Coaching Carousel 6 - You can't make everyone happy. You are not bacon.

Fatmike91

Fatmike91

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CuseJacket said:
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All I see is jerry seinfeld:

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gt24

Jolly Good Fellow
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354
AUFC said:
I went to rural CT high school boy's and girl's basketball games my entire childhood. It does not come close to the fervor I hear states like Indiana do. The games were friends and family of the players and then me and my dad (and we were family when my brother was playing and friends when my babysitter was playing). Very fond memories though, despite any lack of intensity in the gym. I'd wake up every morning before school and read the Hartford Courant for box scores of away games.
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As someone who has experience in Kentucky, Indiana, and Connecticut high school gyms, I can attest to your statement. Bullseye.

There is nothing like Indiana high school basketball. The mythology of it is legitimate. It is real. Maybe not in every town at every school on every night, but generally speaking, it is accurate and deserved. Kentucky is not on the same level, and yet it is above all others not named Indiana. (Not speaking about talent level or future D1 or pro players - that title belongs to the DMV.) A few anecdotes...

I've been in gyms in Indiana on high school campuses, connected to the high school building, that held 3/4/5,000+ fans. These gyms (on campus) had reserved seating for season ticket holders. They had 360, two-level seating. They had elevated, second-level dedicated press rows/boxes for radio or TV broadcasts.

I've been in gyms for pre-season scrimmages in Kentucky where 2,000+ fans paid to attend and were throwing trash at the opposing team as came out of the tunnel to enter the gym for warmups 20 minutes before tipoff. The Kentucky Sweet 16 state tournament at Rupp Arena is special. Only 3 states remain with 1 single state champion/tournament - no levels or divisions or classes. Just one tournament and one champion. Kentucky, Hawaii, and I believe New Hampshire or Vermont? (I forget which one it is.) The 16 regional tournaments to earn a trip to Rupp might be even more special, because they are local/regional and all the rivalries and fans are there for incredible experiences year after year after year.

There are, at most, a ~dozen HS games per year in Connecticut that match what happens at dozens of gyms across Kentucky and Indiana every week for midseason local rivalry matchups on Tuesday and Friday nights.

I spoke with a New England mid-major D1 associate head coach two years ago (pre-COVID) and asked for his latest thoughts on recruiting. He said they were specifically recruiting/targeting Indiana because they figured out that Indiana HS kids have spent their whole lives preparing and competing to make the local HS team. Then they fought to earn minutes against other kids whose primary goal in life was to start varsity for their local HS team. If they started varsity in Indiana, they surely played in home and away gyms that were more intense and hostile and pressure-packed than most mid-major D1 programs ever face except for the conference tournament to get the bid to the NCAAT. In short, he said nothing replicated Indiana HS basketball.

Aside from HS, I can also speak to the dearth of UConn fanatics relative to IU/UK/UofL bball fanatics. The gap is so wide, I'm not sure how to describe it.
 
ESPNjacket

ESPNjacket

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1,531
gt24 said:
As someone who has experience in Kentucky, Indiana, and Connecticut high school gyms, I can attest to your statement. Bullseye.

There is nothing like Indiana high school basketball. The mythology of it is legitimate. It is real. Maybe not in every town at every school on every night, but generally speaking, it is accurate and deserved. Kentucky is not on the same level, and yet it is above all others not named Indiana. (Not speaking about talent level or future D1 or pro players - that title belongs to the DMV.) A few anecdotes...

I've been in gyms in Indiana on high school campuses, connected to the high school building, that held 3/4/5,000+ fans. These gyms (on campus) had reserved seating for season ticket holders. They had 360, two-level seating. They had elevated, second-level dedicated press rows/boxes for radio or TV broadcasts.

I've been in gyms for pre-season scrimmages in Kentucky where 2,000+ fans paid to attend and were throwing trash at the opposing team as came out of the tunnel to enter the gym for warmups 20 minutes before tipoff. The Kentucky Sweet 16 state tournament at Rupp Arena is special. Only 3 states remain with 1 single state champion/tournament - no levels or divisions or classes. Just one tournament and one champion. Kentucky, Hawaii, and I believe New Hampshire or Vermont? (I forget which one it is.) The 16 regional tournaments to earn a trip to Rupp might be even more special, because they are local/regional and all the rivalries and fans are there for incredible experiences year after year after year.

There are, at most, a ~dozen HS games per year in Connecticut that match what happens at dozens of gyms across Kentucky and Indiana every week for midseason local rivalry matchups on Tuesday and Friday nights.

I spoke with a New England mid-major D1 associate head coach two years ago (pre-COVID) and asked for his latest thoughts on recruiting. He said they were specifically recruiting/targeting Indiana because they figured out that Indiana HS kids have spent their whole lives preparing and competing to make the local HS team. Then they fought to earn minutes against other kids whose primary goal in life was to start varsity for their local HS team. If they started varsity in Indiana, they surely played in home and away gyms that were more intense and hostile and pressure-packed than most mid-major D1 programs ever face except for the conference tournament to get the bid to the NCAAT. In short, he said nothing replicated Indiana HS basketball.

Aside from HS, I can also speak to the dearth of UConn fanatics relative to IU/UK/UofL bball fanatics. The gap is so wide, I'm not sure how to describe it.
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I think we are using completely different definitions. A basketball state is one where basketball is as important or at least close to as important, as football. It doesn't mean it is like Indiana. College and high school sports aren't as important, in general, in New England as the midwest or the south.
 
forensicbuzz

forensicbuzz

21st Century Throwback Dad
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ESPNjacket said:
I think we are using completely different definitions. A basketball state is one where basketball is as important or at least close to as important, as football. It doesn't mean it is like Indiana. College and high school sports aren't as important, in general, in New England as the midwest or the south.
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Well, that's not tough when HS football is about the 4th or 5th sport at the school. I played HS football in CT as a 6'0" 135# running back my senior year. Our heaviest OL was 225#. That's not a very good definition of a basketball state.
 
LibertyTurns

LibertyTurns

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@dtm1997 One forum over we got a similar scenario although not as many results to analyze like Crean and arguably an easier scenario fixing a basketball program. There’s a reason you don’t march in & crap on your organization’s history. Some players/fans will come out immediately & get defensive, many will bite their tongue and wait for you to F up then unleash their fury. He’s getting it now. You better be damn good if you’re going to take that approach. He’s not that good.
 
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