Defense depth chart

GTrob21

Helluva Engineer
Messages
1,087
I am really concerned with our front 4. We are horribly inexperienced and the losses of earlier this summer are really glaring. I am hoping Whiteside comes in and immediately plays lights out.

I think if things don't break perfectly for us, we are looking at a bunch of team doubling Adam and running it straight at us.
 

ATL1

Helluva Engineer
Messages
7,377
I like Chungong & Whitehead at the ends. (If Kallon still not ready I expect to see Commissiong)
Freeman & Merriweather on the B side.

If/When we go to 4-3 on more run oriented teams we can align up with Beau Hawkins & Tre Jackson in the middle.
 

AE 87

Helluva Engineer
Messages
12,967
Only surprise was Kallon vs Kitchen.....maybe a good surprise. We are solid 3 deep at LB but used up pretty much everybody else in the 2 deep. Pulling hard for Whitehead.

This. I would even add Gamble. I thought Gotsis, Green and Kitchen were a pretty good 3 man rotation going into Spring. I hope this means we rotate more guys thru rather than saying that the top 2 have to be iron men.

For others, I think Stargel will surprise people. I think his size, speed and run-stopping ability will end up translating to our SDE better than WDE at which he wasn't Jerry but passable last year. I think his speed will allow us to use him in some multiple sets. He came around and blitzed through the middle of the line during the Spring game.
 

dressedcheeseside

Helluva Engineer
Messages
13,672
This. I would even add Gamble. I thought Gotsis, Green and Kitchen were a pretty good 3 man rotation going into Spring. I hope this means we rotate more guys thru rather than saying that the top 2 have to be iron men.

For others, I think Stargel will surprise people. I think his size, speed and run-stopping ability will end up translating to our SDE better than WDE at which he wasn't Jerry but passable last year. I think his speed will allow us to use him in some multiple sets. He came around and blitzed through the middle of the line during the Spring game.
I remember TB blowing by him like a sign post. I hope that is more indicative of TB's abilities than Stargel's. I certainly hope you are right about him.
 

AE 87

Helluva Engineer
Messages
12,967
I remember TB blowing by him like a sign post. I hope that is more indicative of TB's abilities than Stargel's. I certainly hope you are right about him.

It probably has to do with scheme, but without referring to a particular play, we can't know for sure. However, in the abstract, if you say that Byerly blew past him, than you are referring to a situation in which Stargel would have been the playside DE and the QB was keeping the ball. One of our plays in which that could happen is the triple option where the playside DE is the dive key. In those plays, the DE is unblocked but the only reason TB would have kept the ball was if he read Stargel as pinching down to stop the dive. That would explain TB blowing past him. It also might happen tha the playside DE stays wide to help string out the play, and dive key is a crashing linebacker. That situation might result in TB "blowing past" Stargel on the inside. Again, not because TB's ability vs Stargel's but because of the scheme.
 

JazzyD95

Ramblin' Wreck
Messages
727
Location
The ATL
It probably has to do with scheme, but without referring to a particular play, we can't know for sure. However, in the abstract, if you say that Byerly blew past him, than you are referring to a situation in which Stargel would have been the playside DE and the QB was keeping the ball. One of our plays in which that could happen is the triple option where the playside DE is the dive key. In those plays, the DE is unblocked but the only reason TB would have kept the ball was if he read Stargel as pinching down to stop the dive. That would explain TB blowing past him. It also might happen tha the playside DE stays wide to help string out the play, and dive key is a crashing linebacker. That situation might result in TB "blowing past" Stargel on the inside. Again, not because TB's ability vs Stargel's but because of the scheme.
Hope I'm wrong but I'm not too high on Stargell. Could be a decent run stopped though if he comes along. Hope ik wrong
 

augustabuzz

Helluva Engineer
Messages
2,187
There are only 2 players that concern me. They are Stargel and Demond Smith. Stargel gets pushed around and just isn't the answer. Demond had some good plays last year but I remember at least 5 plays where he got burned and was chasing the defender from behind. I say we put kitchens, kallon, or gamble there and add some athleticism to the position and put Noble instead of Smith.
Really? You know, after watching a redshirt freshman on a few plays, that he isn't the answer?
 

dressedcheeseside

Helluva Engineer
Messages
13,672
It probably has to do with scheme, but without referring to a particular play, we can't know for sure. However, in the abstract, if you say that Byerly blew past him, than you are referring to a situation in which Stargel would have been the playside DE and the QB was keeping the ball. One of our plays in which that could happen is the triple option where the playside DE is the dive key. In those plays, the DE is unblocked but the only reason TB would have kept the ball was if he read Stargel as pinching down to stop the dive. That would explain TB blowing past him. It also might happen tha the playside DE stays wide to help string out the play, and dive key is a crashing linebacker. That situation might result in TB "blowing past" Stargel on the inside. Again, not because TB's ability vs Stargel's but because of the scheme.
It was this. I don't Stargel's assignment was containment on the particular play in mind. It appeared his intent was tackling the qb.
 

33jacket

Helluva Engineer
Messages
4,526
Location
Georgia
I really don't think you can analyze much of our D when it plays against our O. Individuals on certain individual plays maybe, but its tough to do. So I really do give our players more of a pass than vs a normal setup. I look at angles, athleticism, use of hands, leverage, size, in dbs looseness of the hips and fluidity in turns etc.

My issue with Stargel, is if he is really only 240, setting that edge and fighting a TE and OT in power sets as the SDE will be nearly impossible over of the course of a game and the run game will be tough for us in our current scheme. It tyler is now 265, I feel better...those 25 lbs matter a ton in leverage through the course of a game and year. Especially when that 25 lbs is muscle mass...not fat...We don't need a superior athlete or speed at SDE in our scheme. We need a tough player that can command an edge double team or if not use his hands play off the tackle and force the run outside for the OLB to clean up. I am concerned here because Tyler appeared to get too swallowed at times...

A great recent example of this was vs UGA years ago. When Adamm Oliver went down with a torn ACL, MJ was put in and the line just crashed. They blew up that side in the running game (from what i recall). Its one reason MJ couldn't get on the field early in his career as much. Having the right SDE in a 4-3 is really important....MJ played WDE and SDE as a sub....but in this case was the SDE backup....
 

dressedcheeseside

Helluva Engineer
Messages
13,672
I really don't think you can analyze much of our D when it plays against our O. Individuals on certain individual plays maybe, but its tough to do. So I really do give our players more of a pass than vs a normal setup. I look at angles, athleticism, use of hands, leverage, size, in dbs looseness of the hips and fluidity in turns etc.

My issue with Stargel, is if he is really only 240, setting that edge and fighting a TE and OT in power sets as the SDE will be nearly impossible over of the course of a game and the run game will be tough for us in our current scheme. It tyler is now 265, I feel better...those 25 lbs matter a ton in leverage through the course of a game and year. Especially when that 25 lbs is muscle mass...not fat...We don't need a superior athlete or speed at SDE in our scheme. We need a tough player that can command an edge double team or if not use his hands play off the tackle and force the run outside for the OLB to clean up. I am concerned here because Tyler appeared to get too swallowed at times...

A great recent example of this was vs UGA years ago. When Adamm Oliver went down with a torn ACL, MJ was put in and the line just crashed. They blew up that side in the running game (from what i recall). Its one reason MJ couldn't get on the field early in his career as much. Having the right SDE in a 4-3 is really important....MJ played WDE and SDE as a sub....but in this case was the SDE backup....
Why don't we just bump one our our backup DT's out to SDE? Maybe Commissiong would be great out there?
 

33jacket

Helluva Engineer
Messages
4,526
Location
Georgia
Why don't we just bump one our our backup DT's out to SDE? Maybe Commissiong would be great out there?

not sure. I mentioned in another post a good idea may be to put Gotsis at SDE and backfill him with gamble or Commissiong (who is more a DT than Gotsis)....Clearly, the staff must feel that this is their best 4 with stargel on the edge.

I don't know. Tyler may just be fine! but I do believe 100% that if he isn't bigger than 240 he will struggle through games and the year as it wears on....

Personally, I don't like practice's vs our O to judge this stuff.

It feels more right to me, considering our issues on DE, to go Gotsis, Gamble, Green, Whitehead/freeman etc
 

dressedcheeseside

Helluva Engineer
Messages
13,672
not sure. I mentioned in another post a good idea may be to put Gotsis at SDE and backfill him with gamble or Commissiong (who is more a DT than Gotsis)....Clearly, the staff must feel that this is their best 4 with stargel on the edge.

I don't know. Tyler may just be fine! but I do believe 100% that if he isn't bigger than 240 he will struggle through games and the year as it wears on....

Personally, I don't like practice's vs our O to judge this stuff.

It feels more right to me, considering our issues on DE, to go Gotsis, Gamble, Green, Whitehead/freeman etc
Pelton is the man making the call. Do you feel comfortable with his judgement?
 

33jacket

Helluva Engineer
Messages
4,526
Location
Georgia
Pelton is the man making the call. Do you feel comfortable with his judgement?

Not yet nope too new in our staff for me to get a feel. Many types of coaching styles. Some just go off practice. Some go too much off potential. Some are able to balance negatives of practice, with the upside and ups of potential during gametime as a player gets more PT becomes better...so they take a tad risk vs the practice assignment warrior. I don't know which Pelton is. I hope the latter, I personally love coaches who use practice and film time to evaluate a player, but then also adds high ceiling value to the player so if they are slightly (not grossly) but slightly behind the practice warrior and have much better upside...thats who they play.

Also, typically the DL coach doesn't set the depth chart. The Coord does. The input is there from the DL coach for sure...but if Roof says no we are not moving so and so outside or etc etc...then it doesn't happen. So this isn't on Pelton solely. Its also Roof. So I trust roof more because he knows his scheme and what he needs for the scheme to be successful, not just the DL but how the LB's behind it are assigned and what they need. But again, is roof a practice guy or rolls with upside too??? I don't know that either. But clearly he knows what he needs and what weaknesses he can overcome.

Bottom line on face value we have to trust the depth chart as is. But what we don't know, is has the staff even considered moving Gotsis to SDE and if not why? Thats the question. The question isn't, is this the best 4 as is within the positions, its is this the best 4 considering all swaps etc?? Not sure...Maybe they considered it and like this 4 as-is...cool...I stand skeptical.

If Stargel starts caving do we see a switch and how quick? Will be fun to watch that this year. If the switch is quick, then you know they knew its an issue....if we see a problem and don't switch quick.....then they had no plan, no personnel, or were practice blind to it....

just something to watch....
 
Top