What if Tevin had another year?

dressedcheeseside

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Do you think we'd have won some of those losses if we had Tevin under center this year? Certainly we would have won all the games we won.

I think both qb's bring different things to the table and Vad has a higher upside, I think. However, we haven't been able to take advantage of Vad's strengths too often this year while we sure have been hurt by his weaknesses.

Does Tevin's superior game management and ball security trump Vad's superior athleticism as it applies to our current record this year? I think it does. Not only do we win at least one of the games we lost, I think we beat both Uva and Pitt much more comfortably.

I thought Vad would be much further along with the offense by now and that we'd see way more explosion plays from him, especially with his feet. Tevin had better rushing and passing numbers on average in '12 than Vad does now with less turnovers. Hmmm.....

Our OL play has something to do with it but it's the same guys minus a gimpy Uzzi. Yes we've been hit by injuries but they were banged up at times last year, too, with various guys missing chunks or whole games at a time.
 

IronJacket7

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You make some great points cheese but bottom line is that in the "Big" games Tevin was a bed wetter.

Vad is a RSoph. Tevin was a RSenior. Big difference. If you remember Tevin was not so great of a game manager his Soph. year.

For our offense I think Justin Thomas maybe be the best suited if we are going to do the norm and run it 40 times a game.

Vad brings the element of a better passer imo. If we ran a different offense where we were passing more and had an offensive line that could PP for longer than 3 seconds then I would say Vad would be the better option.
 

dressedcheeseside

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You make some great points cheese but bottom line is that in the "Big" games Tevin was a bed wetter.

Vad is a RSoph. Tevin was a RSenior. Big difference. If you remember Tevin was not so great of a game manager his Soph. year.

For our offense I think Justin Thomas maybe be the best suited if we are going to do the norm and run it 40 times a game.

Vad brings the element of a better passer imo. If we ran a different offense where we were passing more and had an offensive line that could PP for longer than 3 seconds then I would say Vad would be the better option.
I can't argue with any of your points, but they are not really to the point I made.

What I'm asking is a 5th year Tevin better than a 3rd year Vad? That is all. Imagine inserting Tevin into our offfense today as it exists. Factor in all the injuries on the OL but don't forget to add Smelter. Now add in our much improved defense to the mix. Would we be better off recordwise, in what we've already played and what we still have left? Would we have beaten any of the teams we lost to so far. Think about the affect of a single turnover, now multiply that 3 fold. Think about how devestating our offense is when the correct read is made, the pitch is executed perfectly. One big play can decide a game, especially close games.

Tevin wet the bed with big games on the line, no doubt, but would those same games have been on the line had we had today's defense? Tevin played well, at times, in those very same games. Do we even go to overtime against VT and Miami last year with this year's D. I think not. The same idea can be used putting Tevin on this year's team. Just having longer drives alone gives us a huge advantage with our better D. Misreads and tentative decision making kills plays and that, in turn, kills drives. Turnovers are the worst part of the equation.
 

CuseJacket

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I don't think the results this year would be different because I don't think Vad deserves all the credit or blame.

The only games that could have produced different results are the UNC, VT, and Miami games. I'm not sure either QB could replay the UNC game and guarantee a win, especially in those conditions. Vad had one big turnover in both the VT and Miami games, but I don't think you can extrapolate those mistakes to confidently state Tevin would have reversed the eventual outcome.

Vad has done several things better than Tevin already:
1) He's made more difficult passes look easy (anyone think Tevin would have hit Smelter in stride when he dropped the pass against Pitt?)
2) He's turns ordinary 2-3 yard gains into 5-6 yard gains
3) He's eluded defenders when the pocket collapses in times when I felt like it would have been a sack last year

Vad needs to be a better game manager and learn the bread and butter; that's the where I see Tevin still ahead of him. Both have had their share of bonehead turnovers in inopportune times, so it'd be silly to make any assumptions on who would have executed each individual play better.
 

dressedcheeseside

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I don't think the results this year would be different because I don't think Vad deserves all the credit or blame.

The only games that could have produced different results are the UNC, VT, and Miami games. I'm not sure either QB could replay the UNC game and guarantee a win, especially in those conditions. Vad had one big turnover in both the VT and Miami games, but I don't think you can extrapolate those mistakes to confidently state Tevin would have reversed the eventual outcome.

Vad has done several things better than Tevin already:
1) He's made more difficult passes look easy (anyone think Tevin would have hit Smelter in stride when he dropped the pass against Pitt?)
2) He's turns ordinary 2-3 yard gains into 5-6 yard gains
3) He's eluded defenders when the pocket collapses in times when I felt like it would have been a sack last year

Vad needs to be a better game manager and learn the bread and butter; that's the where I see Tevin still ahead of him. Both have had their share of bonehead turnovers in inopportune times, so it'd be silly to make any assumptions on who would have executed each individual play better.
I agree, it's impossible to know for sure. However, the very nature of our offense puts a premium on perfect qb execution, especially when it comes to reads and decision making. Put the turnovers aside for now, just look at all the big plays left on the field due to a missed read or wrong decision. Pitches to the Abacks are our explosion plays. We're seeing far fewer of these this year. I also think Tevin, though slower, had more big runs. When you run the offense quickly, decisively and correctly, there's just more big play potential than if you don't.

As far as passing goes, Tevin had a better completion percentage and qb rating than Vad today.
 

AE 87

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imo, (1) yes, TW at QB would've won all the games we won and would've been more competitive in the games we lost, probably winning at least two of them and (2) Vad's only a RS sophomore who will get better.

I could be way off, but I think Vad's biggest problem has been his athleticism and past success. I get the feeling that he trusts his own ability more than the system, or, in other words, that he hasn't fully bought into the system. He trusts his own ability to make plays at times more than the reads, the blockers, etc as the play is designed to develop.
 

cyptomcat

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I think Tevin might have lost one or more of Duke, Pitt, UNC or Virginia. Vad made quite a few plays in those games, that I haven't seen much from Tevin. Especially the drives to seal the deal against Pitt, UVA and UNC.
 

dressedcheeseside

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I think Tevin might have lost one or more of Duke, Pitt, UNC or Virginia. Vad made quite a few plays in those games, that I haven't seen much from Tevin. Especially the drives to seal the deal against Pitt, UVA and UNC.
A handful of plays doesn't make up for 3 handfuls of mistakes.
 
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