2025 NC St post game

[Root4GT]

Yeah, if I’m going to bash one phase of the game it’s definitely the defense. However, I agree with you, as well as coach Key, that it was a team loss. In critical situations, when one side of the ball needed the other side to pick them up, it didn’t happen. That pattern repeated throughout the game. NC State could not have won a shootout with us if our offense gets some critical yards when needed. On the other hand, it never should have come down to a shootout and that’s on our defense.

We stopped NCST one drive Saturday night until their last drive where they were killing the clock.

Our offense needed 3 more TDs to win the game. Getting 7 TDs is beyond any reasonable expectations.

NCST likely could have gotten another TD in their last possession had they actually tried based on how our defense never stopped their offense giving them 55 points.

This was on the defense.

 

[Northeast Stinger]

We stopped NCST one drive Saturday night until their last drive where they were killing the clock.

Our offense needed 3 more TDs to win the game. Getting 7 TDs is beyond any reasonable expectations.

NCST likely could have gotten another TD in their last possession had they actually tried based on how our defense never stopped their offense giving them 55 points.

This was on the defense.

Yeah, I’m not trying to split hairs. It was mostly on the defense. But what I saw was NC State playing complimentary ball. Their offensive players got truly excited every time a Tech drive stalled, and NC State’s defensive players seemed to hit harder and get more aggressive every time their offense scored. They were picking each other up. We were not.

I’ll be curious about their QB in the future. Is he going to be as good as he seems? Was that a once in a lifetime game for him? He was unbelievably poised and confident and seemed to make the right reads and decisions on every play. Contrary to what some on here have said, our defense was mixing coverage, disguising coverage, and mixing up the pressure packages, but he seemed to know exactly what to do each time. He found the open man on blitzes, he stayed in the pocket when he needed to, he scrambled for yardage when he needed to, and he dumped to safety valves when needed.

 

[Root4GT]

Yeah, I’m not trying to split hairs. It was mostly on the defense. But what I saw was NC State playing complimentary ball. Their offensive players got truly excited every time a Tech drive stalled, and NC State’s defensive players seemed to hit harder and get more aggressive every time their offense scored. They were picking each other up. We were not.

I’ll be curious about their QB in the future. Is he going to be as good as he seems? Was that a once in a lifetime game for him? He was unbelievably poised and confident and seemed to make the right reads and decisions on every play. Contrary to what some on here have said, our defense was mixing coverage, disguising coverage, and mixing up the pressure packages, but he seemed to know exactly what to do each time. He found the open man on blitzes, he stayed in the pocket when he needed to, he scrambled for yardage when he needed to, and he dumped to safety valves when needed.

Bailey is a good WB having a very good season. I would expect Miami to try and get him via the Portal this offseason. He is from Miami. If not Miami some other high level P4 team will come after him.

 

[Frenchise]

Overall - this is the problem with hiring a guy who has never called plays before. He was exposed and had no answers. Love Key, but he's not a guy who can go in and fix that like Saban or Kirby. Not many teams have that, some do. Our defense has plenty of tape out there, its the point in the season where your weaknesses become glaring.

BG needs to learn from this and adjust. This performance wasn't bad - it was completely pitiful.

And to those saying Blitz 6 or 7 - we couldn't cover with 8. 6 or 7 man blitzes are not something you want to be calling often.

A couple things:
We must get more deceptive and figure out how to get pressure with 5. None of those blitzes have been deceptive or fast.
The DT twists have not worked. I don't know why we keep doing it. Both DTs get shuffled into the same A gap and there are huge holes in the B gaps.

 

[Frenchise]

Hard to pressure a los with our scheme that is essentially prevent zone reliant. Thats why our run d is so bad. Everyone is so far back and in zone. You want pressure. We need alot more man to man than we do and man to man is the best D against the run. Yet we are in a deep 2 deep shell or quarters darn near every snap. When we do man or even blitz we have no concept of spacing or attacking the opposing offenses blocking schemes.

Gideon has no answer and is too scared to be aggressive. He is in way over his head and if this hire was better we wouldn’t be squandering a once in a century opportunity

Unreal. Key better start figuring something out or even bringing in a d staff consultant now.

Zone is not bad against the run, it's typically better than man. Man is not "the best" against the run. Zone with Corners 15 yards back is bad against the run.

 

[BainbridgeJacket]

Zone is not bad against the run. Zone with Corners 15 yards back is bad against the run.

Cover 2 with LBs lined up outside the box because of WR alignment is bad against the run, though....

 

[Northeast Stinger]

Overall - this is the problem with hiring a guy who has never called plays before. He was exposed and had no answers. Love Key, but he's not a guy who can go in and fix that like Saban or Kirby. Not many teams have that, some do. Our defense has plenty of tape out there, its the point in the season where your weaknesses become glaring.

BG needs to learn from this and adjust. This performance wasn't bad - it was completely pitiful.

And to those saying Blitz 6 or 7 - we couldn't cover with 8. 6 or 7 man blitzes are not something you want to be calling often.

A couple things:
We must get more deceptive and figure out how to get pressure with 5. None of those blitzes have been deceptive or fast.
The DT twists have not worked. I don't know why we keep doing it. Both DTs get shuffled into the same A gap and there are huge holes in the B gaps.

“Mind the gap” is not just advice for the London Underground.

I hate to pile on players but our linebackers can’t seem to keep up with fast teams either.

 

[Frenchise]

Cover 2 with LBs lined up outside the box because of WR alignment is bad against the run, though....

Sure. I'm just saying the answer is not "Run man because it's better against the run".

 

[yeti92]

I wonder if Key can get Saban to come consult with Gideon for the next 2 weeks. I'm sure a donor would be happy to fund the cost.

 

[RamblinRed]

We never had a realistic shot to win this game in the 2nd half.
After NC ST scored a TD with 7 min left in the 3rd quarter GT never had the ball with a chance to tie or lead the rest of the game.
From that point on it was basically a matter of how bad of loss was it going to be.


It's time to take this game and learn from it and prepare for BC.

Before the season started I had 2 goals for this team, win at least 9 regular season games and beat UGA - both of those are still on the table.
I will say anything less than 10 regular season wins would be a really poor finish though. Not having a ten win season would mean losing at least 4 of its last 5 games.

 

[slugboy]

They didn’t have to play a perfect game. They just had to make the routine plays and the game probably turns out different. The decision to kick a 54 yd FG was the beginning of the end. Should have gone for it and kept momentum but that didn't happen.

I haven’t gone through the plays, but NC

I pulled up the drives. NC State elected to take the opening kickoff because they know what kind of team they are--they play better with a lead than from behind. You also need to pressure Bailey, and we didn't all day long.

If you've been a fan of GT for a while, you can remember being in shootouts. If you're trading scores, you have to keep scoring TDs until the other team flinches.

There were four drives in Q1: NC State TD, GT TD, NC State TD, GT FG. We were down at the end of the first because we couldn't hold serve. 10-14 (our score first)

Q2, NC State punts--this is important, because it's our first shot at playing with a lead. GT TD--we lead and take the advantage 17-14. NC State fumbled into the end zone for a score--17-21. GT fails on drive and misses FG. We failed to hold serve, and lose the advantage. NC State FG--halftime 17-24: a full TD lead

At halftime, we had shot ourselves in the foot. We had one punt from NC State, so we had a chance to control the game. We surrendered that chance.

Q3: if we played Q2 well, we would take the kickoff with a chance to lead, but we barely had a chance to tie. We bungled the middle 8-- the for minutes on either side of halftime. GT FG, 20-24, which was better than nothing, but we failed to keep pace again.
NC State TD: 20-31. They aren't having trouble scoring. Not only is this the shootout I hoped wouldn't happen, but we can't shoot as well as them. GT FG, NC State TD, GT TD. 30-38 at the end of Q3, NC State has the ball.

Q4: NC State FG--better than a TD, but small comfort. 30-41, two score lead. GT punt. NC State TD, 30-48. GT TD, NC State punt, end of game, 36-48.

Yes, the defense was terrible, but teams in shootouts do win them if they can hold serve—we couldn’t


For plays that turned the game, it’s mostly us having opportunities and not being able to execute: https://gameonpaper.com/cfb/game/401754579

I put in bold the negative plays where we shot ourselves in the foot.

Most Important Plays​

As determined by absolute WPA.

Time	Offense	Play Description	EPA	WP%	WPA
Q4 8:25	GT	(4th & 11 at GT 24) (08:29) #47 M.Nichols punt 42 yards to the NCSU34 #9 T.Anderson return 0 yards to the NCSU34 (#27 C.Alexander; #39 W.Kiker) PENALTY NCSU Holding (#36 K.McBride) 10 yards from NCSU34 to NCSU24 - GT 30, NCSU 41	3.39	6.1%	85.2%
Q3 10:21	GT	(1st & Goal at NCSU 2) (10:26) No Huddle-Shotgun #1 J.Haynes rush middle for 0 yards to the NCSU02 (#52 C.Wallace) - GT 17, NCSU 24	-7.51	55.4%	-20.0%
Q2 2:50	GT	(1st & 10 at GT 25) (02:58) Shotgun #10 H.King rush middle for 10 yards gain to the GT35 (#1 C.Fordham), 1ST DOWN - GT 17, NCSU 21	0.40	73.2%	-19.3%
Q3 2:49	NCST	(3rd & 6 at NCSU 45) Teddy Hoffmann 55 Yd pass from CJ Bailey (Kanoah Vinesett Kick) - GT 23, NCSU 38	5.63	73.4%	19.0%
Q2 4:26	NCST	(3rd & 20 at NCSU 33) (04:38) Shotgun #11 C.Bailey pass complete deep right to #9 T.Anderson caught at GT25, for 51 yards to the GT16 (#1 C.Spaulding), 1ST DOWN - GT 17, NCSU 14	5.10	24.6%	18.8%
Q2 7:37	GT	(1st & Goal at NCSU 2) (07:42) Shotgun #10 H.King rush middle for 0 yards to the NCSU02 (#44 B.Cleveland; #1 C.Fordham) - GT 10, NCSU 14	-6.69	68.0%	-16.9%
Q1 7:54	GT	(2nd & 12 at GT 23) (08:09) Shotgun #10 H.King pass complete short middle to #85 J.Allen caught at GT40, for 50 yards to the NCSU27 (#33 K.Soares, Jr.), out of bounds, 1ST DOWN - GT 0, NCSU 7	4.81	44.3%	12.2%
Q3 0:08	GT	(2nd & Goal at NCSU 3) Haynes King 3 Yd Run (Aidan Birr Kick) - GT 30, NCSU 38	1.37	13.7%	10.7%
Q2 13:49	GT	(4th & 10 at NCSU 26) A. Birr 43 yd FG GOOD - GT 10, NCSU 14	1.90	48.1%	10.2%
Q2 1:08	GT	(2nd & 6 at NCSU 36) (01:14) No Huddle-Shotgun #10 H.King sacked for loss of 9 yards to the NCSU45 (#1 C.Fordham, #92 C.Bond) - GT 17, NCSU 21	-1.77	58.9%	-10.2%

 

[4shotB]

“Mind the gap” is not just advice for the London Underground.

I hate to pile on players but our linebackers can’t seem to keep up with fast teams either.

For years it seemed we had guys at this position that were difference makers at this position. I'm talking about guys who influenced the outcomes of games and the offensive playcalling of the opposing teams. Going all the way back to guys like Lucious and Al Richardson back when I was in school. Wheeler, Fox, Roof, Smith, Brooking, etc. Seems like that has not been the case much over the last decade or so since the departure of Tenuta although guys like Charlie Thomas or PJ Davis showed some flash at times. I don't see any disruptive players at this position (like all ACC level or higher) and haven't in a long time. Am I wrong in my recollection of things?

 

[yeti92]

For years it seemed we had guys at this position that were difference makers at this position. I'm talking about guys who influenced the outcomes of games and the offensive playcalling of the opposing teams. Going all the way back to guys like Lucious and Al Richardson back when I was in school. Wheeler, Fox, Roof, Smith, Brooking, etc. Seems like that has not been the case much over the last decade or so since the departure of Tenuta although guys like Charlie Thomas or PJ Davis showed some flash at times. I don't see any disruptive players at this position (like all ACC level or higher) and haven't in a long time. Am I wrong in my recollection of things?

2022 we had Ace Eley, Charlie Thomas, and Demetrius Knight on the roster. Eley and Thomas played well enough to earn 2nd and 3rd team All ACC, but of course Knight was wasted and eventually transferred.

Our LBs since have been meh at best. Efford was also on that 2022 team and showed some flashes as I recall, but it doesn't seem like he has really improved much since then, maybe even taken a step back this year. Constantly changing schemes probably doesnt help with that.

 

[TampaBuzz]

We never had a realistic shot to win this game in the 2nd half.
After NC ST scored a TD with 7 min left in the 3rd quarter GT never had the ball with a chance to tie or lead the rest of the game.
From that point on it was basically a matter of how bad of loss was it going to be.

I actually thought the turning point was the false start on 4th and 1 foot in the 2nd quarter with a chance to tie. Big Red stands up and hits the OT on the head...I'm sure he had some choice words right there.

 

[BainbridgeJacket]

2022 we had Ace Eley, Charlie Thomas, and Demetrius Knight on the roster. Eley and Thomas played well enough to earn 2nd and 3rd team All ACC, but of course Knight was wasted and eventually transferred.

Our LBs since have been meh at best. Efford was also on that 2022 team and showed some flashes as I recall, but it doesn't seem like he has really improved much since then, maybe even taken a step back this year. Constantly changing schemes probably doesnt help with that.

Efford was 3rd team all ACC last year. He's consistently been a good LB for us when he's been allowed to come downhill and stop the run until this year when he's been asked to sit in zone coverage which is not his strong suit.

 

[GTrob21]

We lost a game; the season is over. There is nothing left to do but Cry, Wail, and throw sand in the air...

 

[stinger78]

Sure. I'm just saying the answer is not "Run man because it's better against the run".

Man coverage is just a coverage scheme. For an empty backfield, 5-receiver set against a nickel D (4-2-5) it can give you all 6 DT/LB that can play "in the box.," depending on how you employ it. That means you have an extra player that can, if designed and executed right, bring pressure to the QB.

If you're playing nickel D in cover 2 deep against a 5-receiver set, depending on how you employ it, it can require the CB play well off the lines and the LB/DE to have cover responsibility for the flat and OTM on their side. In that approach it's 7 with some coverage responsibility which leaves only 4, maybe 5, players "in the box." Unless you can disguise it well, you will struggle to get pressure.

Our zone seems designed to play deep to keep plays in front of them. Safeties are 15-17 yards off the LOS and corners are 10-12 off the LOS - and are often moving *back* at the snap. That leaves a big area - 10 yards deep, sideline to sideline between corners and LOS for short routes. This often puts our LB in difficult situations to make plays at the LOS. This is my observation.

 

[Northeast Stinger]

Man coverage is just a coverage scheme. For an empty backfield, 5-receiver set against a nickel D (4-2-5) it can give you all 6 DT/LB that can play "in the box.," depending on how you employ it. That means you have an extra player that can, if designed and executed right, bring pressure to the QB.

If you're playing nickel D in cover 2 deep against a 5-receiver set, depending on how you employ it, it can require the CB play well off the lines and the LB/DE to have cover responsibility for the flat and OTM on their side. In that approach it's 7 with some coverage responsibility which leaves only 4, maybe 5, players "in the box." Unless you can disguise it well, you will struggle to get pressure.

Our zone seems designed to play deep to keep plays in front of them. Safeties are 15-17 yards off the LOS and corners are 10-12 off the LOS - and are often moving *back* at the snap. That leaves a big area - 10 yards deep, sideline to sideline between corners and LOS for short routes. This often puts our LB in difficult situations to make plays at the LOS. This is my observation.

Adding my observation, when playing zone our linebackers seem slow to break toward passing lanes. It’s as if they have a run first responsibility.

Honestly, Saturday night it seemed like our defense kept “guessing” wrong, or else NC State had really studied our defense well and knew the cues. But our linebackers were either late closing down on the runners or late breaking to the passing lanes, kind of stuck in limbo.

But I’m just complaining. In my more optimistic outlook I think we are still getting every team’s best shot and it’s difficult week to week to keep up with how many different wrinkles teams are showing us. It’s as if we have to be a completely new team each week.

 

[SOWEGA Jacket]

We all know our defense scares us and our LB’s are tough dudes but speed isn’t their best feature. Which means the path to winning is simple - outscore the other side. Against Pitt it’s going to be a mid 90’s type game we’ve seen many times before where you gotta go in planning to score 50. No field goals, limited punts. It’s Dwyer vs. Warrick part 2. We’ve seen many shootouts as Tech fans because our defense has ALWAYS been suspect except for a very few seasons over the past 30 years. Remember the UGA game of 45-42 and others.

The Pitt game is gonna be just like this one. But we should now be expecting it so the offensive players better buckle up because they are gonna see monster stats. If I’m Hosley, Haynes, Allen, Cannion, Harpring, I can’t wait for that game because it’s gonna be an offensive show. The other night we played like it was an ordinary game and by the time we adjusted to a shootout we were down 11 and it was over. I can’t wait for that game.

 

[JoJaTeck]

We all know our defense scares us and our LB’s are tough dudes but speed isn’t their best feature. Which means the path to winning is simple - outscore the other side. Against Pitt it’s going to be a mid 90’s type game we’ve seen many times before where you gotta go in planning to score 50. No field goals, limited punts. It’s Dwyer vs. Warrick part 2. We’ve seen many shootouts as Tech fans because our defense has ALWAYS been suspect except for a very few seasons over the past 30 years. Remember the UGA game of 45-42 and others.

The Pitt game is gonna be just like this one. But we should now be expecting it so the offensive players better buckle up because they are gonna see monster stats. If I’m Hosley, Haynes, Allen, Cannion, Harpring, I can’t wait for that game because it’s gonna be an offensive show. The other night we played like it was an ordinary game and by the time we adjusted to a shootout we were down 11 and it was over. I can’t wait for that game.

Or we just death march them all game and limit the amount of snaps their offense gets ala CPJ..