DaltonJacket
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SI article about triple option football
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It is a fascinating read. It talks about is the option, and in particular the old school option fading out.
It does suggest there will always be some variations of it but it talks a fair bit about some of the modifications to it to make it more modern.
There are a couple of items that stand out in it.
"The zone-read, a kind of double option, has swallowed high school and college football for nearly two decades, but its bigger brother the triple has maintained a persistent presence at both levels of the sport, even as the number of teams that exclusively operate out of it dwindles. Navy, Army and Georgia Tech run the option in its purest form, using their offenses as battering rams operated from under center. At Air Force, Calhoun has tweaked the formula slightly, mixing the spread option with the under-center triple that the program has run for years. Most other schools that employ some classic features of the option have modernized and cloaked them within spread concepts, as Fritz has at Tulane, Bob Davie has at New Mexico and Scott Frost has begun to at Nebraska. These new strains of option football surpass their ancestors in charm and glamour."
"Some believe the original under-center versions of the scheme are on the verge of complete extinction. Even a few inside the small fraternity of coaches who run the system agree that the triple option as they know it is an offense in twilight, soon to be replaced completely by those refurbished spread option systems, many of which are derived from the offense Fritz and his offensive coordinator Bob DeBesse created six years ago at Sam Houston State."
“It’s not going extinct,” says Lou Cella, a sports psychologist and former high school coach who now consults high school teams wanting to implement Johnson’s triple option. “I get calls every day—people want to do it.”
"However, the path forward for traditional option offenses is surrounded on all sides by threats, including in the NCAA rulebook. A new rule this year has put the system's foundational blocking method on a path toward complete elimination."
"Cut blocks (blocks below the waist from the defender's front side) are no longer allowed outside of five yards from the line of scrimmage, a change that was made this spring in the interest of player safety, "
"Johnson is not afraid to acknowledge his brand of option won't last forever. “I know I’m at the back end,” he says, “but I’m glad [others] don’t do it. It makes us unique and different.”
"Niumatalolo and his Navy staff have visited New Mexico and folded in elements of the Lobos’ shotgun-based triple option, which DeBesse implemented over five years under Davie after leaving Sam Houston State. New Mexico peaked in 2015 and ’16 with the first back-to-back bowl trips at the school in a decade."
It does suggest there will always be some variations of it but it talks a fair bit about some of the modifications to it to make it more modern.
There are a couple of items that stand out in it.
"The zone-read, a kind of double option, has swallowed high school and college football for nearly two decades, but its bigger brother the triple has maintained a persistent presence at both levels of the sport, even as the number of teams that exclusively operate out of it dwindles. Navy, Army and Georgia Tech run the option in its purest form, using their offenses as battering rams operated from under center. At Air Force, Calhoun has tweaked the formula slightly, mixing the spread option with the under-center triple that the program has run for years. Most other schools that employ some classic features of the option have modernized and cloaked them within spread concepts, as Fritz has at Tulane, Bob Davie has at New Mexico and Scott Frost has begun to at Nebraska. These new strains of option football surpass their ancestors in charm and glamour."
"Some believe the original under-center versions of the scheme are on the verge of complete extinction. Even a few inside the small fraternity of coaches who run the system agree that the triple option as they know it is an offense in twilight, soon to be replaced completely by those refurbished spread option systems, many of which are derived from the offense Fritz and his offensive coordinator Bob DeBesse created six years ago at Sam Houston State."
“It’s not going extinct,” says Lou Cella, a sports psychologist and former high school coach who now consults high school teams wanting to implement Johnson’s triple option. “I get calls every day—people want to do it.”
"However, the path forward for traditional option offenses is surrounded on all sides by threats, including in the NCAA rulebook. A new rule this year has put the system's foundational blocking method on a path toward complete elimination."
"Cut blocks (blocks below the waist from the defender's front side) are no longer allowed outside of five yards from the line of scrimmage, a change that was made this spring in the interest of player safety, "
"Johnson is not afraid to acknowledge his brand of option won't last forever. “I know I’m at the back end,” he says, “but I’m glad [others] don’t do it. It makes us unique and different.”
"Niumatalolo and his Navy staff have visited New Mexico and folded in elements of the Lobos’ shotgun-based triple option, which DeBesse implemented over five years under Davie after leaving Sam Houston State. New Mexico peaked in 2015 and ’16 with the first back-to-back bowl trips at the school in a decade."
takethepoints
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The "old school" for TO offenses includes both the spread option and the veer. Both are TO offenses and use an under-center approach. With that definition the number of schools using the TO goes up a bit.
These things run in cycles. Right now, the shotgun double option Os are prominent. But I doubt that will continue. If you want a template for how things will develop going forward, I'd look to New Mexico. Bob Davie's offense out there is very hard to stop. At any rate, I wouldn't sell the TO short.
One other thing: a lot of people think that if the NCAA gets rid of cut blocks - I doubt they will, btw - that Tech's style of O is out. Nope. What that would do is something a lot of people here have called for over the years: bigger ABs. The 2014 team's ABs could have done without cut blocking altogether and done just fine. That might, btw, explain why our AB recruiting has included more players with room to grow recently.
These things run in cycles. Right now, the shotgun double option Os are prominent. But I doubt that will continue. If you want a template for how things will develop going forward, I'd look to New Mexico. Bob Davie's offense out there is very hard to stop. At any rate, I wouldn't sell the TO short.
One other thing: a lot of people think that if the NCAA gets rid of cut blocks - I doubt they will, btw - that Tech's style of O is out. Nope. What that would do is something a lot of people here have called for over the years: bigger ABs. The 2014 team's ABs could have done without cut blocking altogether and done just fine. That might, btw, explain why our AB recruiting has included more players with room to grow recently.
jgtengineer
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You know if johnson probably didn't see himself retiring in 4 years or so ( and he should see that no one wants to work until they die paterno style) He'd probably hire an OC and start offloading. If i were modernizing the offense all i would do is add an rpo series out of splitback gun and the jet sweep outside veer triple from the fritzkrieg.
Pistol Flex formations woudl work to AS long as you used them correctly and had a true option threat. but never forget the under center play package. I really wish we had had a better QB than vad in 2013 we'd still be running that option attack.
Pistol Flex formations woudl work to AS long as you used them correctly and had a true option threat. but never forget the under center play package. I really wish we had had a better QB than vad in 2013 we'd still be running that option attack.
Techster
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Man...I was gonna start a thread that touches on some of the themes in this article. F'in SI stealing my thunder! 
Pretty interesting quotes in that article...by CPJ himself. There's one quote in there that makes me think, "Hmm...I just hope the sun isn't setting for GT as you approach that back end..."
I think the article sums up my belief in the 3O: The offense isn't the problem, but the offense is a problem.
The higher the level of football being played, the more of an issue the offense becomes in terms of off the field considerations. The Urban Meyer episode pretty much summarizes this offense at this level: It's an offense that in terms of effectiveness probably has very few peers, but connotations that come along with running 3O limits its ceiling such that it gets undeserved labeling. That baggage includes recruits that don't want to play in it, coaches that know they can win using it but are scared to outright use it as it puts a ceiling on them, schools that don't want their coaches using it because it hurts them off the field.
Pretty interesting situation GT finds ourselves in.
Pretty interesting quotes in that article...by CPJ himself. There's one quote in there that makes me think, "Hmm...I just hope the sun isn't setting for GT as you approach that back end..."
I think the article sums up my belief in the 3O: The offense isn't the problem, but the offense is a problem.
The higher the level of football being played, the more of an issue the offense becomes in terms of off the field considerations. The Urban Meyer episode pretty much summarizes this offense at this level: It's an offense that in terms of effectiveness probably has very few peers, but connotations that come along with running 3O limits its ceiling such that it gets undeserved labeling. That baggage includes recruits that don't want to play in it, coaches that know they can win using it but are scared to outright use it as it puts a ceiling on them, schools that don't want their coaches using it because it hurts them off the field.
Pretty interesting situation GT finds ourselves in.
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I stopped reading early after "The Veer is the opposite of fancy. It is football’s version of a ham sandwich: enduring and reliable, but tedious and tiresome. "
I'm sure there is a lot of interesting information in that article, so I'll read it later. But a few thoughts in no particular order. I can't speak for other teams, but a minority of our plays are triple option. Its also not simple and tedious and tiresome - you can run the same exact play 5 different ways just from blocking alone. It also has any number of different passing plays. What it does give you is a tremendous amount of flexibility to suit the particular quarterback or personnel you might have. Matthew Jordan could run the QB follow until the cows came home. Justin Thomas didn't. Justin Thomas threw for 1700 yards and 18 passing TDs in 2014. In 2016 he only threw 2 interceptions all year off 150 attempts and 1600 yards passing...and both of those interceptions were end of half/game hail mary's. TaQuon Marshall will barely throw half that much. But its the same exact playbook. You just run it differently to play to your particular personnel's strengths. I find it neither tedious, nor boring, nor simple. Hell, how much do people complain about missed assignments - its exactly because of the complexity of it that you can get that. (Don't get me wrong, I'm not permamently attached to it either.)
I'm sure there is a lot of interesting information in that article, so I'll read it later. But a few thoughts in no particular order. I can't speak for other teams, but a minority of our plays are triple option. Its also not simple and tedious and tiresome - you can run the same exact play 5 different ways just from blocking alone. It also has any number of different passing plays. What it does give you is a tremendous amount of flexibility to suit the particular quarterback or personnel you might have. Matthew Jordan could run the QB follow until the cows came home. Justin Thomas didn't. Justin Thomas threw for 1700 yards and 18 passing TDs in 2014. In 2016 he only threw 2 interceptions all year off 150 attempts and 1600 yards passing...and both of those interceptions were end of half/game hail mary's. TaQuon Marshall will barely throw half that much. But its the same exact playbook. You just run it differently to play to your particular personnel's strengths. I find it neither tedious, nor boring, nor simple. Hell, how much do people complain about missed assignments - its exactly because of the complexity of it that you can get that. (Don't get me wrong, I'm not permamently attached to it either.)
Techster
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One of the things I've always wanted CPJ to do was start with the RnS, and work our way back to the 3O. Basically, get a true dual threat QB, and RnS personnel, and use RnS as our base offense, but complement it with our base option plays. Obviously, RnS and Flex 3O are each practice intensive schemes due to variation of each play. If we go primarily RnS and complement it with option, our run game wouldn't be as extensive as it is. However, I think if we're able to pass it as well as Hawaii does their RnS and work to perfection a core group of option schemes, the offense could be DEVASTATING...and the narrative would be different.
Hawaii is actually incorporating zone read with the RnS staples. It's pretty fun to watch:
https://www.sbnation.com/college-fo...ball-offense-nick-rolovich-cole-mcdonald-2018
Just imagine running our core 3O off that type of passing. Implement a little more every week as each play is perfected. My eyes glaze over as I think of the possibilities...
jgtengineer
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I agree with you on this. I also think that Ratliffe was going to be the second shot at trying to evolve the offense and we might see it with Graham, but graham is probably not physiclaly ready yet. Johnson is the only other QB we have that could do this.
Milwaukee
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The triple works, we just don't run it anymore. How many times per game do we run true triple? PJ is in the middle of an identity crisis and he's overanalyzing imo. I'd pay money to watch one full game without a counter option and I'd bet that same amount of money that the results would be better for him.
The "keys" he is seeing are smoke and mirrors on purpose. The DC's are "showing" different looks because they know he's looking for those to take advantage of.
The "keys" he is seeing are smoke and mirrors on purpose. The DC's are "showing" different looks because they know he's looking for those to take advantage of.
alagold
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I couldn't help but notice several things.
-they never said ANYTHING about Colorado TYING for Nat Chp with us although Col claim was mentioned 3 times.
- PJ being quoted--"it allows 4 recs (WR and Abacks ) to get out quickly for passes.WOW--I agree but how many times do you see us try that? Having small quick Abacks means the only real advantage on 230 lb LBs is that.
Instead we have a lot of 185 lb Abacks trying to block these 235 lb (or 260 lb DEs) a lot esp on passes.
-Noticed also no mention about PJ's recent record.
-they never said ANYTHING about Colorado TYING for Nat Chp with us although Col claim was mentioned 3 times.
- PJ being quoted--"it allows 4 recs (WR and Abacks ) to get out quickly for passes.WOW--I agree but how many times do you see us try that? Having small quick Abacks means the only real advantage on 230 lb LBs is that.
Instead we have a lot of 185 lb Abacks trying to block these 235 lb (or 260 lb DEs) a lot esp on passes.
-Noticed also no mention about PJ's recent record.
Milwaukee
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He's right if he'd run quick slants and quick flats with the abacks and wrs, then he'd have something tough to defend in the passing game. But our scheme depends on a DC making a mistake and blitzing too many and leaving someone completely uncovered, because after all, we're running 4 verts 97% of passing plays where we send all 4 out. The problem is DC's don't make that mistake enough to justify it, not even close.
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Here was the biggest take away i had.
some other TO schools are updating what they do - Navy is mentioned as adding packages. When was the last time we tried to add anything. it feels like CPJ has gotten more stubborn and doesn't want to change anything now. He even sort of hints at that at being proud that no one else is running the true TO but him - that we are unique. But on the other side he hints that he is a dying breed. Well it sort of sucks if you end up being the last.
some other TO schools are updating what they do - Navy is mentioned as adding packages. When was the last time we tried to add anything. it feels like CPJ has gotten more stubborn and doesn't want to change anything now. He even sort of hints at that at being proud that no one else is running the true TO but him - that we are unique. But on the other side he hints that he is a dying breed. Well it sort of sucks if you end up being the last.
RamblinWreck92
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conspicuously, we aren't mentioned in that paragraph.
Coloradojacket
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And the issue right now is he doesn't have he quarterback he want. TM just cant throw the ball
swampsting
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a couple of technical things about the article, which otherwise was well done.
One, it was a poor job of editing. How many times did principals get used instead of principles?
Two, Ga Southern went away from the option for more than the three years of the Hatch Attack. GSU also went away from the option in 1996 (the year that does not exist in Eagles' fans memories), and many fans would insist they didn't run the option during the woe begotten Tyson Summers era.
Three, they didn't ask Larry Lacewell, later a defensive coach with the Dallas Cowboys, how hit Arkansas State Indians fared in the 1986 I-AA national championship game. The opposing quarterback ran for 180 yards and threw for 306. His name was Tracy Ham. His offensive coordinator?
Paul Johnson.
One, it was a poor job of editing. How many times did principals get used instead of principles?
Two, Ga Southern went away from the option for more than the three years of the Hatch Attack. GSU also went away from the option in 1996 (the year that does not exist in Eagles' fans memories), and many fans would insist they didn't run the option during the woe begotten Tyson Summers era.
Three, they didn't ask Larry Lacewell, later a defensive coach with the Dallas Cowboys, how hit Arkansas State Indians fared in the 1986 I-AA national championship game. The opposing quarterback ran for 180 yards and threw for 306. His name was Tracy Ham. His offensive coordinator?
Paul Johnson.
jgtengineer
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Summers didn't really ever have an offensive identity at all to his teams. They had some options but he didn't really let cook implement the scheme he is known for ( skigun).
GT Tennessee
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If Johnson were to leave I want Fritz, Ken, or Brian. Keeping the same concepts of this offense with tweaks will help us to continue to push forward. If we completely switch identities, look for one of the worst season we’ve had in a while