Notre Dame academic problems

GTFowler

Georgia Tech Fan
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95
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Barrow County
Not the same thing... One is just not cutting it at a school academically and the other involves trying to cover it up and hope to not get caught. I'll never respect a program that puts the football team over the university
 

dressedcheeseside

Helluva Engineer
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13,630
This situation just underscores the hardships "academic" schools face. (I can't believe that I just said academic schools) Factories don't typically have these issues because their tests are "How do you spell cat." It really helps shine a light on how hard it must be to find the needles in the haystack that can both contribute greatly on the field while cutting it in the classroom.

My guess is Kelly is not as hyper vigilent as CPJ. The fine line between reward for athletic performance vs risk for academic misfortune got blurred and crossed. He knows he has humanity majors to stash players but that doesn't mean guys w/o the work ethic can coast through like at a factory.

Problem is, if a kid doesn't have an academic work ethic in hs they're not gonna suddenly develop one in college. Schools like them and us need kids who are not only students, but good students already. Factories don't even need students.
 

TheSilasSonRising

Helluva Engineer
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3,729
Not the same thing... One is just not cutting it at a school academically and the other involves trying to cover it up and hope to not get caught. I'll never respect a program that puts the football team over the university[/
Trying to give 85 young men a chance is not putting a football team over a university of 15,000 to
50,000 others.

Sometimes when you give someone a chance - they surprise you. Audie Murphy comes to mind off top of my head.
 

dressedcheeseside

Helluva Engineer
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13,630
Trying to give 85 young men a chance is not putting a football team over a university of 15,000 to
50,000 others.

Sometimes when you give someone a chance - they surprise you. Audie Murphy comes to mind off top of my head.
Giving someone a chance who actually wants an education is one thing and I bet nobody here has a problem with that. What I have a problem with is forcing a kid through a university who

a) has no desire whatsoever to be in school,
b) has not the slightest foundation for college level academics and
c) for the sole purpose of making the football team better.

That was not the purpose of intercollegiate athletics from the beginning. The whole paradigm as it exists today is screwed up big time.
 

Northeast Stinger

Helluva Engineer
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4,242
Giving someone a chance who actually wants an education is one thing and I bet nobody here has a problem with that. What I have a problem with is forcing a kid through a university who

a) has no desire whatsoever to be in school,
b) has not the slightest foundation for college level academics and
c) for the sole purpose of making the football team better.

That was not the purpose of intercollegiate athletics from the beginning. The whole paradigm as it exists today is screwed up big time.
I could not agree more. Well said.
 

flounder

Jolly Good Fellow
Messages
306
Location
Lynchburg, VA
“We may not make a university student out of him, but if we can teach him to read and write, maybe he can work at the post office rather than as a garbageman when he gets through with his athletic career.”
 

Northeast Stinger

Helluva Engineer
Messages
4,242
“We may not make a university student out of him, but if we can teach him to read and write, maybe he can work at the post office rather than as a garbageman when he gets through with his athletic career.”
Poignant and damning quote that will forever epitomize the gulf between higher education and pretend higher education.
 

flounder

Jolly Good Fellow
Messages
306
Location
Lynchburg, VA
Jan Kemp Dies at 59; Exposed Fraud in Grades of Players

Jan Kemp, a former English instructor whose lawsuit against the University of Georgia in the 1980s drew national attention to preferential treatment of college athletes unable to meet academic standards, died on Dec. 4 in Athens, Ga. She was 59.

The cause was complications of Alzheimer’s disease, her son, Will, told The Associated Press.

While coordinator of Georgia’s remedial English program, Dr. Kemp was among several faculty members who had complained that officials at Georgia intervened in the fall of 1981 to enable nine football players to pass a remedial English course in which they had received failing grades. The athletes remained eligible to play for Georgia against Pittsburgh in the Sugar Bowl on New Year’s Day 1982.

Dr. Kemp was demoted in 1982 and dismissed the next year. She filed suit, maintaining that she had been ousted because of her complaints, a violation of her constitutional right to free speech.

In Atlanta Federal Court in January 1986, university officials defended their actions concerning the football players, saying the athletes had been admitted to the regular curriculum because they were making progress in their studies. Dr. Kemp, they said, was dismissed for disruptive conduct and for failure to conduct adequate scholarly research.

O. Hale Almand Jr., a lawyer for the defense, offered a justification for the favorable treatment accorded the athletes, citing a hypothetical player. “We may not make a university student out of him,” he told the jury, “but if we can teach him to read and write, maybe he can work at the post office rather than as a garbageman when he gets through with his athletic career.”

The jury found that Dr. Kemp had been dismissed illegally and awarded her more than $2.5 million (later reduced to $1.08 million) for lost wages, mental anguish and punitive damages. She was later reinstated.
 
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