CTR

Bruce Wayne

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1,870
Couple things. Not quite what the internet is telling me on salaries. Looks like we paid Wommack $288,500 in base. Then we paid Groh $150k base, with a pretty sizeable bonus. I think Groh ended up getting somewhere between 3-400k from us. Groh would have cost more, but his salary was essentially irrelevant (UVA owed him something like $4 mil minus whatever we paid him).

Roof came in at 550k, and was up to low 600ks, so we just gave him a bit of a bump. BUT, let's take into account the most important thing - we don't have to pay an offensive coordinator. Combined CPJ and CTR are at 3.75 mil per year. No offense coordinator saves us a ton. Look at Clemson for example, last year they paid their coordinators combined over 2 mil. Virginia paid theirs something like 1.25 mil.

That may actually be the biggest thing of Paul Johnson - we save several hundreds of thousands of dollars a year because he doesn't need two coordinators (difference of say a 5-600k coordinator to a 200k coach). We can throw a lot of that at a guy like CTR who is better than what we could otherwise afford.
a 25% salary increase is only a "bit of a bump"? Plus guaranteed for 3 years is solid. I know you are thinking of "absolute" numbers and so don't see 600 to 750 as that big of an increase but how often does anyone get a 25% increase in pay from one year to the next without changing jobs?

(Correct me if I am wrong, I am a humanities guy not a math guy).
 

Ibeeballin

Im a 3*
Messages
6,081
I could careless about yds/Gm. With majority of teams running spread O yds will be giving up. What I look at is: TO margin, red zone TD %, 3rd down D, and sacks/pressures. If we continue to play aggressive and force low % throws, turnovers will happen. That is why they call forced TO. It is not a luck thing.
 

CuseJacket

Administrator
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19,554
Couple things. Not quite what the internet is telling me on salaries. Looks like we paid Wommack $288,500 in base. Then we paid Groh $150k base, with a pretty sizeable bonus. I think Groh ended up getting somewhere between 3-400k from us. Groh would have cost more, but his salary was essentially irrelevant (UVA owed him something like $4 mil minus whatever we paid him).

Roof came in at 550k, and was up to low 600ks, so we just gave him a bit of a bump. BUT, let's take into account the most important thing - we don't have to pay an offensive coordinator. Combined CPJ and CTR are at 3.75 mil per year. No offense coordinator saves us a ton. Look at Clemson for example, last year they paid their coordinators combined over 2 mil. Virginia paid theirs something like 1.25 mil.

That may actually be the biggest thing of Paul Johnson - we save several hundreds of thousands of dollars a year because he doesn't need two coordinators (difference of say a 5-600k coordinator to a 200k coach). We can throw a lot of that at a guy like CTR who is better than what we could otherwise afford.

Keep in mind we pay for 2 OL coaches in lieu of having an OC. Have to throw Coach Ray's or Sewak's salary for a fair comparison.

When you put it all together (HC+OL+DC vs. HC+OC+DC), I think we're spending money in line with teams with similar expectations + on-the field performance.

Some resources:
  • This USA Today table for 2014 suggests we're in line with our peers when factoring in HC bonuses + total staff comp
  • Syracuse.com did a follow-up article on assistant coaches' pay comparing total assistant comp for the ACC's public schools forced to report the info. Only UVA and NC State surprise me among those who pay more for assistants, but that's offset by HC i.e., CPJ's pay.
 

awbuzz

Helluva Manager
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Good for CTR and hopee that we see continued improvement. Legal is dead on that we need some Dline pressure and can generate more sacks, but the most important thing is to vastly improve our 3rd Down defense to force more punts.
 

Skeptic

Helluva Engineer
Messages
6,372
Couple things. Not quite what the internet is telling me on salaries. Looks like we paid Wommack $288,500 in base. Then we paid Groh $150k base, with a pretty sizeable bonus. I think Groh ended up getting somewhere between 3-400k from us. Groh would have cost more, but his salary was essentially irrelevant (UVA owed him something like $4 mil minus whatever we paid him).

Roof came in at 550k, and was up to low 600ks, so we just gave him a bit of a bump. BUT, let's take into account the most important thing - we don't have to pay an offensive coordinator. Combined CPJ and CTR are at 3.75 mil per year. No offense coordinator saves us a ton. Look at Clemson for example, last year they paid their coordinators combined over 2 mil. Virginia paid theirs something like 1.25 mil.

That may actually be the biggest thing of Paul Johnson - we save several hundreds of thousands of dollars a year because he doesn't need two coordinators (difference of say a 5-600k coordinator to a 200k coach). We can throw a lot of that at a guy like CTR who is better than what we could otherwise afford.
Ah, good points. And maybe allowed him to rectify what we know he learned, the hiring of a special teams guy. Had no idea Roof started at 550. More impressed than I was prepared to be.
 

Legal Jacket

Ramblin' Wreck
Messages
561
a 25% salary increase is only a "bit of a bump"? Plus guaranteed for 3 years is solid. I know you are thinking of "absolute" numbers and so don't see 600 to 750 as that big of an increase but how often does anyone get a 25% increase in pay from one year to the next without changing jobs?

(Correct me if I am wrong, I am a humanities guy not a math guy).

I was responding to the post that anchored our D coordinator salary at 350 and noted that 700k was remarkable based on that. My point was that it was only 600 and chance (something like 620, 630 maybe) to 750 isn't as big of a jump as 350 to 750k.
 

Legal Jacket

Ramblin' Wreck
Messages
561
I could careless about yds/Gm. With majority of teams running spread O yds will be giving up. What I look at is: TO margin, red zone TD %, 3rd down D, and sacks/pressures. If we continue to play aggressive and force low % throws, turnovers will happen. That is why they call forced TO. It is not a luck thing.

TO margin is like ERA. It's way too unpredictable.

If you want to go third down (114th) and sacks/tackles for loss (105th, 115th) then we were downright horrid. Red zone, along with turnovers, is what kept us from being 6-6 or worse. We are going to have to improve a lot or stay lucky to repeat what we did last year (not that it was all luck, but a lot of it was - see GSU, VT, uga).
 

Legal Jacket

Ramblin' Wreck
Messages
561
Keep in mind we pay for 2 OL coaches in lieu of having an OC. Have to throw Coach Ray's or Sewak's salary for a fair comparison.

When you put it all together (HC+OL+DC vs. HC+OC+DC), I think we're spending money in line with teams with similar expectations + on-the field performance.

Some resources:
  • This USA Today table for 2014 suggests we're in line with our peers when factoring in HC bonuses + total staff comp
  • Syracuse.com did a follow-up article on assistant coaches' pay comparing total assistant comp for the ACC's public schools forced to report the info. Only UVA and NC State surprise me among those who pay more for assistants, but that's offset by HC i.e., CPJ's pay.

That's why I said he only saves us several hundreds of thousands of dollars as opposed to over half a mill (and provided the math of the difference between a 5-600k coordinator to a 200k coach).

We don't get to hire extra coaches. Each team has a set number of coaches. In the example you give above, an offensive coordinator is going to make a lot more than an offensive line coach, so we are going to save that money. We may spend it back on CPJ and CTR, which was my original point. We have the 4th highest paid DC, but we aren't in the top four in terms of staff pay. That's because we aren't spending 500k on an offensive coordinator (with the results we've had, we probably would have to pay CPJ a lot as an offensive coordinator anyways).
 

alaguy

Helluva Engineer
Messages
1,117
Getting good Asst coaches pays BIG dividends if they can recruit.the "bagman" Garner at awbern is still pulling them in and prob not doing much coaching.

That DEF did about as well as possible with the talent available--a 225 lb TRUE Fr def end? and he might have played the best --pleez
it would not surprise me to see 5 guys from this recr class start in '16 on def
 

CuseJacket

Administrator
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19,554
That's why I said he only saves us several hundreds of thousands of dollars as opposed to over half a mill (and provided the math of the difference between a 5-600k coordinator to a 200k coach).

We don't get to hire extra coaches. Each team has a set number of coaches. In the example you give above, an offensive coordinator is going to make a lot more than an offensive line coach, so we are going to save that money. We may spend it back on CPJ and CTR, which was my original point. We have the 4th highest paid DC, but we aren't in the top four in terms of staff pay. That's because we aren't spending 500k on an offensive coordinator (with the results we've had, we probably would have to pay CPJ a lot as an offensive coordinator anyways).
Guess I didn't explain my point well as I think I agree with you for the most part. I wasn't suggesting we got extra coaches. Just pointing out that we have 2 OL coaches as opposed to 1, which I guess was implied in your post.

I agree that not paying for an OC should be advantageous for our other assistants, all things being equal. Seems like that's how it worked given we just raised the Roof :shame:
 

dressedcheeseside

Helluva Engineer
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14,218
Moar.....
6_saxophone-9.jpg
 

Skeptic

Helluva Engineer
Messages
6,372
a 25% salary increase is only a "bit of a bump"? Plus guaranteed for 3 years is solid. I know you are thinking of "absolute" numbers and so don't see 600 to 750 as that big of an increase but how often does anyone get a 25% increase in pay from one year to the next without changing jobs?

(Correct me if I am wrong, I am a humanities guy not a math guy).
From another humanities guy, and just an observation: it is a hell of an academic world we live in when we pay the head coach $3.2 million and whatever bonuses, then note we are saving money on an OC since he is one, and not note that maybe part of that $3.2 million ought to be for offensive coordinating, or whatever. And that we pay the DC enough to hire, what, five or six top notch classroom professors for student-athletes? Oh, the humanity of it all.
 

PBR549

Ramblin' Wreck
Messages
837
From another humanities guy, and just an observation: it is a hell of an academic world we live in when we pay the head coach $3.2 million and whatever bonuses, then note we are saving money on an OC since he is one, and not note that maybe part of that $3.2 million ought to be for offensive coordinating, or whatever. And that we pay the DC enough to hire, what, five or six top notch classroom professors for student-athletes? Oh, the humanity of it all.
Capitalism
 

Eastman

Helluva Engineer
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1,289
Location
Columbia, SC
What normally comes to mind for me after such pay discussions is "man if I could make that much money for just a few years..." So funny that we call pay raises that are over 100,000 a year, "bumps" when I am hoping to get a raise of a few thousand.
I know a Tech degree certainly is valuable, but CPJ probably makes even more that the average Tech grad :)
 

CuseJacket

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Curious sideways turn to this thread; the unrelated discussion has been removed. Feel free to restart the side convo in The Swarm Lounge.
 

Skeptic

Helluva Engineer
Messages
6,372
Bottom line is that Roof and Pelton played 14 games with a total of 3 effective DT. Complain about stats all you want, no other team in the country was able to do that!
Speaking of Pelton, a story in today's (3/10) Oklahoman must be giving him pause that he was even considered at Oklahoma. A fraternity thrown off campus for a racist -- virulently so -- 10-second video; the university president and Stoops attending protest rallies (the video, not the ban) and the perception that suddenly "recruiting at Oklahoma just got a lot harder."
 
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