CPJ Press Conference

Bruce Wayne

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This won't be the All-Academic Bowl on Saturday. The academics at GS have greatly improved over the years, and they now have the only fully accredited engineering program available south of Atlanta. I don't think that any of the football players at GS have declared that major. The average freshman SAT is higher at GS than at Georgia State, but not quite as high as GT and UGA. The GS number is getting higher every year, and they do have a variety of recognized programs on a nationwide basis. Without question the major sticking point for GT attracting the top high school football talent is the academics and limited degree offerings. There are a number of "smart" schools out there that attract the top talent, but they also offer degree programs that are attractive to a larger number of those four and five star kids.
Good post but I do not think I am being cynical when I go ahead and believe that investigative journalist who says that 100% of 5-star prospects take bribes in some form or fashion from bagmen, and 80% of 4 star prospects do the same.

Clearly a kid has to be interested in Tech to begin with to ever have a chance to land him as a commit and so the restriction of all degrees to being Bachelors of Science degrees (wish I could just use the abbreviation but I can't :p) and more rigorous standards as well as having to attend real classes are obstacles. But the sleazy reality below the surface of college recruiting also works strongly against Tech.

If a kid has 5 star talent, is going to be given 100-200K in under the table payola to school X and fully believes they will be drafted in 3 years then Tech's best selling point of a degree that will give them a comfortable means of making a living even after a possible pro career fades a good deal. These kids (like that UGA player who talked of football as his "livelihood") at no point consider themselves "students." They are in "career prep" not "college prep" mode in high school and see themselves as having started their professional careers after graduating high school. And why not if they are getting paid to play (plus room and board, medical care, etc)? Tech's same pitch to the high 3 stars and 20% of 4 stars that are not influenced by bribery has a chance at success.

That Bagmen article has definitively changed my expectations so far as recruiting is concerned, and it lurks behind even the "offseason" issue raised in this thread by Foxy about the football culture at Southern vs. that at Tech.
 

Bruce Wayne

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Improved football has greatly helped VT. Their applications almost doubled when Beamer started winning. With more applications, they have been able to raise the standard of students accepted. This is the link that every school trying to work their way up the recognition ladder can benefit.

At GT, we are unique, kind of like Stanford or ND (despite their guaranteed graduation Arts & Letters degree), in that we already get the best applications in the country and don't need football to improve the academic capability of incoming students. But I would think that the football program would help Ga Southern academics by bringing in more applicants so that the SAT average of those accepted is improved.

Spot on post. I think it is hard to really grasp just how significant and traditionally established Tech is as a world-class research Institute. If you grew up around here and went to Tech it in some sense was a "local" or "hometown" "school." If you are a longtime fan of GT athletics then you recognize its significant tradition with multiple championships in football, etc., and it is easier to lump Tech in your thoughts with other colleges that have a history of athletic tradition. But Tech is really spectacularly unique.

The only equivalent I can think of is that if you went back 80-90 years and looked at the national significance of the Yale vs. Harvard sports rivalry and academic rivalry, then you might have an analogue to what Tech still tries to accomplish. In both college athletics and worldwide academics Harvard and Yale were at the pinnacle plus they were truly in the national eye for both general public and media attention. Tech is still trying to "play" that game.

Btw, I don't mean this as a knock on any other college whether it be Georgia Southern or Stanford. The point is not a conceited "Tech is a better school" one but stressing that it is really unique. It is largely incomparable . . . not because all others "pale in comparison" but because it is just so "different" in what it is up to as an Institute of higher education, plus as a representative of the southern (and American) love of excellence in sport.
 

orientalnc

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5,083
This won't be the All-Academic Bowl on Saturday. The academics at GS have greatly improved over the years, and they now have the only fully accredited engineering program available south of Atlanta. I don't think that any of the football players at GS have declared that major. The average freshman SAT is higher at GS than at Georgia State, but not quite as high as GT and UGA. The GS number is getting higher every year, and they do have a variety of recognized programs on a nationwide basis. Without question the major sticking point for GT attracting the top high school football talent is the academics and limited degree offerings. There are a number of "smart" schools out there that attract the top talent, but they also offer degree programs that are attractive to a larger number of those four and five star kids.

I do not entirely disagree about the improvement at GSU. But, the data I used was from the 2014 incoming freshman class and it does not compare well with GT. It is also virtually unchanged from the 2011 and 2012 incoming classes. For that matter, it does not compare well with uga. My kid is making better grades at GSU than she did in HS with less out of class work. That is what she wanted in spite of my pleas to the contrary. What she got was an easy school that will allow her to have really good grades. So far, so good. That said, I wish her diploma would have a better respected name at the top. As you implied, at least it's not Georgia State. That said, she was accepted at Georgia Tech. That was my first choice for her. Now, I hope I am not also buying her a steak dinner. I gave her the points.
 

str8shooter

Georgia Tech Fan
Messages
22
No one said GS compared academically to GT. Glad that your daughter chose GS. Perhaps she is getting better grades because she is applying herself more and is going to school where she wants to. I will say again, this weekend is not about the Academic Bowl. You can get a very good education at GS and find jobs right out of college making good money. Before the economy went to pot, GS graduates from the Construction Management program had 100% job placement. The nursing program today is one of the best in the nation, and there are thousands of teachers and school administrators in Georgia with baccalaureate, Masters and Doctorage degrees from GS. Heck, we're even good at turning out notable musical artists, as both Luke Bryan and Cole Swindell are alums of GS. But in the end, this is ultimately about a football game. 50,000+ fans aren't going to show up to watch the Academic College Bowl or a spelling contest. Good news for GT is that they're getting some media coverage in south GA and the good news for GS is that they're getting the same in north GA.
 

vamosjackets

GT Athlete
Featured Member
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2,126
This won't be the All-Academic Bowl on Saturday. The academics at GS have greatly improved over the years, and they now have the only fully accredited engineering program available south of Atlanta. I don't think that any of the football players at GS have declared that major. The average freshman SAT is higher at GS than at Georgia State, but not quite as high as GT and UGA. The GS number is getting higher every year, and they do have a variety of recognized programs on a nationwide basis. Without question the major sticking point for GT attracting the top high school football talent is the academics and limited degree offerings. There are a number of "smart" schools out there that attract the top talent, but they also offer degree programs that are attractive to a larger number of those four and five star kids.
Just a little nitpick, but I don't think that's true. I'm pretty sure Mercer's engineering program is fully accredited as I have always considered them to be the 2nd best engineering program in the state. Now, maybe it's true for "south of Macon".
 

Nook Su Kow

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Just a little nitpick, but I don't think that's true. I'm pretty sure Mercer's engineering program is fully accredited as I have always considered them to be the 2nd best engineering program in the state. Now, maybe it's true for "south of Macon".
Think you're correct on that.
 

Longestday

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Did anyone find this comment interesting?

CPJ on coaching at GSU: ''It was a great time [coaching at Southern],'' Johnson said. ''It was a fun time. They get it. They care about football and they want to be good. They do what it takes to be good.''
 

Oldgoldandwhite

Helluva Engineer
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Did anyone find this comment interesting?

CPJ on coaching at GSU: ''It was a great time [coaching at Southern],'' Johnson said. ''It was a fun time. They get it. They care about football and they want to be good. They do what it takes to be good.''
Yep! When it is all said and done, Not a soul says "Alabama - National Champions - But they didn't graduate all their players!" Or," we fired our coach for recruiting good students."
 

Faulkner475

Georgia Tech Fan
Messages
39
I do not entirely disagree about the improvement at GSU. But, the data I used was from the 2014 incoming freshman class and it does not compare well with GT. It is also virtually unchanged from the 2011 and 2012 incoming classes. For that matter, it does not compare well with uga. My kid is making better grades at GSU than she did in HS with less out of class work. That is what she wanted in spite of my pleas to the contrary. What she got was an easy school that will allow her to have really good grades. So far, so good. That said, I wish her diploma would have a better respected name at the top. As you implied, at least it's not Georgia State. That said, she was accepted at Georgia Tech. That was my first choice for her. Now, I hope I am not also buying her a steak dinner. I gave her the points.

Does not compute.
 

dressedcheeseside

Helluva Engineer
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Yep! When it is all said and done, Not a soul says "Alabama - National Champions - But they didn't graduate all their players!" Or," we fired our coach for recruiting good students."
Being one of the few schools that actually tries to make a real college student out of it's football players is a point of pride for me.
 

jacketup

Ramblin' Wreck
Messages
998
Good point. Not every athlete wants to be an engineer. Tech is unwilling to implement majors that, in general, are more attractive for athletes. Our athletes either have to want to major in one of the few majors we have (very few athletes nationwide) or they are forced to major in one because they want to play at ball at a D1 school.

Dennis Andrews is eligible this week. What is his major?
Literature, media and communication

I went on a campus tour recently. The guide was a scholarship athlete. Her major?
History, Science and Technology

I heard an academic presentation from the various schools. One was the Liberal Arts College. Can you get a liberal arts degree at GT?

Yes, although it is a BS.

Not every athlete wants to be an engineer, but that statement has little to do with GT.

Paul Johnson, through his ministers of propaganda, like Kelly Quinlan, has done a great job of convincing the GT fan base that academics, and not his failures, is why GT is a mediocre (maybe) program.

It's almost funny that the UGa grad Quinlan is putting one over on GT fans.
 
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