Credit for the Win today

Augusta_Jacket

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I am sure most will take your side of the debate but at the end of they day, what the coaches say or do not say in the postgame presser don't effect outcomes As I said in another post, our previous coach whom I had a great deal of respect for, was a "straight shooter" when winning and "snarky and bad with the press" when losing. I felt then, as I do now, these types of criticisms are emotional imo and driven purely by outcomes rather than rational thought.

What the coaches say and do at the end of the game is the only window the average fan gets into the program other than the product on the field. It is entirely possible to make rational judgements about a program based on the way a coach handles himself with the press. You can tell a lot about the culture of a program by the coaches demeanor. Now, we can debate ad nauseum (and we have on these threads) the merits of a particular culture vs. other programs, but that does not preclude the fact that the coaches very words are the single best indicator of the culture he has put in place.

Now, does that mean every single criticism on these boards is fair or accurate? No. There are a lot of posters who simply cannot or refuse to be reasonable about CGC. Some from the very start, with more added to the bandwagon with each bad loss. My position is that you can't throw the baby out with the bathwater. Just because some/most refuse to make reasonable judgements does not mean that reasonable judgement can not or should not be made.
 

4shotB

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What the coaches say and do at the end of the game is the only window the average fan gets into the program other than the product on the field. It is entirely possible to make rational judgements about a program based on the way a coach handles himself with the press. You can tell a lot about the culture of a program by the coaches demeanor. Now, we can debate ad nauseum (and we have on these threads) the merits of a particular culture vs. other programs, but that does not preclude the fact that the coaches very words are the single best indicator of the culture he has put in place.

Now, does that mean every single criticism on these boards is fair or accurate? No. There are a lot of posters who simply cannot or refuse to be reasonable about CGC. Some from the very start, with more added to the bandwagon with each bad loss. My position is that you can't throw the baby out with the bathwater. Just because some/most refuse to make reasonable judgements does not mean that reasonable judgement can not or should not be made.

Reasonable response. You make a lot of good points. However (and it may be a function of my age) is that I have listened to enough coaches speak that I think I could pull off a good presser and I wouldn't coach my way out of a wet paper bag. Also, I listened to enough talking heads in my day in the corporate world who could talk but couldn't do that I don't pay much attention to what anyone in front of a microphone says. i am a believer in the "show me, don't tell me" group. And, to reiterate, criticisms around what happens (or doesn't happen) on the field is fair game. Criticisms of a press conference remain silly to me.
 

Northeast Stinger

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5,173
I am sure most will take your side of the debate but at the end of they day, what the coaches say or do not say in the postgame presser don't effect outcomes As I said in another post, our previous coach whom I had a great deal of respect for, was a "straight shooter" when winning and "snarky and bad with the press" when losing. I felt then, as I do now, these types of criticisms are emotional imo and driven purely by outcomes rather than rational thought.
I think you are underestimating some of the people offering criticisms. It’s not all just an irrational emotional reaction to something said. For better or worse, CGC has said that he understands elite players and elite levels of play and elite programs. After dismal showings on the field he is asking us not to trust what our eyes are telling us but to trust him. After two years of being asked to ignore on field results some people are concerned that CGC is not addressing serious problems with his approach. His continuous happy talk is confirmation bias that he is not getting it done.

For my part I think beating Clemson is a chance to flip the script and look at this program in a whole new way. When we beat Clemson some of us will be tempted to say “I told you so,” but for my part I will just rejoice that there is renewed hope and the CGC approach might just be working.
 

MidtownJacket

Helluva Engineer
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3,488
I think you are underestimating some of the people offering criticisms. It’s not all just an irrational emotional reaction to something said. For better or worse, CGC has said that he understands elite players and elite levels of play and elite programs. After dismal showings on the field he is asking us not to trust what our eyes are telling us but to trust him. After two years of being asked to ignore on field results some people are concerned that CGC is not addressing serious problems with his approach. His continuous happy talk is confirmation bias that he is not getting it done.

For my part I think beating Clemson is a chance to flip the script and look at this program in a whole new way. When we beat Clemson some of us will be tempted to say “I told you so,” but for my part I will just rejoice that there is renewed hope and the CGC approach might just be working.
I don't think I have ever wanted a poster on this board to be right more than I do right this very moment. As the week gets closer to game week I am talking myself more and more into believing that we can pull a crazy upset.
 

billga99

Jolly Good Fellow
Messages
121
I don't think I have ever wanted a poster on this board to be right more than I do right this very moment. As the week gets closer to game week I am talking myself more and more into believing that we can pull a crazy upset.
I just don't think we will move the ball on offense. Clemson held Georgia to 10 points and no offensive TDs. And facing facts, GA has a far superior Offensive Line to us currently. I think the only realistic way to even be in this game is multiple turnovers by Clemson and leaving us short fields. I think sustained drives will be very difficult.
 

IslandsofGaunilo

Georgia Tech Fan
Messages
35
It makes the fan base look like a bunch of winey little bitches. If you want to moan and complain, let me know ahead of time and I'll just put you on ignore because you have the right to piss and moan, and I have the right to not have to listen to it. It's a pretty bad showing by a true fan to piss and moan (i.e. vent online) in the middle of your team's season.
Fair enough. You find angry fans distasteful and want them to either be banned or censored during the season. I just don't believe that your worry about looking like "whiney little bitches" justifies such censorship. I also find it ironic that you imply these angry fans are "whiney little bitches" and yet if one of them called Collins such you would put them on ignore.
 

tomknight

Jolly Good Fellow
Messages
194
Divisive and counterproductive to what exactly? You assume as if this board were in charge of running the team. What possible influence could some angry fans venting online have on the team? Players transfer? Collins wants to quit? Donors stop giving money? Thank you for laying out the argument. I just don’t buy it.
did you watch the post game conferences, where the players were asked specifically about this, and their responses?
 

tomknight

Jolly Good Fellow
Messages
194
I get it. I feel frustrated too. It’s just that bellyaching isn’t going to change it and just pisses other people off.

if we’re not going to stay optimistic about our team, all we’re succeeding in doing that is bringing others around us down.
it wasn't just griping and bellyaching. There are 65 pages (NO IDEA WHY MODS ALLOWED THIS) actively campaigning for the coach to be fired, criticizing the players directly, and even rooting for us to lose to KSU to hasten the departure of the coach.

It was pretty low.
 

tomknight

Jolly Good Fellow
Messages
194
I think you are underestimating some of the people offering criticisms. It’s not all just an irrational emotional reaction to something said. For better or worse, CGC has said that he understands elite players and elite levels of play and elite programs. After dismal showings on the field he is asking us not to trust what our eyes are telling us but to trust him. After two years of being asked to ignore on field results some people are concerned that CGC is not addressing serious problems with his approach. His continuous happy talk is confirmation bias that he is not getting it done.

For my part I think beating Clemson is a chance to flip the script and look at this program in a whole new way. When we beat Clemson some of us will be tempted to say “I told you so,” but for my part I will just rejoice that there is renewed hope and the CGC approach might just be working.

and if we lose, the Fire Collins thread and Money Down hate threads each go to 150 pages, making this whole forum stupid and wasteful.
 

MWBATL

Helluva Engineer
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4,954
it wasn't just griping and bellyaching. There are 65 pages (NO IDEA WHY MODS ALLOWED THIS) actively campaigning for the coach to be fired, criticizing the players directly, and even rooting for us to lose to KSU to hasten the departure of the coach.

It was pretty low.
Very few "rooted" for us to lose to KSU...about 25% (if I recall the poll accurately) thought we might lose to KSU. That's VERY different.

The bitching about coaching has been going on for about 5 or 6 years now (heck, maybe a lot longer). There were those who simply could not stand CPJ, and they were always vocal about it. Now there are those who cannot stand CGC. But MOST GT fans simply want to see good solid football and coaching and if we get beat doing that, then so be it. It is when we see very poor football decisions being made and no visible progress that we complain the loudest. And that, I suggest, if the fans' right to do.
 

roadkill

Georgia Tech Fan
Messages
26
it wasn't just griping and bellyaching. There are 65 pages (NO IDEA WHY MODS ALLOWED THIS) actively campaigning for the coach to be fired, criticizing the players directly, and even rooting for us to lose to KSU to hasten the departure of the coach.

It was pretty low.
It's a natural, some would say knee-jerk reaction among many fans to call for firing the coach after a disappointing or unexpected loss. But to put it in perspective, there's another message board that specifically bans calls for firing the coach. I'm not exactly sure why, but their policies tend to be such as to reduce strife and bickering among our fanbase (hint). I'm not suggesting that our coach(es) shouldn't be criticized - all comments and opinions about their performance should be welcomed.
Collin's demeanor after the NIU loss was frustrating to me personally and didn't help with respect to opinions of whether or not he should be fired, but I think that's just the way he is.
 

bobongo

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3,054
it wasn't just griping and bellyaching. There are 65 pages (NO IDEA WHY MODS ALLOWED THIS) actively campaigning for the coach to be fired, criticizing the players directly, and even rooting for us to lose to KSU to hasten the departure of the coach.

It was pretty low.
Over the top. A few called for the coach to be fired now, still fewer criticized players, and fewer still rooted for us to lose. Out of the 65 pages, maybe five comprise what you allege.
and if we lose, the Fire Collins thread and Money Down hate threads each go to 150 pages, making this whole forum stupid and wasteful.
If we lose to Clemson? No, it won't. More exaggeration.
 

forensicbuzz

Helluva Engineer
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4,776
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North Shore, Chicago
Fair enough. You find angry fans distasteful and want them to either be banned or censored during the season. I just don't believe that your worry about looking like "whiney little bitches" justifies such censorship. I also find it ironic that you imply these angry fans are "whiney little bitches" and yet if one of them called Collins such you would put them on ignore.
No, I understand angry fans. I am an angry fan. I'm as angry at the way my fellow fans have acted as I am at how the coaches and the team looked unprepared during the first game.

What is distasteful is the way certain of these angry fans choose to comport themselves. It doesn't reflect well on the Team or our fanbase. As another font posted, be critical of x's and o's, be critical of decision-making, discuss and dissect what could have/should have/wasn't done. But don't just complain and whine about how "the coach touts the elite nature of the team and then they don't show up." That's a lousy fan, and if you want to be that kind of lousy fan, have at it. Just give me enough warning to put you on ignore so I don't have to listen to you whine about something.
 

forensicbuzz

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it wasn't just griping and bellyaching. There are 65 pages (NO IDEA WHY MODS ALLOWED THIS) actively campaigning for the coach to be fired, criticizing the players directly, and even rooting for us to lose to KSU to hasten the departure of the coach.

It was pretty low.
yeah, I "ignored" the OP (one of my favorite fonts on this whole site) when I first saw the thread title, so the entire thread disappeared from my feed.
 

forensicbuzz

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North Shore, Chicago
Very few "rooted" for us to lose to KSU...about 25% (if I recall the poll accurately) thought we might lose to KSU. That's VERY different.

The bitching about coaching has been going on for about 5 or 6 years now (heck, maybe a lot longer). There were those who simply could not stand CPJ, and they were always vocal about it. Now there are those who cannot stand CGC. But MOST GT fans simply want to see good solid football and coaching and if we get beat doing that, then so be it. It is when we see very poor football decisions being made and no visible progress that we complain the loudest. And that, I suggest, if the fans' right to do.
I agree. Let's complain about the "right" things, though. Complaining about peripheral, unimportant crap isn't helpful. Neither is calling for the coach to be fired after the 1st game of the 3rd season, with Year 2 being The Year of Covid. It's purely an emotional response and not helpful in my opinion.
 

4shotB

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2,922
No, I understand angry fans. I am an angry fan. I'm as angry at the way my fellow fans have acted as I am at how the coaches and the team looked unprepared during the first game.

What is distasteful is the way certain of these angry fans choose to comport themselves. It doesn't reflect well on the Team or our fanbase. As another font posted, be critical of x's and o's, be critical of decision-making, discuss and dissect what could have/should have/wasn't done. But don't just complain and whine about how "the coach touts the elite nature of the team and then they don't show up." That's a lousy fan, and if you want to be that kind of lousy fan, have at it. Just give me enough warning to put you on ignore so I don't have to listen to you whine about something.

I will tell you where I am. I enjoy GT FB and expect to do so until I am on the other side of the dirt. I am excitedly looking forward to the upcoming game. And yes, I do suffer through the ups and downs and want the team to do well. I was attracted to the message boards in the early days because, in their infancy, it was a place to get details and insight into the program. To discuss specifics about strategy. Recruiting. Breakdowns of previous games. Camraderie amongst fellow Tech fans.

Over time, it has devolved into discussions of uniforms and press conferences and Myers-Briggs personality types. I just want to watch the actual games and discuss them without rancor or angst but it it is getting harder and harder to do so.
 

forensicbuzz

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I will tell you where I am. I enjoy GT FB and expect to do so until I am on the other side of the dirt. I am excitedly looking forward to the upcoming game. And yes, I do suffer through the ups and downs and want the team to do well. I was attracted to the message boards in the early days because, in their infancy, it was a place to get details and insight into the program. To discuss specifics about strategy. Recruiting. Breakdowns of previous games. Camraderie amongst fellow Tech fans.

Over time, it has devolved into discussions of uniforms and press conferences and Myers-Briggs personality types. I just want to watch the actual games and discuss them without rancor or angst but it it is getting harder and harder to do so.
Agreed. This place is a long way from what @John and @Eric started back in 2013.
 

jgtengineer

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1,633
Agreed. This place is a long way from what @John and @Eric started back in 2013.

At this point we are at 4 years since our last major successful season (i'd argue 2018 was "successfulish" Might be hard to imagine but fanbase was pretty much the same going into 2014. We just had more wins over the previous 4 years than now. And there were just as many calls for johnson's head in 2012 on other sites after the collapse. In september and october. And the OT loss to VT in a game we should have won. 2013 saw bringin in roof to appease the money guys who were friends with him. Also that happens to be the year Johnson literally changed his offense to a more power running passing offense around vad, even if we weren't that successful. Remember godigh had like 600 yards rushing and 400 receiving or something like that. We did the diamond thing, lots of pistol. But we still had inexplicable losses. 2014 we had the same things said in the first couple games. We just won them. The irony is a lot of people complaining about people calling out the coach now were the same folks on different boards calling for johnsons head constantly. If collins wants to win over fans he has to prove it. Johnson did too. The differences was Collins way of talking rubs people the wrong way.
I watched dabo's presser about us today. He was in spin mode to truly make the game out to be liek they were playing world beaters in us. So that when he wins it can viewed as bigger than it is. However its dabo and i did have to laugh because you know what a "elite player" is to dabo? "A good player." That's how he described yates. That's how johnson described good players. Collins uses elite to mean good. Its hyperbole. Hyperbole works when you winning. It bites you triple hard when you are losing.
 
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