Conference Realignment

Northeast Stinger

Helluva Engineer
Messages
11,127
Isn't this what the SEC and B1G want? They want their two conferences to be on a level above the rest. Not playing B12, ACC, and G5 teams just re-enforces that perception.
Think about it. The thing that reinforces the myth of superiority is playing patsies from other conferences, coupled with having winning records. Take away those two things and the SEC and B1G become just another conference that has a couple of good teams.
 

yeti92

Helluva Engineer
Messages
3,181
Yep.

I've been saying this for the past year or two...and advocating for a multi-tier system like the English leagues. Every school would eventually reach their proper level and play for their leagues' respective National titles.

CBS, ESPN, et al, would have MULTIPLE playoff games and championships to televise. And because of promotion/relegation, even the regular season games would count more and draw a larger TV audience.

What's not to love?
How does TV money get handled in this scenario of promotion and relegation? Let me know. The Big10 and SEC are already at the top and trying to lock that permanently in as best they can, they aren't going to agree to a TV revenue situation where any of their teams might fall, and they aren't going to agree to equal revenue distribution with the other leagues/conferences/levels.
 

Vespidae

Helluva Engineer
Messages
5,339
Location
Auburn, AL
Think about it. The thing that reinforces the myth of superiority is playing patsies from other conferences, coupled with having winning records. Take away those two things and the SEC and B1G become just another conference that has a couple of good teams.
The SEC also, over the last ten years, signed 155 5 star recruits … 3 times that of the ACC at 52.

“Twice during (that) span, SEC schools signed 20 five-star prospects and four other times they signed at least 15. SEC schools signed double-digit five-star guys every year during (that) span — and no other league reached double figures even once.” - ON3

Combine that with huge fan bases and media promotion = dominance.
 

orientalnc

Helluva Engineer
Retired Staff
Messages
10,037
Location
Oriental, NC
The SEC also, over the last ten years, signed 155 5 star recruits … 3 times that of the ACC at 52.

“Twice during (that) span, SEC schools signed 20 five-star prospects and four other times they signed at least 15. SEC schools signed double-digit five-star guys every year during (that) span — and no other league reached double figures even once.” - ON3

Combine that with huge fan bases and media promotion = dominance.
I don't think anyone is arguing that the SEC and B1G are not the strongest conferences in football. How that strength should be recognized in the CFP is the point where opinions diverge.
 

iceeater1969

Helluva Engineer
Messages
9,762
No, that’s not what the SEC wants. Sankey wants the best matchups, not any matchups. Play FSU or Clemson? Sure. Syracuse? Not so much.

As I understand it, all FBS teams who want to be in the CFP signed that they agreed to lesser money AND that SEC/B1G run it. So they agree too … the SEC/B1G are above the rest. And now that they are addicted to the money, how do they change that? Not likely.
The ncaa presidents run ncaa, but fail to limit excessive inventoring the best players.
I think this was also an issue with Dodd - during pre tv time.

They could link playoff appearances with total allowed scholarships. Do the regression analysis playoff verse J I MMY / JOE.
 

Vespidae

Helluva Engineer
Messages
5,339
Location
Auburn, AL
The ncaa presidents run ncaa, but fail to limit excessive inventoring the best players.
I think this was also an issue with Dodd - during pre tv time.

They could link playoff appearances with total allowed scholarships. Do the regression analysis playoff verse J I MMY / JOE.
Totally agree. If you want parity, cap the roster, limit the size of paid/unpaid staff, etc.

But no one has. The NCAA hasn’t helped by basically saying, “Whatever you want, dear”.
 

iceeater1969

Helluva Engineer
Messages
9,762
Totally agree. If you want parity, cap the roster, limit the size of paid/unpaid staff, etc.

But no one has. The NCAA hasn’t helped by basically saying, “Whatever you want, dear”.
Thanks.
The real issue is the aggregated talent by few causes the middle to aggregate from smaller schools.

We need to cut pay of NCAA
 

Vespidae

Helluva Engineer
Messages
5,339
Location
Auburn, AL
Thanks.
The real issue is the aggregated talent by few causes the middle to aggregate from smaller schools.

We need to cut pay of NCAA
The real problem is that all schools are not alike. Like HS, there should be tiers where schools of similar resources can compete against each other. Even within the SEC or B1G, only a handful of teams are good on a consistent basis.

Cap FBS at 128 teams, divide into 4 tiers of 32 each and create Natties for each.
 

roadkill

Helluva Engineer
Messages
1,921
The ncaa presidents run ncaa, but fail to limit excessive inventoring the best players.
I think this was also an issue with Dodd - during pre tv time.

They could link playoff appearances with total allowed scholarships. Do the regression analysis playoff verse J I MMY / JOE.
There was a time when scholarship limits could have been used to achieve more parity. With NIL, that approach would no longer be as effective. It would have to be a pretty deep cut, since the blue-chip players could get enough through NIL to not care about a scholly.

Roster size limits might seem useful, but even if you limited the roster to single-platoon football, the elite teams would simply have a team of all 5-stars.

As things stand now with antitrust rulings, it is exceedingly difficult to achieve parity via rules that impact player compensation. It might be possible to do something with staffing, but would that move the needle? Hopefully, some folks can come up with creative solutions, because everyone besides the players seems to agree that the system is broken.
 

Vespidae

Helluva Engineer
Messages
5,339
Location
Auburn, AL
Hopefully, some folks can come up with creative solutions, because everyone besides the players seems to agree that the system is broken.
One of the issues in CFB today is that the money is unequally distributed. It should be that the NCAA, not the conferences, negotiates a media deal and then, distributes the money to all participating schools. They can still leverage their fanbases for support, but that would be a big step to equalize access to resources that is increasingly out of reach for many schools.
 

Northeast Stinger

Helluva Engineer
Messages
11,127
The SEC also, over the last ten years, signed 155 5 star recruits … 3 times that of the ACC at 52.

“Twice during (that) span, SEC schools signed 20 five-star prospects and four other times they signed at least 15. SEC schools signed double-digit five-star guys every year during (that) span — and no other league reached double figures even once.” - ON3

Combine that with huge fan bases and media promotion = dominance.
Doesn’t change what I said though.

5 star athletes go to certain schools, not certain conferences. Ohio State, Michigan, Southern Cal, Georgia, Alabama, maybe even FSU and Miami, will continue to get their star recruits. But the days of a Mississippi or Tennessee piggybacking off of SEC hype would be over.

Look, even Georgia padded their record last season with several bottom feeder schools. If the SEC has to build their success on more than reputation, by actually winning on the field, most SEC teams will look just like the teams in every other conference.
 

roadkill

Helluva Engineer
Messages
1,921
One of the issues in CFB today is that the money is unequally distributed. It should be that the NCAA, not the conferences, negotiates a media deal and then, distributes the money to all participating schools. They can still leverage their fanbases for support, but that would be a big step to equalize access to resources that is increasingly out of reach for many schools.
An interesting concept. They do that for the basketball tournament, but the CFP got ahead of them for football. Not sure how it could ever change to NCAA governance.
I've suggested that the CFP organization itself be the governing body for D1 football. After all, they are now controlling the largest share of media revenue. This approach aligns with the Knight Commission recommendations.
 

Vespidae

Helluva Engineer
Messages
5,339
Location
Auburn, AL
Doesn’t change what I said though.

5 star athletes go to certain schools, not certain conferences. Ohio State, Michigan, Southern Cal, Georgia, Alabama, maybe even FSU and Miami, will continue to get their star recruits. But the days of a Mississippi or Tennessee piggybacking off of SEC hype would be over.

Look, even Georgia padded their record last season with several bottom feeder schools. If the SEC has to build their success on more than reputation, by actually winning on the field, most SEC teams will look just like the teams in every other conference.
You said "The thing that reinforces the myth of superiority is playing patsies from other conferences, coupled with having winning records. Take away those two things and the SEC and B1G become just another conference that has a couple of good teams."

"Conferences", not "schools". So I am responding to that. And the data I provided demonstrates that the very best players tend to play in the SEC (at various schools).

You are not "just another conference" if your ten-year recruiting record demonstrates having the best athletes year after year AND huge fanbases that want to watch them.
 

Vespidae

Helluva Engineer
Messages
5,339
Location
Auburn, AL
An interesting concept. They do that for the basketball tournament, but the CFP got ahead of them for football. Not sure how it could ever change to NCAA governance.
I've suggested that the CFP organization itself be the governing body for D1 football. After all, they are now controlling the largest share of media revenue. This approach aligns with the Knight Commission recommendations.
The problem for CFB is that they want NFL like money, but don't organize themselves like the NFL. Can imagine if all 32 NFL teams let 6 determine who gets spots in the Playoffs and who gets what share of the revenue? All CFB has done is lock in who the perpetual winners are.
 

Root4GT

Helluva Engineer
Messages
3,310
The real problem is that all schools are not alike. Like HS, there should be tiers where schools of similar resources can compete against each other. Even within the SEC or B1G, only a handful of teams are good on a consistent basis.

Cap FBS at 128 teams, divide into 4 tiers of 32 each and create Natties for each.
The roblmbecomes TV viewers are highly concentrated on Tier 1 in your scheme. Tire 1 schools then will want proportional money commensurate with viewers. TV networks will agree as that is where their money comes from. Soon there after Tires 2-4 are FCS and Division II level schools.
 

Techster

Helluva Engineer
Messages
18,388
adding Texas is a little different than adding just any other second school from an already represented state

Some schools you take regardless of the "overlap" implications. Notre Dame and UTexas would easily be in the top 5 schools you never turn down if you're building a "power" conference.
 

slugboy

Moderator
Staff member
Messages
11,724
An interesting concept. They do that for the basketball tournament, but the CFP got ahead of them for football. Not sure how it could ever change to NCAA governance.
I've suggested that the CFP organization itself be the governing body for D1 football. After all, they are now controlling the largest share of media revenue. This approach aligns with the Knight Commission recommendations.
The University of Oklahoma and others sued the NCAA back in 1984 for the rights to create TV contracts and be on the air more often

Before that, the NCAA was severely limiting the number of games on TV and the individual appearances. GT practically couldn’t get on TV. It’s part of at least 50 years of the NCAA making bad strategic decisions

They could have a shared NFL style contract, if they hadn’t blown it years ago
 

57jacket

Helluva Engineer
Messages
1,582
The roblmbecomes TV viewers are highly concentrated on Tier 1 in your scheme. Tire 1 schools then will want proportional money commensurate with viewers. TV networks will agree as that is where their money comes from. Soon there after Tires 2-4 are FCS and Division II level schools.
The Tier stuff is a bunch of crap. Just look at some games and make a rating.
 
Top