, that's all. As pleasantly surprised as I would be if some of these notions were explored -- eventually -- I'd be quite satisfied with a return to something sortakinda resembling the 2014 offense.
 
OldJacketFan

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alagold said:
Wow, you are amazing. So that leaves only the "falling action"--having PJ implement the idea. lol Seeing he's had a putrid pass game and he had an ex-QB in his backfield at A/B back every yr since he started and tried a pass with them very rarely,I don't see much hope.
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Do you EVER post anything, anywhere that is not negative? Why are you a Tech fan if every team, every coach aggravates you so? Do you just take a perverse pleasure in being universally negative? How in the world did you survive Tech going 11-3 and kicking *** in the Orange Bowl?
 

65Jacket

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Skeptic said:
I got it. Quick kick on 4th down. That should surprise 'em.

Until I watched that video of Dodd and the quick kick I had no idea what went into it, or that every effort was made to kick the back third of the ball to get a forward roll. That had to be a kick in the slates to any D back trying to catch up to it.

(And before anybody leaps to reply, the 4th down kick is a joke. Maybe.
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First Tech game I attended, I saw a quick kick. After that, I used to practice it in my back yard. The ball would roll a long way
Old Jacket Fan, alagold is like several negativests on these boards. I think they post their crappy opinions just to enrage the true fans like us.
 

alagold

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OldJacketFan said:
Do you EVER post anything, anywhere that is not negative? Why are you a Tech fan if every team, every coach aggravates you so? Do you just take a perverse pleasure in being universally negative? How in the world did you survive Tech going 11-3 and kicking *** in the Orange Bowl?
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Bless your heart,I'm really glad that you are happy with the worst season in 20 yrs and the breaking of our bowl string but I'm generally not. . btw--I was there cheering in the stands at the OB, were you?, the koolaide of a big yr reversing turned a bit too sour for me so taking for granted everything is ok may be a stretch --glad that you are contented though
 
iceeater1969

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Its the start of second quarter with score tied and offense has not shown much. The down and distance are 3rd and 15 on the 20. There is a strong wind at our back. The conditions are perfect for a quick kick!

Why not call it? Answer : if we quick kick to say the other 20 verses getting no gain on 3rd and then punt to the 40, it will take about 5 plays for the "bend but don't break while hoping for a turn over defense " to let them across midfield. The old days of a real defense are negated by legal holding (zone blocking).
Kim king was awsome - beat Tennessee 6-3
 
GT Man

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Skeptic said:
Hard enough to get Johnson to kick on 4th down.
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That's what I like about this... opponents now expect PJ to go for it on 4th. If his intent is to punt on 4th, disguising it as "going for it" would be an easy sell. Conversely, if the opponent starts thinking it could be a punt, wouldn't they have to place a defender deep just in case?
 

Skeptic

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GT Man said:
That's what I like about this... opponents now expect PJ to go for it on 4th. If his intent is to punt on 4th, disguising it as "going for it" would be an easy sell. Conversely, if the opponent starts thinking it could be a punt, wouldn't they have to place a defender deep just in case?
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Actually you may have a tactical case, whether Johnson would ever do it or not. Just not sure how it would work with the B back so close to the LOS but I guess he could figure something out. It would be one of those one-time off deals, though. (I think.) After all, who among us ever, in our wildest message board imaginations of trick plays and goofy alignments and weird lineups, would ever, ever, think Swinney would trust his punter to pass to a 315-pound DE end on 4th and 4? The scorched earhole, helmet paint melted punter who did a lonesome polecat on 4th and 15 in the ACC championship game and failed? The poor, abused kid who a Raleigh guest columnist declared as scarred for life by the humiliating public and TV dressing down by a coach he described as an out of control, "enraged grownup" as I think he described it. The same kid who has been an excellent punter ever since, and who after nailing the long pass was leaping up and down and shouting like a 4-year-old. I came off the couch when I saw it unfold, and then to see the Mountain tightroping the sideline for another 5-10 yards was amazing. In short, one time it might work. I am not into religion, but Swinney is, and if there was ever a more poignant example of redemption and reconciliation, that was it.
 

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