Clayton State (Scrimmage)

[dtm1997]

@CuseJacket fantastic report back on our questions and great point about Bolden being @kg01's fault.

More work to be done before next week, but we appear to have a foundation.

Box score for anyone interested, but not sure it'll provide much analytical value.

http://www.ramblinwreck.com/sports/m-baskbl/stats/2014-2015/gt110714.html

 

[Peacone36]

@kg01 : "Hey how is Bolden playing? "

 

[kg01]

Yesh, I'll take the L on that one. From now on it's full reverse jinx mode on #2 (he is #2 now, right?)

 

[ChasonBaller]

The way Bolden plays really pisses me off.....he is slow on everything he does and it seems that he hasn't improved as he should. I think if he doesn't show improvement in the beginning of the season, he needs to be at the very end of the bench with the towel wavers.

 

[Peacone36]

As much as i am trying to be optimistic that his frosh year was CB and year 2 was an aberration I agree with @ChasonBaller , if he continues to throw up floaters and play lackadaisical on defense and hesitant on offense I would just assume see him sit and rotate TJ, TJ, CH, MGH and JH at the 2 guard spots.

 

[alaguy]

@CuseJacket fantastic report back on our questions and great point about Bolden being @kg01's fault.

More work to be done before next week, but we appear to have a foundation.

Box score for anyone interested, but not sure it'll provide much analytical value.

http://www.ramblinwreck.com/sports/m-baskbl/stats/2014-2015/gt110714.html

thebox score was revealing on some things
-Lammers looked like the most efficient player--10 pts/4 rebs,2-2 Ft in 12 mins
Generally if you can't look good vs C St,you are not going to look good unless Coach specifically said to try this or that
11-25 FT is not good vs dook an 15000 much less in a scrimmage
on paper,it looks like this what team needsis a proven 3pt shooter instead of say-Bolden

 

[dtm1997]

@alaguy the problem with the free throws is that the improvement is going to have to primarily come from other than Cox & Mitchell. I think we're gonna get what we got from them. Combined for over 60% from the field, were abysmal from the line.

Adjusting them out, I recall the rest of the team shot 60%FT and that, in my opinion, is where the bulk of the oppty to improve lies.

I'm not saying Cox & Mitchell shouldn't work to improve, but if they're combining for 15-20 shots, hitting 60%+ on them, I feel pretty good about their overall offensive contribution. If opposing teams go to a Hack-A-Cox or Hack-A-Chuck strategy, they'd better hold off because they'll get in to foul trouble quickly.

ETA - I got nothing for you on the 3pt shooting. Only guess is TJ, TJ, & Q, hoping Bolden comes along.

 

[Eric]

Simply put...Bolden is going to have to play step up. If not, were in for some long nights on offense.

 

[awbuzz]

Thanks for all of your evaluation...
Going to be a long season...
I'll be happy to get an NIT bid. Making the big dance will be gravy (that I'd gladly eat)

 

[Peacone36]

I love gravy, especially when its on poutine.

 

[dtm1997]

I love gravy, especially when its on poutine.

I'm no fan of gravy, but I'll admit... it's pretty good on poutine.

 

[Connell62]

@CuseJacket Way to bring the heat with the coverage and summary. Great stuff man!! That's why this is the best source for GT hoops discussion on the web!

Couple thoughts:

- Free throw shooting - dtm hit it right on the head. In order to have any success this year, we must make free throws. We're not good enough offensively to shoot 11-25 from the line and still win. If Cox & Mitchell can improve even a little, it would be huge for this team as both are going to get a ton of chances at the line.

- 3 Point Shooting - I think that our three point shooting can improve if we can create more flow within our offense. I don't know about Friday night, but in the exhibition, the three's that we made (especially Tadric), were from where a guard broke down the defense and kicked it, or it came back out of the post. Taking Bolden out of the equation, I think that Tadric, Quinton, and to a certain degree, Jorgensen, are pretty solid three point shooters, but consistency must improve.

 

[Peacone36]

Im interested to see Travis' attempt some in game. I like his stroke but it looks like he may need a bit of time, which may end up being ok considering we have a front line that represents an NFL linebacking crew.

 

[CuseJacket]

As promised here are my last takeaways from the game, albeit 1 day later than I promised:

• Jorg - most natural PG we've had in years. I'm not worried about making that proclamation now, though I think that's as much a factor of Udofia and Golden being scorers who played PG. Jorg sees the floor well and understands the flow of the game. Three unanswered questions from what I saw:
  • #1 - Will he be a threat from 3? Right now I say he won't. His form starts low and is a slow release. His only attempted 3 was wide open. The only form I've seen start that low with any consistent success is Shawn Marion. A solid/confident 3-pt shooter would have looked to put up 1 or 2 more in specific situations I saw. Good news is I think his form is at a starting point where he can quickly get better with practice. Sometimes that's not always the case.
  • #2 - Will he be pass-first to a fault? There was one transition 2-on-1 where he didn't make the defender commit before passing. He eyed down his teammate and it resulted in a TO. He will make freshman mistakes as he did Friday. I also want to see if he'll finish in the lane with consistency in the half court. He had one aggressive drive to the basket early in the game that I liked.
  • #3 - How is he defensively? Clayton State didn't make anyone have to prove anything.
• Tadric - I wonder if it was nervousness, rust, him being a frosh, or something else that kept him from getting going early. Probably too soon to read into it but it seems fair to expect wild swings from a freshman that is expected to contribute as a scorer. His stroke was solid once he mentally got into the game. It was clear to me, even when he missed his last 3-pt attempt before finally connecting, that he is a scorer. He had the confidence and it was noticeable once he got rid of the cobwebs. I didn't see him much on defense and wonder about his ability there.
• Lammers - Best shooting form of the big men? Only Sampson can give him a run for his money. Lammers seems a little slow and Gregory even pointed out postgame that he needs to put on weight. Impressed with Lammers' hands and instinct though for a freshman guy his size. I'm not sure how he'll hold up against ACC-caliber big men this year, but he's certainly capable if the other team goes small. His FG numbers from Friday are the result of some easy layups/dunks. He finished those strong though.
• Gueye - Probably one of the best players Friday but also probably needs to redshirt. Understands how to pumpfake and use his athleticism to his advantage. Given his lack of weight he's an undersized 4 right now. Brought good energy on Friday. Not worried about his FT shooting this year as I don't expect him to play much nor get attempts that matter.
• Cox -
  • Have to admit I haven't been that interested in reading a lot of material on all of our transfers during the offseason. Given my comfort (or maybe arrogance?) in assessing b'ball players independently I am trying to form my own opinion as the season goes along. End of disclaimer.
  • My thoughts... Cox clearly is a guy in the transition year going from role player to scorer. He positioned himself well on the block and used his body/weight to work his way to the basket. His form when going up seemed uncomfortable. He had a couple low and unnatural release points that will get swatted against better competition. He effectively used his weight to shield the defender from blocking his shot Friday. I am inclined to believe that's largely the Clayton St. factor. Either way, he'll be good for 6-10 a game.
  • As I watched his first free throw attempt my brain said "uh-oh". It's not that his form is terrible, but it seemed to be a struggle to find the appropriate muscle memory. It's the classic Shaq/big guy thing. Someone said in Chat and in this thread that he's a 50% shooter for his career. I don't see that drastically improving.
• Sampson - Consistent midrange jumper and form in pregame. I have confidence that he's able to hit the 18-footer. We'll need him to hit those as a compliment to Cox playing back to the basket. Not so confident in his ability to hit 3's. Seemed to rush into his 3-balls during the game. He showed flashes of aggressiveness on D including a pretty clean two-handed recovery block that was called a foul.

That's all. Hope the positives remain positive and the negatives are just me reading way too much into an exhibition game. Everything will be much clearer after this Friday night.

 

[alaguy]

As promised here are my last takeaways from the game, albeit 1 day later than I promised:

• Jorg - most natural PG we've had in years. I'm not worried about making that proclamation now, though I think that's as much a factor of Udofia and Golden being scorers who played PG. Jorg sees the floor well and understands the flow of the game. Three unanswered questions from what I saw:
  • #1 - Will he be a threat from 3? Right now I say he won't. His form starts low and is a slow release. His only attempted 3 was wide open. The only form I've seen start that low with any consistent success is Shawn Marion. A solid/confident 3-pt shooter would have looked to put up 1 or 2 more in specific situations I saw. Good news is I think his form is at a starting point where he can quickly get better with practice. Sometimes that's not always the case.
  • #2 - Will he be pass-first to a fault? There was one transition 2-on-1 where he didn't make the defender commit before passing. He eyed down his teammate and it resulted in a TO. He will make freshman mistakes as he did Friday. I also want to see if he'll finish in the lane with consistency in the half court. He had one aggressive drive to the basket early in the game that I liked.
  • #3 - How is he defensively? Clayton State didn't make anyone have to prove anything.
• Tadric - I wonder if it was nervousness, rust, him being a frosh, or something else that kept him from getting going early. Probably too soon to read into it but it seems fair to expect wild swings from a freshman that is expected to contribute as a scorer. His stroke was solid once he mentally got into the game. It was clear to me, even when he missed his last 3-pt attempt before finally connecting, that he is a scorer. He had the confidence and it was noticeable once he got rid of the cobwebs. I didn't see him much on defense and wonder about his ability there.
• Lammers - Best shooting form of the big men? Only Sampson can give him a run for his money. Lammers seems a little slow and Gregory even pointed out postgame that he needs to put on weight. Impressed with Lammers' hands and instinct though for a freshman guy his size. I'm not sure how he'll hold up against ACC-caliber big men this year, but he's certainly capable if the other team goes small. His FG numbers from Friday are the result of some easy layups/dunks. He finished those strong though.
• Gueye - Probably one of the best players Friday but also probably needs to redshirt. Understands how to pumpfake and use his athleticism to his advantage. Given his lack of weight he's an undersized 4 right now. Brought good energy on Friday. Not worried about his FT shooting this year as I don't expect him to play much nor get attempts that matter.
• Cox -
  • Have to admit I haven't been that interested in reading a lot of material on all of our transfers during the offseason. Given my comfort (or maybe arrogance?) in assessing b'ball players independently I am trying to form my own opinion as the season goes along. End of disclaimer.
  • My thoughts... Cox clearly is a guy in the transition year going from role player to scorer. He positioned himself well on the block and used his body/weight to work his way to the basket. His form when going up seemed uncomfortable. He had a couple low and unnatural release points that will get swatted against better competition. He effectively used his weight to shield the defender from blocking his shot Friday. I am inclined to believe that's largely the Clayton St. factor. Either way, he'll be good for 6-10 a game.
  • As I watched his first free throw attempt my brain said "uh-oh". It's not that his form is terrible, but it seemed to be a struggle to find the appropriate muscle memory. It's the classic Shaq/big guy thing. Someone said in Chat and in this thread that he's a 50% shooter for his career. I don't see that drastically improving.
• Sampson - Consistent midrange jumper and form in pregame. I have confidence that he's able to hit the 18-footer. We'll need him to hit those as a compliment to Cox playing back to the basket. Not so confident in his ability to hit 3's. Seemed to rush into his 3-balls during the game. He showed flashes of aggressiveness on D including a pretty clean two-handed recovery block that was called a foul.

That's all. Hope the positives remain positive and the negatives are just me reading way too much into an exhibition game. Everything will be much clearer after this Friday night.

Good pts.
I had only seen Jorg on tape from hi school but your thoughts were exactly mine--good QB type but the 3 pt shot was low and slow.I also worried about a 180lb guy with a recovering leg on Def.Good passer-If we had some shooters he would get a bunch of assists.
To me Sampson is THE KEY to the scoring this season .If he can hit 15-18 ft shots from hi-low set then teams can't double on Cox low.That tandem should be our 1st AND 2nd play every time to start the season even with G-H.

 

[Peacone36]

Good pts.
I had only seen Jorg on tape from hi school but your thoughts were exactly mine--good QB type but the 3 pt shot was low and slow.I also worried about a 180lb guy with a recovering leg on Def.Good passer-If we had some shooters he would get a bunch of assists.
To me Sampson is THE KEY to the scoring this season .If he can hit 15-18 ft shots from hi-low set then teams can't double on Cox low.That tandem should be our 1st AND 2nd play every time to start the season even with G-H.

He may have to prove that he can hit that shot and could be a key to the success of this team (he is in my mind as well) but I KNOW Q can hit that shot.