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The Biggest Political Scandal In The Last Several Decades

Discussion in 'The Swarm Lounge' started by bwelbo, Oct 25, 2017.

  1. armeck

    armeck Ramblin' Wreck

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    Ok, I feel like we are getting sideways on the issue that I was originally addressing: There has been zero Ukrainian input on this - the servers were never shipped to the Ukraine, the company is not Ukrainian, neither of the owners are Ukrainian.

    Trump was the one really pushing the Ukraine angle, leading many to think he had reason to deflect from Russia to somewhere else:
    That one statement is almost 100% false.

    Here is what is true about the FBI and CrowdStrike's forensic activities:
    Crowdstrike is an American company, details from their own website open for anyone to prove otherwise:
     
  2. GT_EE78

    GT_EE78 Helluva Engineer

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    I've always suspected that whatever the DNC was hiding was financial and could have been completely unrelated to the leaked emails.
    such as campaign contributions instead or payment for the Steele dossier.maybe just more incriminating emails....
    .I don't think we'll ever know
    upload_2020-2-21_12-56-25.png
     
  3. bwelbo

    bwelbo Helluva Engineer

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    Yea I wasn't discussing Ukraine at all - Trump is an idiot. Ukraine meddled in our election in 2016, but not in the way Trump usually vomits about. Multiple people were arrested, prosecuted, and convicted for it. I was pointing out the absurdity that in one of the more consequential hacks of our lifetime, our federal government accepted and used third hand information for their analysis.
     
  4. armeck

    armeck Ramblin' Wreck

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    Wait, what Ukrainian meddling exactly? Who was arrested, prosecuted, and convicted? Honestly asking...

    https://www.csmonitor.com/USA/Polit...nterfere-in-the-2016-election-Three-questions
     
  5. bwelbo

    bwelbo Helluva Engineer

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    From the link you posted: "Independent experts say that is unequivocally a conspiracy theory." (that Ukraine meddled in our election). That assertion is demonstrably false. Sometimes people who say that are erroneously conflating 2 separate issues - it was Russia, it wasn't Ukraine. The facts show Ukraine and Russia BOTH did, independent of each other.

    From the Politico:
    https://www.politico.com/story/2017/01/ukraine-sabotage-trump-backfire-233446
    "Kiev officials are scrambling to make amends with the president-elect after quietly working to boost Clinton."

    "Donald Trump wasn’t the only presidential candidate whose campaign was boosted by officials of a former Soviet bloc country. Ukrainian government officials tried to help Hillary Clinton and undermine Trump by publicly questioning his fitness for office. They also disseminated documents implicating a top Trump aide in corruption and suggested they were investigating the matter, only to back away after the election. And they helped Clinton’s allies research damaging information on Trump and his advisers, a Politico investigation found."

    If you read through that, you'll see how Democrat operatives like Chalupa coordinated opposition research with the Ukranian Embassy.

    In December 2018, a Ukranian court ruled that Sergii Leshchenko and Artem Sytnyk (2 of the leaders of this opposition work), unlawfully interfered in the 2016 U.S. presidential election. The court also ruled that these actions had caused interference in American electoral processes and harmed the Ukrainian state’s interests.

    Again, to be clear, this is separate of what Russia did. This is not to say what Russia did doesn't matter or didn't happen (pardon the double negatives).
     
  6. MWBATL

    MWBATL Helluva Engineer

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    We agree completely!
     
  7. armeck

    armeck Ramblin' Wreck

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    I suppose that many nations every year are interfering to varying degrees. What I was most curious about was this question: "Who was arrested, prosecuted, and convicted?"
     
  8. MWBATL

    MWBATL Helluva Engineer

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    Agreed.

    what I am more interested is whether there is any proof that said interference had ANY impact on the outcome. Russia’s “interference” was minuscule compared to the spending by the Clinton campaign and arguably had far less impact than the biased media coverage by US outlets.
     
  9. bwelbo

    bwelbo Helluva Engineer

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    Of course the ironic part is that we know of at least 2 coordinated campaigns with Clinton and foreign countries (Ukraine, Russia), yet Trump gets blamed for it when he was the target. Go figure.
     
  10. bwelbo

    bwelbo Helluva Engineer

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  11. Technut1990

    Technut1990 Helluva Engineer

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    To my knowledge the FBI never tried to recover any actual servers nor did they do any forensics on any computer which was actually used by the DNC.

    This is a complete deviation from ANY normal hacking or fraud investigation and anyone in law enforcement would tell you that.

    Furthermore in a national security matter The FBI did not need The DNCs permission to take servers and when/ if the request for access was refused the proper response would have been to access them via search warrant.

    The FBI didn’t even try.

    If your computer was hacked the first thing the police would do, if you reported it, would be to take it. In Georgia it would be submitted to the GBI for proper forensics.

    The FBI failed hugely in their responsibility to properly investigate and that’s the bottom line.
     
  12. armeck

    armeck Ramblin' Wreck

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    I disagree. A forensic image is preferable due to possibility of hardware failures. Every time you power down a machine there is a possibility that it will never power up again. Taking a forensic image is standard operating procedure for these cases. I don't know why CrowdStrike was the one who created the image and not the FBI, but the act of analyzing the image and not the physical server is a complete non-issue.
     
  13. bwelbo

    bwelbo Helluva Engineer

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    Assuming the image taken and all the tools and capabilities use are the exact same that our intelligence people and FBI have and that nothing was done to the server prior to any of those tasks being done, then correct. But given what this was, the fact our federal government was using third hand information is just sad. When you also consider the DNC wouldn't let our own federal government be involved, that should raise red flags too.
     
  14. bwelbo

    bwelbo Helluva Engineer

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    Roger Stone’s Judge rules she’s not biased and not stepping down.
    https://www.yahoo.com/news/judge-won-t-bow-roger-003829349.html

    Instead of making some emotional quick strike decision, she should have taken a few moments to think more deeply about the actual substance of the filing.

    The judge accused Roger Stone of covering up for the President. Remember, he had no contact with Russians or WikiLeaks. He lied to Congress and investigators that he had told Credo that he had been speaking with WikiLeaks. He didn’t actually do anything to cover up for Trump. There was nothing he did with Trump that he was covering up. Her comment is nonsensical and shows she IS biased. Roger Stone shouldn’t have lied about lying and shouldn’t have encouraged his friend to do the same. And that’s all she needed to say. Making political commentary when none was justified means she doesn’t actually have a clear understanding and management of the case.
     
  15. mts315

    mts315 Helluva Engineer

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    After the Hillary Server/Email debacle the fact that the FBI had zero first hand contact with the server is ridiculous. It would be fine if the FBI had imaged it and analyzed that, but to just take a third-party's word on it is not something that should happen.
     
  16. forensicbuzz

    forensicbuzz Helluva Engineer

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    I'm going to go out on a limb here...I feel pretty comfortable that the judge actually hearing the testimony has a better understanding of the case than a person researching articles and whatever other information is available to the public. Sorry, I just don't think you know more than her about this. I'm not saying she's not prejudiced in this matter, just saying I think you're overreaching when you say she doesn't have a clear understanding of the case. I posit she has a clearer understanding of the law too.
     
    armeck likes this.
  17. bwelbo

    bwelbo Helluva Engineer

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    I am open to that suggestion. So maybe you can help me - what was Roger Stone covering up for Trump?
     
  18. armeck

    armeck Ramblin' Wreck

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    It is certainly possibly that he thought he needed to cover for Trump on his own. That wouldn't make his crimes any less severe.
     
  19. bwelbo

    bwelbo Helluva Engineer

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    No, sorry - I meant cover WHAT. Mueller investigated him - he had no contacts with Russia, WikiLeaks...nothing. He had nothing and did nothing to cover up that I've ever heard.

    That's my beef with the Judge - instead of saying she's staying in charge and he deserves his sentence because he lied to Congress, told someone else to lie, and harassed her, she specifically said what he did was so egregious because he was covering up for Trump. So that's my question - covering WHAT? I may have missed it, but I've never seen, nor heard, nor read anything along those lines.
     
  20. bwelbo

    bwelbo Helluva Engineer

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    A few days ago, Flynn's attorneys again filed to have the case dismissed.

    The interviewers of Flynn reported that they didn't think he had lied to them. But the FBI pushed the case forward anyway, so they could squeeze Flynn for information. Of note, as of today, those 302 (interview forms) have still never been provided to the defense team in unredacted form. You can see the redacted forms here:
    https://www.businessinsider.com/michael-flynn-fbi-interview-notes-sentencing-2018-12

    As you can see, Strzok was involved with these interviews and some of his texts with Page at this same time discussed using some of the news of the dossier as a pretext to go interview people. The dossier that they knew was false at this point. This is one of the many several dozen egregious behaviors and errors documented by the IG Horowitz in his report. These are also the interviews that Comey laughed about with how clever he was setting up Flynn.

    A summary of just some of the BS:
    https://thehill.com/opinion/white-house/422801-three-oddities-in-fbi-handling-of-flynn-interview

    Trump's got a lot of pardoning to do in the future.
     

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